SW4048, 115 volts on AC 1 and 2

mickeyk
mickeyk Registered Users, Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 2 ✭
in Off Grid Solar & Battery Systems #1
Vintage 2001 Trace SW4048 is reading 115 volts at AC 2 with nothing attached to it. AC 1 will read about 114.5 vac. This while AC out is 120 vac. I am off grid, so nothing is currently hooked to either AC 1 or 2. I discovered this while trying to get my inverter to accept my generator. It could have been this way for some time as there was never a reason to check it. My understanding is there should only be a search voltage of around 13.8 vac. Any ideas? Finding full voltage there freaked me out! My thinking is there is an internal relay stuck. but does'nt seem likely it would affect both AC1 in and AC 2 in . What do you people out there think? This things been 24/7 for bout 19 years! Prob time for new but it won't be Snhieder as they don't respond to Tech help.
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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,894 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2020 #2
    Welded relays ! 

     Schneider responds to installers and dealers first ! They are busy this time of year. They next response is to residential owners (you). The last thing they respond to, is equipment that they did not build (you). Good Luck!

    https://solar.schneider-electric.com/netsuite/
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #3
    There has been a low but constant level of AC transfer relays with welded contacts. There should even be an error code for stuck relay (as I recall--No expert here).

    You can always wire up a 120 VAC filament bulbs of 4-40 Watts to the AC input connection and see if there is any "current" behind the voltage (bulb will safely load the AC connection and let you measure the "real" voltage).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • mickeyk
    mickeyk Registered Users, Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 2 ✭
    #4
    Thanks Dave and BB. Kind of what I expected. Is it worth killing all the power and taking a look inside? Apparently I've gotten good life expectancy from it fat 19 years. BUT, what to replace it with? I've been looking at Magnum, Outback (who I haven't seen a good matching model and of course Schneider. I am DIY so want Some back up support. Probably selling Schneider short due to 7 days waiting for e-mail response. My supplier would generally help with simple stuff. Right now everyone is hard to get a hold of due to "that covid thing." Inverter does still invert fine, just can't accept gen power.
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #5
    Yes... Sounds like a good life.

    If you want to look at repairs/support for older inverters, I have a post where folks have listed aftermarket inverter repair facilities:

    https://forum.solar-electric.com/discussion/comment/241766#Comment_241766

    Of course, COVID-19 (and age) may have trimmed this list.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,894 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #6
    No codes on those BTW. Pre-networked (before XW) trace and xantrex indicate welded relays by not working or getting bad measurements. The failure here is just age related, probably. Most of the welded relay failures are caused by improper set-up/config. 
    XW and Outback radian log the relay attempts and can void warranty.

    Why would Schneider even respond to a Trace failure??? They are in business to make money.

    If you are DIY then swap the AC1 and AC2 relays!
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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  • RCinFLA
    RCinFLA Solar Expert Posts: 1,485 ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2020 #7
    If you are handy with soldering iron. Relays are on the AC power connect board.  Fairly easy to remove PCB to replace relays.
    read this thread:
    https://forum.solar-electric.com/discussion/355261/need-help-with-a-xantrex-sw4048#latest

    There are new relays available on eBay.

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  • Photowhit
    Photowhit Solar Expert Posts: 6,006 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #8
    Dave Angelini said:
    Why would Schneider even respond to a Trace failure??? They are in business to make money.
    Because they own the company now and failure to at least minimally support past products would encourage people to go somewhere else? Even a reply stating they no longer support it, would be something.
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,894 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2020 #9
    Well maybe they will respond. I wouldn't unless I had nothing else to do, like being here, listening to the fire scanner and helping a friend...

    They have plenty to do BTW. New 100 amp mppt, 3 phase support on XW pro, old support on combox up to insight2, getting the digital and analog I/O working on Gateway and a bunch of stuff they can't share.

    People love to say bad things about great companies. Look at Apple, a 2 trillion dollar company and they won't fix my apple 1.
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #10
    Dave Angelini said:
    ............
    People love to say bad things about great companies. Look at Apple, a 2 trillion dollar company and they won't fix my apple 1.
    Exactly, when someone buys a company, they are not buying just the profits, but the history and headaches.   No reason to toss a inverter when a $20 replacement relay puts it back into working order.   I see the point about buying a newer gadget to replace an older one, but my wife never bought into that idea.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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