Stacking Similar but not identical Trace / Xantrex inverters (SW+2524 & PS2524)

OceanOcean Registered Users Posts: 46 ✭✭
So I have a Xantrex "Sine Wave Plus 2524" and also a Xantrex "Power Station 2524".  I need 240 to run a 1.5hp well pump.  Right now I'm doing it with an Outback 3524 coupled to a transformer.  But there are losses, and the pump pulls 12amps running at 240, and both the transformer and the Outback heat up, so I can only run it for 10 or 15 minutes per hour before it gets uncomfortable here in Redding where it can be 104 or more during the summer.  I have a timer spacing it out from early morning to evening but It's really not enough.  I need up to 4 hours per day plus I want the capacity for continuous running output from the well in case of a fire.  Generator is not cost effective for everyday use plus it's noisy.  I have enough solar to supply it.  The issue is keeping equipment cool.

The battery pack is a Tesla 7s 9kw pack.  It performs awesome with top end 29.2v and low end 21v.

I would really like to stack the SW+ with the PS if it's possible because I believe they can easily handle the load - that's only 12 amps on each unit.  I think they could do it continuously even at 104f (40c).... that's my goal.

Does anyone here have intimate knowledge of how the stacking works?  I believe the stacking cable is the same for both units.  I don't even have a stacking cable yet but I know I could build one.  I noticed in stacking section of the SW+ manual, that the Neutral Output of the Primary Inverter is connected to the Neutral Input of the secondary.  Does this determine who is master and who is slave?  Are there any other factors?  I don't have a SWRC so I cannot program the PS2524.  I would like to simply connect them together with the SW+ being the master and the PS being the slave.

Any insight would be greatly appreciated....

thanks,
-Ocean

Comments

  • Dave AngeliniDave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 4,990 ✭✭✭✭✭
     As I learned it when I used these back in the day, stacking is for identical inverters only. Short of this you could damage loads and inverters. Search the forum here and you may find the damage.

    The SW+ stack manual is attached here.

    My take on using this old equipment is it is fine as long as you do not have critical applications or loads. If you do, you need spare equipment to back this up. It will fail when you need it most. Fighting a fire at your home is about as critical as it gets, to me.

    Schneider sells in the store here a split phase inverter for about $1300. CSW 2524.

    Good Luck!
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Mountains near Mariposa/Yosemite CA
     http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
    E-mail [email protected]

  • mike95490mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 8,578 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What Dave said.  I've even heard the firmware version needs to be the same when stacking.  What's it worth to do right, and not rigged together?

    Keep us posted

    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

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  • OceanOcean Registered Users Posts: 46 ✭✭
    Thanks... well, yeah.  Of course I want to do it right.  Also, there is budget issues.  If I have to find $1300 I will find a refurbished GVFX3524 and stack that with the one I already have.   So if I could do it reliably with the equipment I have, that's the first best choice.  Both of these two inverters (SW+2524 and PS2524) I have are working very well.

    And of course, I would not expect a single Schneider 2524 split phase inverter to run a 1.5 hp well pump continuously - or even for more than 5 minutes - since the well pump pulls 12amps @240v as I said.  Over 2500 watts.

    My question therefore obviously is about using two 2500 watt inverters to do the job.  And, whether or not these two very similar inverters - same rating, same make, slightly different model - would naturally sync with each other- essentially asking if they speak the same language - do they attempt to identify each other to verify that they are compatible?  Or is the Synchronization signal something that happens automatically - the unit simply assuming that you have plugged a compatible unit to the other end of the cable?

    Apologies I should have made this post in the advanced user section....

    I'm looking for really truly creative ideas here, and I always take responsibility for my own actions.

    thanks!
    -Ocean


  • mcgivormcgivor Solar Expert Posts: 3,249 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2019 #5

    @Ocean
    And of course, I would not expect a single Schneider 2524 split phase inverter to run a 1.5 hp well pump continuously - or even for more than 5 minutes - since the well pump pulls 12amps @240v as I said.  Over 2500 watts.



    Are you sure about 12A @ 240V, seems rather high, is that measured current because I run a 1.5 hp. 230V deep well pump on a cheap 2 Kw inverter, the measured current is~6A, it generally runs for about an hour and a half when needed always in 30 to 40°C ambient without any issues for 3 years.
    1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider MPPT 60 150 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery bank 
    Second system 1890W  3 × 300W No name brand poly, 3×330 Sunsolar Poly panels, Morningstar TS 60 PWM controller, no name 2000W inverter 400Ah FLA 24V nominal used for water pumping and day time air conditioning.  
    5Kw Yanmar clone single cylinder air cooled diesel generator for rare emergency charging and welding.
  • OceanOcean Registered Users Posts: 46 ✭✭
    Wow!  I wish I had stats like that!  How deep is your well?  Mine is 300'.  I just dropped that pump my self and I know it reads 12a 240v on the label.  Also, that's about what my AC/DC clamp meter reads...
  • OceanOcean Registered Users Posts: 46 ✭✭
    I guess it's all highly experimental.  No one should sanction such a thing.  It would be nice to know if it works.  Guess I will just keep looking for the best deal on a match to any of what I have....
  • mcgivormcgivor Solar Expert Posts: 3,249 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ocean said:
    Wow!  I wish I had stats like that!  How deep is your well?  Mine is 300'.  I just dropped that pump my self and I know it reads 12a 240v on the label.  Also, that's about what my AC/DC clamp meter reads...
    That's one detail I thought about after posting, my pump is ~45 feet down with static 12-20 with total maximum head of 28 feet. That likely why there is such a vastly different consumption.
    1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider MPPT 60 150 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery bank 
    Second system 1890W  3 × 300W No name brand poly, 3×330 Sunsolar Poly panels, Morningstar TS 60 PWM controller, no name 2000W inverter 400Ah FLA 24V nominal used for water pumping and day time air conditioning.  
    5Kw Yanmar clone single cylinder air cooled diesel generator for rare emergency charging and welding.
  • OceanOcean Registered Users Posts: 46 ✭✭
    Hmmmm... nice.  Interested in trading for a windmill pump cylinder / system?  I just tried installing one - it's beautiful (all brass, 3" dia 35" stroke)... I just need one of any of these inverters to match what I already have: SW+2524, PS2524, SW5548, Outback GVFX3524.  All are stackable I just need one to match any of these....  I have the complete cylinder pump setup with wellcap and fittings to drop the cylinder up to 300 feet on 1-1/4" black poly, but it could be shortened to any depth or just the cylinder installed as an upgrade to an existing system...  It could be an awesome hand pump @ about 1 gal per pump.

    Anyways.  That's where I am at....
  • paulcheungpaulcheung Registered Users Posts: 42 ✭✭
    Isn't the SW5548 a split 120/240 volt inverter? that should run the pump with ease even it is run 12A 240volts.
    XW6848+ Magnum 4448PAE (Backup) 7800 watts total mixed Panels, 370 AH @48volts battery bank. Grid assist and soon be Tied.
  • OceanOcean Registered Users Posts: 46 ✭✭
    Isn't the SW5548 a split 120/240 volt inverter? that should run the pump with ease even it is run 12A 240volts.
    It's the older SW5548 not split phase.  But yes, it should - even though it would be 24+amps at 120 coming out still it WOULD be no problem...  However, there is a burn on the FET Board and one (maybe two) of the FET's is destroyed.  It works but I don't dare put it under heavy load.  If I had another unit, I would stack them because then this one would only bare half the load - 12amps @120 volts not too bad.  Using this unit alone would be my last backup plan because it also means changing the pump house system from 24v to 48v - a hassle but doable.
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