S550 new and not lasting

fog said:

So I’ve been running generator for 4 hours now and it’s still MPPT bulking. Outback says 59.0 volts. Do I just keep going until it starts to absorb?

How much current is being sent to the battery bank? Has it started to be reduced? I guess you might have lost a cell, that would keep voltages a bit low. Might go ahead and take SG readings. See what is happening... (I did not think your night time voltage change was enough to indicate a dead cell, but perhaps...)

Hi fog,

Thanks for the SGs and the screen shot of the OB CC,   but that is a screen that just shows the settings,  not the present status of Solar charging.

It would be nice if you knew the current that is going into the battery.   Perhaps the Inverter has such a reading.

Do you have a ComBox,  or similar doodad from Schneider that has such detail.   Assume that you do not have the OB FNDC + Mate gizmos that would show the battery current ...

Does your generator show the amount of power that it is delivering?

Do you have an AC,  or DC clamp-on Ammeter,   that could read currents?
Are your AC (inverter) .loads minimal,   or,   what do you think that those loads might be?

Your batteries appear to really need as complete a charge that you can give them,   and then,   trying to EQ them.

Batteries that are essentially dead,   need tons of accumulated charge current to get them charged (as much as that is possible),   before the EQ.

It appears that there has been a real charging problem.  You might measure the voltage on the TERMINALS of each battery,   and then,  look for the voltage drop between each battery's terminal,  and the lug that attaches to that terminal (measuring this lut-to-terminal voltage should require switching to a lower voltage range,  like 2V,  vs 20 V,  for example).  This is looking for poor connections.

The OB FM-60 (assumed model number) has a main status screen that shows how much current is going to the battery buss from the PVs,  but not the total Net battery current,  without those two OB  accessories,  noted above.

More later.   Thanks for the info. Good Luck,  Vic

fog said:

Could my outback controller be failing somehow?

It's possible, of course we haven't heard about your systems output of array or actual loads. That is frustrating...

So you have looked at your logs, what type of daily output from the charge controller are you getting? Look back to a sunny day and see what you are getting out of your system...

I don't know Conext system, but I trust Dave, if you don't have one of the devices to read the output to your system a DC clamp meter would be very nice to get some idea of what is happening.

I suspect something is wrong, and likely unknown. The reason I suggested checking the array output, and the daily use. If you find you've been producing 15-20 kWhs and regularly gets 2-3 kWhs on the ugly days, then I'd look to what loads are active on your system. If you are Not alone, you should ask the others in your household. Maybe some snuck in a desktop or window air conditioner while you weren't looking. Runs a potpourri in a mini crock pot 24/7. It could be that your fridge is or freezer is near dead. Do you turn off your computer over night? Used a laptop?

Over time loads grow, be sure to run down any loads running.

Setting the charge controller at a slightly higher voltage value, say around 0.2V, than the inverter charger will allow the solar to contribute to the charging during the day should it be available, no point in wasting free energy. Looking at the graphic it would appear you have a way to go and no don't EQ before absorption is completed, or at very least until the current drops to near 2% of the battery Ah capacity  Having overnight loads will only prolong the process, two steps forward one back so to speak.

What capacity generator is being used and are you using 240V or 120V to charge, 1.1 kW seems on the low side, 30 A  would speed things up significantly.

fog said:

For some reason my inverter keeps kicking off the generator. Not sure if I need it at this point. However it’s not sunny out and the outback controller just went into snooze mode. What’s happening.? 

It's likely sensing higher system voltage than it's settings and shutdown. When you went to equalizing, did the voltage and amps jump up? If the voltage hasn't reached absorb, the charge controller, in theory, isn't limiting the voltage, so I would assume you saw little change. The fact that the current(amps) has reduced without reaching the set absorb voltage is not a good sign.

If the voltage (and current) did increase then Perhaps the changes you made didn't make it into memory,

You will want,  and need the Battery Temp Sensor for the FM-60.   You can manually compensate the charge voltage,   for dool/cold batts,  by increasing  Absorb,  Float and EQ voltages,  by 0.12 Volts per degree C that the guessed battery temp is below 25 degrees C.

Not having the BTS,  can easily cause incomplete charging,   every day,   unless you actively manage the temp compensation (as shown in the Surrette Battery Manual.

