Generator Start Module for SW Plus 4024

trumpets3utrumpets3u Solar Expert Posts: 35 ✭✭✭
I'm looking for a easy way to start a generator off the inverter, it would be a 2 wire to the gen.
Thanks Brian

Comments

  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 29,511 admin
    Re: Generator Start Module for SW Plus 4024

    An accurate method would be to use a Xantrex or Victron battery monitor with a configurable alarm contact. Set to turn on at 50% state of charge and of at 80 to 90% state of charge (depending on your needs and if you have solar or other charging source).

    Not cheap.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • RCinFLARCinFLA Solar Expert Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭
    Re: Generator Start Module for SW Plus 4024

    The SWplus removed the three small relays that where included in the original SW series inverters. It was done to remove cost from SWplus unit. Xantrex sold an external box called Generator Start Module.

    Attached is picture of outside of box and internal PCB. There is not much to it. There is an RJ11 jack that connect to SWplus jack. Basically +12vdc to run the relays and three relay control lines. One switch on side of unit disable gen start relay, other switch generates a relay alarm test in SWplus.

    You can read the original SW op manual to understand the three relay operations. Then make an RJ cord with open wires at end to check with DVM for +12vdc connection, and three relay control functions. The relay control functions are just pull down logic to activate relay 12 vdc coil so you need a pull up resistor to test for them with DVM.
  • ChrisOlsonChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    Re: Generator Start Module for SW Plus 4024

    I know this is an old thread but I don't know if you ever solved your problem. You don't actually need a Xantrex GSM - you can build your own with a couple ice cube relays. The pinout on the inverter jack for the GSM is:

    Pin 1 and pin 2 are 12V Power supply to the GSM
    Pin 3: RY7 signal
    Pin 4: RY8 signal
    Pin 5: RY11 signal
    Pin 6: not used

    RY7 is used for ignition enable/disable, or glow/stop with a diesel. This is set in Menu Heading 25 under 25A, depending on whether you select the GS, RN1 or RN2. GS (Glow/Stop) provides a momentary glow plug and stop signal to RY7, RN1 provides a continuous RY7 signal for engines that require ignition "on".

    Cranking is provided by RY8.

    RY11 is an alarm relay.

    All three relays in the GSM have a common, NO and NC terminal.
    --
    Chris
  • looneymlooneym Registered Users Posts: 3
    Hello Chris I am trying without success to get this to work with an ice cube relay. I am thinking the pinout on the RJ11 is reversed or something when I use a DVM and toggle through the functions on the inverter. I would love to just have the GSM board and cabling but I have been searching for months to no avail. Any help would be appreciatted

    Thanks
    Greg
  • Dave AngeliniDave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 4,665 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Greg,  Chris was banned from the forum. Unfortunately he will not respond. Since the SW + has been obsolete for 12 years + you will have to do what was suggested in post 2 or 3. The used gear on E-bay is often just a waste of time if you can find it.

    The replacement for your inverter is the CSW and here is a link to the north american version..
    https://solar.schneider-electric.com/product/conext-sw-na/

    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Mountains near Mariposa/Yosemite CA
     http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
    E-mail [email protected]

  • looneymlooneym Registered Users Posts: 3
    Thanks for the reply and the link Dave. I do not want to replace the inverters. They are great units and have been operating flawlessly. I purchased a 6kw Generac EcoGen a couple years back and have just been turning it on manually to charge the batteries on cloudy days. I recently purchased a new conext box that monitors the batteries and tied in a Xanbus GSM to auto start the generator. Unfortunately the conext only can monitor battery level and charge state so it cannot make good decisions on exactly when the generator needs to run based on A/C load and battery level combined. I can make circuit boards very easy so this is not a complex task to reproduce one I would like to get my hands on the cable and the Trace GSM so I can duplicate it. I would be happy to offer anyone who has one some of my duplicated spares if they could lend me one to design against. 
  • mcgivormcgivor Solar Expert Posts: 3,074 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 2018 #8
    Could you not use a current transformer/switch  with a dry contact,  placed on the inverter output which will only enable generator start based on loads greater than X amps, but overridden by low battery voltage, just an idea to ponder.
    1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider MPPT 60 150 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery bank 
    Second system 1890W  3 × 300W No name brand poly, 3×330 Sunsolar Poly panels, Morningstar TS 60 PWM controller, no name 2000W inverter 400Ah FLA 24V nominal used for water pumping and day time air conditioning.  
    5Kw Yanmar clone single cylinder air cooled diesel generator for rare emergency charging and welding.
  • Dave AngeliniDave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 4,665 ✭✭✭✭✭
    So you have the conext battery monitor? If so can't you buy the Conext gen start module and start based on Soc? At least this way you are moving toward devices that will be supported for a very long time into the future.
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Mountains near Mariposa/Yosemite CA
     http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
    E-mail [email protected]

