temp for windy nation lifetime

DJuan222
DJuan222 Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭✭
in Solar Beginners Corner #1
I was looking at windy nations own info on how to get the most years out of their batteries and they say about 50F

to get 9-12 years...I had to LOL for real, not even in my house is cool enough.  I guess I need to get a small freezer and

let it be a battery box  powered by the batteries everyday just to protect the investment in batteries.

At current temp they say about 3 years...thats not ok !!

JC
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  • Solray
    Solray Registered Users Posts: 246 ✭✭✭
    #2
    All batteries are hurt by heat, although some more than others. Any battery will las a lot longer at 50°, not just those made by one company.
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  • Marc Kurth
    Marc Kurth Solar Expert Posts: 1,147 ✭✭✭✭
    #3
    The batteries that I deal with will see a 50% decrease in service life with a 10 deg C, above 25 deg. C.  Remember that this is average temperature for 8760 hours per year. In practice, we see a 6-8 year lifespan in hot climates and 10-11 years in cold climate areas.
    As a reference point, 12v 1,000 ah battery banks buses running the Southwest Desert highways often see 140F or higher, and they tend to make it 5 years.

    My off grid customers in extreme high temperature areas will often dig a recessed area in the ground for their battery room. Some have used water cooling and/or AGM batteries brought indoors and held to around 85F on the really hot days.

    Worst case I have ever seen are DHS remote surveillance packages deployed near our southern border.  Metal boxes with small vents but no power exhaust, sitting in the sun. Only a 3 to 4 year life with shallow cycling. Same equipment package parked at a higher elevation provides 5-6 years.
    I always have more questions than answers. That's the nature of life.
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  • littleharbor2
    littleharbor2 Solar Expert Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #4
    Marc, I have a question.  Is there an appreciable difference in life time when the batteries are in a hot environment and not cycled, as opposed to being regularly cycled?  My system in Baja gets shut down for 3 months in the summer with only a small trickle charge to maintain it.

    2.1 Kw Suntech 175 mono, Classic 200, Trace SW 4024 ( 15 years old  but brand new out of sealed factory box Jan. 2015), Bogart Tri-metric,  460 Ah. 24 volt LiFePo4 battery bank. Plenty of Baja Sea of Cortez sunshine.

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  • mmaritz
    mmaritz Registered Users Posts: 15 ✭✭
    #5
    Marc Kurth said:
    My off grid customers in extreme high temperature areas will often dig a recessed area in the ground for their battery room. 

    Hi Marc

    Can you post a few pictures of recessed and water cooled batteries.  If you have them it would be appreciated.
    Regards
    Mark
    • Main: Infinisolar 3+ (3kv) 48V Grid-Tied PV=3410w NE facing (8x 330W JASolar, 3x 310W Yingli), + Victron MPPT 150/60 @1240w SW facing (2x 310W Renesola, 2x 330W JASolar), Pylontech US3000, Victron BMV 700, 6 string combiner box with PV isolator switch, subDB for inverter supplied power.
    • Draadkar: Axpert 800w, 24V, 8x 12V - 105ah Leisure Batteries 400ah, PV=480 (2x 240W ElChepo), Victron BMV 702 for laptop, relays backup.
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  • Estragon
    Estragon Registered Users Posts: 4,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #6
    > @littleharbor2 said:
    > Marc, I have a question.  Is there an appreciable difference in life time when the batteries are in a hot environment and not cycled, as opposed to being regularly cycled?  My system in Baja gets shut down for 3 months in the summer with only a small trickle charge to maintain it.