Good Luck,   Vic

Yeah, you haven't reached absorb yet, the battery isn't full so the voltage isn't 'running away'. Setting to Equalize isn't helping really, because the battery is limiting the voltage. Taking 2% is pretty ugly, it might be time to get Rolls involved ask them what they would suggest. I understand high voltage pulsed current is sometimes used to recover. I suspect, your battery is heavily sulfated, so the sulfates are covering the plates not allowing the passing of current. Equalizing helps in 2 ways, 1 is to return sulfates into solution, and the other is to simply aggressively get them to fall off (I've even heard of people bumping and banging their batteries!) Once they fall off they expose more area of the plate...

Equalizing, it's self, generally is done on a fully charged battery, hence no real reason, in a properly designed system, to remove loads.
By raising the voltage you are 'tipping the scale' allowing/forcing the battery to take more current. It's a controlled over charging of the battery bank.

If you are having a sunny day, you might compare the flow of amps to the battery bank from the array and from the generator. It could save you a lot of gas and food.

Photowhit said:

Yeah, you haven't reached absorb yet, the battery isn't full so the voltage isn't 'running away'. Setting to Equalize isn't helping really, because the battery is limiting the voltage. Taking 2% is pretty ugly, it might be time to get Rolls involved ask them what they would suggest. I understand high voltage pulsed current is sometimes used to recover. I suspect, your battery is heavily sulfated, so the sulfates are covering the plates not allowing the passing of current. Equalizing helps in 2 ways, 1 is to return sulfates into solution, and the other is to simply aggressively get them to fall off (I've even heard of people bumping and banging their batteries!) Once they fall off they expose more area of the plate...

Equalizing, it's self, generally is done on a fully charged battery, hence no real reason, in a properly designed system, to remove loads.
By raising the voltage you are 'tipping the scale' allowing/forcing the battery to take more current. It's a controlled over charging of the battery bank.

If you are having a sunny day, you might compare the flow of amps to the battery bank from the array and from the generator. It could save you a lot of gas and food.

OK,  ...  whit,   but,  just trying to play a bit of a devilish advocate:

If one had a FLA bank that really needs a good Absorb,   and EQ (sulfated plates),  the battery would Accept a lot of current.   Have probably not dealt with too many battery banks that had Hard Sulfates,   but  just my experience is if the charge source can deliver a lot of  current,   and is able to reach the necessary voltage setpoint,   as the charging process progresses,   the battery will Accept a lot of current. This bank is either not Accepting,   or the charger is limiting the current.

I do not know the workings of the CSW's charger.   Perhaps it is still trying to Absorb.   Dave did mention,  that with Schneider inverters,   when the EQ is initiated,   that a new,   full Absorb needs to be done,   even if one had just been completed.  (this makes little sense to me for off-grid systems,  to me   ...  Schneider!).

The OB CC thinks that IT is in EQ,   but,   the CSW may not be.   Could not find the CSW charge state on the Combox image.

It would seem  that fog should review  the CSW Charger AC in/AC output settings,   and confirm that the CSW is in EQ,  not absorb.

And so on,  FWIW,  Vic

The combox screen in post #50 is exactly what you would see if the genset is not qualified or off/disconnected. The phantom 439 watts is from the solar. Even though it is not networked to a schneider mppt, there is a Hall sensor that shows 439 watts. It is coming in from somewhere, like the FM 60. Genset is where Schneider shows unknown power to not confuse people if there were a Schneider mppt and its Hall sensors in the network.

If the OP had a fully networked system he could see the screens below. One shows a good day and a 3 hour absorb and a 1 hour EQ were done form solar.  The second is a day with clouds and charge really never was complete.

 For many here this is overkill as they know this stuff. For a new person it can really help with the concepts to see the picture of what you are doing.

It is called Battery summary screen on your combox Fog. Keep going with what you are doing and get us some SG readings after you charge tomorrow.

The generator on indication on system performance display being off may not be a true indication, if memory serves me correctly it displays off on mine when I'm absolutely sure it is running and charging. The status may be controlled by the AGS so if not installed in the system it will display off at all times.

Disclaimer I'm not 100%sure this is the case but will fire up the generator today and confirm, we have had 5 days of overcast which is rare here........Edit....OK just fired up the generator it's charging see display, generator off. The temperature 32°C is not the battery temperature but rather the CC  heatsink used to control an auxillary cooling fan as temperature compensation is not required with Lifepo4. 
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