Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

Th = Tc*COP / (COP-1)

Th = temp. hot side in Kelvin (273 + temp. in C)
Tc = temp. cold side in Kelvin (273 + temp. in C)
COP = Coefficient Of Performance

GP

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

Maybe a better way to compare is the EER (BTUs/Watt, should have been BTUs/WattHr to be technically correct).
From this you can compare the cost of 100,000 BTU (1-therm) between conventional heating and heatpump.

Unfortunately both COP and EER change with temp. So as Lucman said, they standardize to some "common" temp.
GP

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

So without going into too much analysis it sounds like in a very moderate climate they might make a good replacement for small electric or gas or oiled fired space heater, but as ambient gets colder any advantage (on the heat side) is diminished. If one doesn't have a reason to need A/C then one would be better off using a high ef gas space heater such as a Rinnai.

Tony

PS Thanks for the input guys!

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

For the 18K-BTU Sanyo split heat pump, the SEER is 20 (from their web site)
Under "standard conditions", this translates to:
* Assuming 10c/KWhr cost, 55c per 100,000 BTUs
* For reference, at NG cost of 85c / CCF, a 80% efficiency gas furnace would cost $1.04 per 100,000 BTUs

Scale these figures to your actual situation to estimate your costs.

GP

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

An update:

I put another 1KW bank of panels up last summer, w/ FM60 controlling. (total 3KW) With the Sanyo on the appliance circuit, when we started the dryer, its glow bar would cause the Sanyo to shut down from low power if the washer was on too. That circuit runs from a Magnum MS2812.

I installed a Xantrex ProWatt 2.0 for our "lights and entertainment" circuit (replaced a ProSine 1.0), moved the Sanyo to that circuit, and it functioned fine all summer. The max draw from the Sanyo was 1600W (I bought a KillAWatt). Only IF the Sanyo was running full on, IF we turned on another load, like the computer (in addition to the Sanyo, TV, satellite, a few lights) it'd "brownout" that circuit enough that the TV and sat and Sanyo would restart. We lived with it and adapted our energy usage.

The ProWatt had only an 1800W continuous rating and we would, when the Sanyo was full on, be running 1850 with the other normal loads. No problem unless we added the computer or my bathroom lights (7 lighted beer signs). And only then because I'd forget, switch on the bathroom and reset the TV, sat, and Sanyo. "DANG it, I forgot again".

I attempted to "cheap out", tho it rarely works. The ProWatt was only $350. It's not like I didn't know better. $1500 less than another MS2812.

We have been using the Sanyo for heat lately, waiting for the woodstove to catch up. Same scenario... turn on the bathroom lights, everything wigs out. Worse than summer because within 15 minutes the Sanyo is running full on at 1600W trying to heat the house.

This week I installed a second MS2812 on the "lights, entertainment, Sanyo" circuit. We can now run all loads with no problem. Washer, dryer, TV, sat, Sanyo, computer, bathroom beer lights, fridge, microwave, everything all at the same time.

Very NICE! And what I should've done last summer.

Between the electric refrigerator and this Sanyo, it's like we've re-entered the twentieth century (never mind the rest of the country is in the 21st).

So for the umpteenth time.... thank you DAVE SPARKS for starting this thread!

Phil

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

@LucMan - the calculator seems to be an excellent tool! Thanks

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

From how deep do you think you'd have to pump the cold water Tony? Have you ever monitored the water temp to any specific depth? A/c at a remote place like yours...of course, last August was a scorcher for a few weeks, lie there and sweat while you try to get to sleep.

Enjoy the cold while we can. It's so Canadian to complain about the cold and heat of our temperate climate.

Ralph

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

Viessman manufacturers ground source heat pumps but without a cooling side so they emphasize what they call 'natural cooling' - utilizing underground lower temperature to cool water to recirculate through fan coils. They have decent information on their web site to see what they propose.

Works OK where the ground temp is low enough - here İ have 16 deg C (61F) well water so would not have worked. You probably need about 10 deg C temperature water to the fan coil to get the delta T to make them work in a satisfactory manner.

***********
The newest style of heat pumps use CO2 as a refrigerant - works to a much lower temperature than the traditional heat pump. These have been popular in Japan for years but are only now being made available around the world. One name is Daikin ecocute.

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

homerramirez wrote: »

Hi guys.

not being negative, last month we had in Van Alstyne Tx. temperature down to 10 F ( wind chill of 5 F )and my 21,000 btu had hard time keeping up heating our 1350 sq. ft. home, we closed all bedrooms and bathroom doors, the mini split kept cycling ON and OFF every 15 min. (it could be because it was defrosting itself), once the outside temp around 30 F it performed as expected.

the summer monts it reduced about half of my cooling cost and this winter bacause the low? temps about 30% of my heating bill. still Im happy with it.

DANG Homer!! Ten freakin' degrees in Texas!?!? I've always heard that heat pumps are very inefficient in extreme cold, and that certainly is what you are living in. You might as well be in New Hampshire!

I won't whine about our current 43 degrees w/ rain. The Sanyo is keeping the house warm because our firewood pile hasn't been replenished because of the rain we have been getting in No Cal.... I'm not complaining 'cause we need the water badly. I'm hoping there'll be a break, otherwise I'll be out with tractor and chainsaw in the rain later today. Luckily (?) I can cut manzanita today and be burning it tonight ... it doesn't HAVE to be seasoned.

Using the Sanyo to HEAT the house was never my intention, but it's sure nice to have the option. When we were using it to cool 1) as Dave recommended, we'd set the timer to KEEP the house cool, rather than trying to cool down a hot house and 2) that smaller inverter worked fine for that, as the Sanyo rarely was running full power, usually just 3 or 400W, and with longer days there wasn't as much of a load on it for lighting. It's only when we started using it for heat that the smaller inverter was a problem.

But, all things considered, things are pretty good now.

Phil

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

homerramirez wrote: »

Hi guys.

not being negative, last month we had in Van Alstyne Tx. temperature down to 10 F ( wind chill of 5 F )and my 21,000 btu had hard time keeping up heating our 1350 sq. ft. home, we closed all bedrooms and bathroom doors, the mini split kept cycling ON and OFF every 15 min. (it could be because it was defrosting itself), once the outside temp around 30 F it performed as expected.

the summer monts it reduced about half of my cooling cost and this winter bacause the low? temps about 30% of my heating bill. still Im happy with it.

10 degrees,, why that is sunbathing weather!

On the other hand it is right around freezing tonight with freezing rain! YUK! Supposed to to back to near normal later in the week, -17c for a high, -24 for a low. (~0/-12f)


Bright sunshine though,

T

Re: Sanyo mini split AC (inverter/variable speed)

Dave, I can,t tell you about how low a power setting the harborpoint will run at. It has a sleep mode that is suposed to run slower and quieter. I paid 1199.00 for an 18,000 btu with a 20 seer rating with the lines and wireing included. It qualifys for the 30% tax break so My thinking it has to be preety eficient or it wouldn,t qualify. I looked for some sanyo,s but got tired of looking. They seemed to not advertise the seer rating and everytime I clicked on one the seer rateing was too low for me. I am wondering if the Fujitso is related to the Mitsubishi. I was reading a description and toward the end it mentioned mitsubushi. Wonder if the seller messed up or they are related. Looks like mitsubushi and Fujitsu have the highest seer rating. I saw up to 26 seer for them. Solarvic