    My understanding is temp is a factor even when stored. The higher temp speeds the chemical reaction, so self-disharge happens faster. In hot conditions, normal float voltage may be high if uncompensated.
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
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  • DJuan222
    DJuan222 Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭✭
    edited July 2017 #7
    Im going to measure a magic chef mini fridge in 4.4 cu and see if the 3 batteries will lay on their side, I think height is no problem, I think depth is to shallow but will see...might be a neat project thats not to $$$
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  • Solray
    Solray Registered Users Posts: 246 ✭✭✭
    edited July 2017 #8
    littleharbor2 said:
    Marc, I have a question.  Is there an appreciable difference in life time when the batteries are in a hot environment and not cycled, as opposed to being regularly cycled?  My system in Baja gets shut down for 3 months in the summer with only a small trickle charge to maintain it.
    Yes. Heat will cause damage over time and shorten the life of batteries whether stored and disconnected, trickle charged or cycled.
    Heat is a killer of all batteries. This is the case with a battery inside a laptop, a starter battery under the hood of a car and stationary batteries in a tin shelter under the hot sun. As a guideline, each 8°C (15°F) rise in temperature cuts the life of a sealed lead acid battery in half. This means that a VRLA battery for stationary applications specified to last for 10 years at 25°C (77°F) would only live 5 years if continuously exposed to 33°C (92°F) and 30 months if kept at a constant desert temperature of 41°C (106°F). Once the battery is damaged by heat, the capacity cannot be restored.
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  • DJuan222
    DJuan222 Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭✭
    #9
    mini fridge project step 1 complete now for wires, holes drilled in top
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #10
    Wow, I'm surprised the plastic bottom, even with a plywood spreader, is holding up.   Or that the bottom battery is not going to get damaged by the weight above it.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
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  • Solray
    Solray Registered Users Posts: 246 ✭✭✭
    #11
    The batteries appear to   be mis-matched. The terminals are different on them.
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  • jonr
    jonr Solar Expert Posts: 1,386 ✭✭✭✭
    #12
    Someone here disassembled a water cooler to create a chilled water bath.   With his hot climate, it made sense to me.  Water is a good way to store cooling - so you can run it while the sun shines and then coast through the night.


    I am available for custom hardware/firmware development

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  • DJuan222
    DJuan222 Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭✭
    #13
    Solray said:
    The batteries appear to   be mis-matched. The terminals are different on them.


    same windy nation batteries but yes the terminals got changed, to many people broke off the style on the top 2 it seemed
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  • DJuan222
    DJuan222 Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭✭
    #14
    mike95490 said:
    Wow, I'm surprised the plastic bottom, even with a plywood spreader, is holding up.   Or that the bottom battery is not going to get damaged by the weight above it.
    seems to be solid, i was worried about the weight but it seems fine so far, not even flexed much
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  • Solray
    Solray Registered Users Posts: 246 ✭✭✭
    #15
    When I buy batteries to use in an array, I always get consecutive serial numbered batteries for the best compatibility. Not everyone does this and it could be overkill, but with the cost of batteries, why not? Better safe than sorry.

    Anyways, good luck with this project, it is interesting at least.
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  • DJuan222
    DJuan222 Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭✭
    edited July 2017 #16
    well heres the finished product.....been running it for awhile in the days garage is 110F but the batteries get about 50F in the day

    total extra cost 149 fridge and silicon 3

    something I learned, panels my be at 17v but amps need to be up and angle of incidence def help the amps

    that 5.45 amps is noon 17.5 V but panels are 45degrees to the side so I turn them thru the day and get 8+amps  keeps everything 100%



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  • littleharbor2
    littleharbor2 Solar Expert Posts: 2,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #17
    What gauge wire do you have coming from your panels, and how long a distance?  That wire looks awfully small.

    2.1 Kw Suntech 175 mono, Classic 200, Trace SW 4024 ( 15 years old  but brand new out of sealed factory box Jan. 2015), Bogart Tri-metric,  460 Ah. 24 volt LiFePo4 battery bank. Plenty of Baja Sea of Cortez sunshine.

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  • DJuan222
    DJuan222 Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭✭
    #18
    its 12 or 14 for about 15 feet I have 10 that Im going to change to but just wanted to finish this project first
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