  • mcgivormcgivor Solar Expert Posts: 3,074 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Actually I appreciate @iooneym 's thoughts, say for example you had an air conditioning unit which comes on, why wait for the battery to be depleted before the generator picks up the load, using a current transformer/switch would sence the demand before the battery monitoring could respond, this could naturally be incorporated with the AGS, just a method of of quick response, sorry automaton and controls is in my blood, did it for 35+years.
    1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider MPPT 60 150 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery bank 
    Second system 1890W  3 × 300W No name brand poly, 3×330 Sunsolar Poly panels, Morningstar TS 60 PWM controller, no name 2000W inverter 400Ah FLA 24V nominal used for water pumping and day time air conditioning.  
    5Kw Yanmar clone single cylinder air cooled diesel generator for rare emergency charging and welding.
  • Dave AngeliniDave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 4,665 ✭✭✭✭✭
    If you look at what the conext genstart module can do some time you might appreciate how easy it is to do just about anything.

    It is automation on steroids! It can sense any medium/large loads and be set also for any state of charge. Lots more that I can't remember...

     The op may not be able to use all of its function because he does not have the inverter/charger data from xanbus. With an SCP, and battery monitor he can set it to trigger on any Soc.

    I am glad that I do not need a generator though ;)
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Mountains near Mariposa/Yosemite CA
     http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
    E-mail [email protected]

  • looneymlooneym Registered Users Posts: 3
    Thanks for everyone's input and replies greatly appreciated. I found a guy in Spain who had three brand new ones for sale on eBay. I purchased one and had it shipped to a freight forwarder in London as the seller refused sales to the US. Got the module and plugged it in and I am now good to go. FYI The RJ11 cable was reversed (like a telephone cable) so the pin orientation had to be reversed from ChrisOlson's post. If anyone else needs one and there is none to be had any longer I can now duplicate off the one I purchased. 
  • TwanD78TwanD78 Registered Users Posts: 1
    Hello Looneym, 

    I am hoping to duplicate the GSM function also since I can’t seem to find anything to purchase so far. Have SW plus and Kohler 8.5RES needing auto startup. I don’t mind building a relay board for it if that’s my best option. So far the wiring diagrams I found aren’t quite clear enough to me. Could you provide a ladder diagram or something to help us get to an auto start/stop setup? This system is off grid, no utility power with the SW plus 2524. 24VDC batteries. The Kohler 8.5 has an ADC-RES controller. So far we charge the batteries by going outside to manually start the generator. 

    Any help is SO MUCH APPRECIATED! 

    Twan
  • VicVic Solar Expert Posts: 2,970 ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 2018 #14

    Hi Twan..,

    We do have an SW+ GSM,   but little time to delve into it.

    Will try to check it out.

    It is very basic.   Just relays,   and PC board traces.   All of the smarts are in the Firmware in the SW+ inverters.

    It would seem that these would show up on e-bay,   at least on occasion.

    More later (perhaps).   Vic

    Off Grid - Two systems -- 4 SW+ 5548 Inverters, Surrette 4KS25 1280 AH [email protected], 11.1 KW STC PV, 4X MidNite Classic 150 w/ WBjrs, Beta KID on S-530s, MX-60s, MN Bkrs/Boxes.  25 KVA Polyphase Kubota diesel,  Honda Eu6500isa,  Eu3000is-es, Eu2000,  Eu1000 gensets.  Thanks Wind-Sun for this great Forum.
  • gwerschlergwerschler Registered Users Posts: 1

    I have a brand new Xantrex GSM - Generator Start Module for SW Plus for sale I never used it with my SW 4024 inverter now have a Magnum inverter first $100 can have it.

    thanks Gary

  • imsaguy86imsaguy86 Registered Users Posts: 1
    Gary, I will take your GSM!!!!!
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 29,511 admin
    You might try sending Gary a private message:

    https://forum.solar-electric.com/messages/add/gwerschler

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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