No AC output from my 600w inverter... Power light go on and disconnect instantly

Fry999
Fry999 Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭✭
in Caravan, Recreational Vehicle, and Marine Power Systems #1
Hello friends, 

I have an issue with my power system in my van. 

So i have : 
-12v 60AH battery (which is fine)  : my water pump is directly connected on the battery and work fine. 
- solar pannel connected on the battery : the signal said that the battery is fully charged. 
- A 600w inverter : I turn it on the fan start (all good) but the light indicating AC Output goes green for a couple of seconds then turn off...

Problem : I dont have AC output and I dont know why. 

My DC Voltage indicator connected on the battery show me a good  13-14 V 
I've seen that i have a drop to  11.5V  when I start the invertor but it goes back quickly to 12.5-13V. 

Do you have any ideas / tips / solution to get my AC output working back ? 

Thank you guys 

Cheers ! 

 
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Comments

  • petertearai
    petertearai Solar Expert Posts: 471 ✭✭✭✭
    #2
    do you have a load on the inverter when starting ? if so it may be to big for the inverter .
    2225 wattts pv . Outback 2kw  fxr pure sine inverter . fm80 charge controller . Mate 3. victron battery monitor . 24 volts  in 2 volt Shoto lead carbon extreme batterys. off grid  holiday home 
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  • Fry999
    Fry999 Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭✭
    edited November 2018 #3
    I've tried with load and whitout.... 
    I had electricity with a basic phone charger for 1minute but then it shut down. Whitout anything connected usually the light goes green for 2-3sec then shutdown.  it's not just a LED problem of course. 
    I have a USB port on the inverter port wich is perfectly giving out electricity tho (with green or no light). 

    I'm a bit confused to be honest. 
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  • Photowhit
    Photowhit Solar Expert Posts: 6,006 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #4
    You need to check the DC voltage under load to see if it's minimal, 11.5 or lower, and the inverter is shutting down on it's own due to low voltage.

    Seeing a system voltage of 13-14 volts, is when the battery is charging and doesn't indicate the state of charge.

    The USB likely uses a DC to DC converter, since USB is 5 volts, the battery would have to be pretty fried for it not to work.
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
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  • Fry999
    Fry999 Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭✭
    #5
    Ok thank you,  But how do i check the DC Voltage under load if I can't have power whitout load ?  
    The invertor I have (https://www.giandel.com.au/product/giandel-modified-inverter-600w-12v-pc8-600m12v/)  have a 10-15V input range. 

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  • mcgivor
    mcgivor Solar Expert Posts: 3,854 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #6
    Do you have a digital multimeter, if so check battery voltage at the DC input of the inverter, check all connections are tight.
    1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider MPPT 60 150 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery with Battery Bodyguard BMS 
    Second system 1890W  3 × 300W No name brand poly, 3×330 Sunsolar Poly panels, Morningstar TS 60 PWM controller, no name 2000W inverter 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery with Daly BMS, used for water pumping and day time air conditioning.  
    5Kw Yanmar clone single cylinder air cooled diesel generator for rare emergency charging and welding.
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  • Fry999
    Fry999 Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭✭
    edited November 2018 #7
    Thank you guys. 

    I have some update for you. 

    Unfortunatly, I don't have a multimeter, however I have a DC V indicator connected to the battery (it's a bit tricky to move my setup as is it right now) BUT I managed to have a stable power AC output connecting (again) my phone charger ( and I seriously don't understand why it's "working" this time)  : 

    The DC V from the battery dropped dramatically to 11.5V when I switch the invertor on, on load. It stayed like this for a good 30sec, then it grow back gradually to 14V (in about 2 minutes). 

    Now it's oscillating  between 13.5 et 14.1 V and as far as I know my phone is still charging as we talk. 
    I'm a bit afraid to disconect this right now as it's stable (?)...  (I am supposed to be able to power a small 100W fridge and my 120W laptop ...).

    With theses precious pieces of informations, what do you think ?  The low voltage while turning the inverter ON while loaded is a trigger to the AC output ? why ? how can i fix it ? 

    Thanks for your informations, it's getting a bit more clear for me to understand thanks to you guys. 







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  • mcgivor
    mcgivor Solar Expert Posts: 3,854 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #8
    Make sure the DC conductors are the correct size, all connections are secure, one problem is the 60Ah battery is small which may cause voltage sag when the inverter is turned on, capacitors charging up internally. You need to do a load calculation, the battery will not support a refrigerator even if the inverter can, a larger capacity battery will also be less prone to voltage sag. Perhaps start a new thread to deal with load calculation.
    1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider MPPT 60 150 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery with Battery Bodyguard BMS 
    Second system 1890W  3 × 300W No name brand poly, 3×330 Sunsolar Poly panels, Morningstar TS 60 PWM controller, no name 2000W inverter 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery with Daly BMS, used for water pumping and day time air conditioning.  
    5Kw Yanmar clone single cylinder air cooled diesel generator for rare emergency charging and welding.
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  • Fry999
    Fry999 Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭✭
    edited November 2018 #9
    The trouble I have is that the previous owner didn't had this power shortage problems at all... He was able to power the small refrigerator and his laptop at the same time without trouble. 
    From what I know the battery can handle at least 2 full hour of powering 250W. 

    Well, my phone stopped charging after 10min  while the voltage was still 13.5 minimum... 
    I've tried to plug the refrigerator and the socket and I had a drastic drop to a minimum of 10.2 Volts (for 1sec) then the AC OUT stopped. 

    Is my battery dead ? 

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  • mcgivor
    mcgivor Solar Expert Posts: 3,854 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #10
    Fry999 said:
    The trouble I have is that the previous owner didn't had this power shortage problems at all... He was able to power the small refrigerator and his laptop at the same time without trouble. 
    From what I know the battery can handle at least 2 full hour of powering 250W. 

    Well, my phone stopped charging after 10min  while the voltage was still 13.5 minimum... 
    I've tried to plug the refrigerator and the socket and I had a drastic drop to a minimum of 10.2 Volts (for 1sec) then the AC OUT stopped. 

    Is my battery dead ? 

    Very likely the battery is dead, most likely from abuse, it is too small for the loads stated.
    1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider MPPT 60 150 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery with Battery Bodyguard BMS 
    Second system 1890W  3 × 300W No name brand poly, 3×330 Sunsolar Poly panels, Morningstar TS 60 PWM controller, no name 2000W inverter 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery with Daly BMS, used for water pumping and day time air conditioning.  
    5Kw Yanmar clone single cylinder air cooled diesel generator for rare emergency charging and welding.
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  • Fry999
    Fry999 Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭✭
    #11
    Must be that yes... Anyway I can fully confirm this diagnostic ? 
    Then what would you advise me as battery type to replace it ?  
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #12
    I would suggest that we start at the beginning... What are your loads (Amp*Hours @ 12 volts per day, or Watt*Hours per day)?

    Roughly where the system will be used (major city--figure out hours of sun per day by season)?

    Is this a summer weekend system or intended to run 9+ months per year (such as an off grid cabin)?

    Are you just experimenting with the system or do you want to have something "reliable"?

    You really should be getting some electrical/battery tools too... A basic list would include:

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01B2NR894 (inexpensive AC/DC current clamp Digital Multimeter)
    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B019CY4FB4 (medium cost AC/DC current clamp DMM)
    https://www.solar-electric.com/kiacpomome.html (AC Kill-a-Watt meter for 120 VAC load measurements--good for use around the house for conservation projects)
    https://www.solar-electric.com/search/?q=hydrometer (for flooded cell lead acid batteries)

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • mcgivor
    mcgivor Solar Expert Posts: 3,854 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #13
    We need to know details, the more precise the better with regards to loads and how long they're used, also include what the charging source is as this is as important, starting a new thread is best as response will be directed to the battery capacity/charging needs, rather than the inverter no output problem. You will receive good advice from various helpful members with loads of experience.
    1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider MPPT 60 150 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery with Battery Bodyguard BMS 
    Second system 1890W  3 × 300W No name brand poly, 3×330 Sunsolar Poly panels, Morningstar TS 60 PWM controller, no name 2000W inverter 400Ah LFP 24V nominal battery with Daly BMS, used for water pumping and day time air conditioning.  
    5Kw Yanmar clone single cylinder air cooled diesel generator for rare emergency charging and welding.
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  • Fry999
    Fry999 Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭✭
    #14
    Thank you guys i'll will considere all of that. 


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  • littleharbor2
    littleharbor2 Solar Expert Posts: 2,101 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #15
    Sure sounds like a bad battery to me. Is the quick rebound of voltage happening during the day while the solar panel is producing voltage? Your small loads may be covered by solar output alone.  Is the problem more pronounced at night?
     Can you find someone with a carbon pile load tester? You can pick them up pretty cheap at Harbor Freight. 

    2.1 Kw Suntech 175 mono, Classic 200, Trace SW 4024 ( 15 years old  but brand new out of sealed factory box Jan. 2015), Bogart Tri-metric,  460 Ah. 24 volt LiFePo4 battery bank. Plenty of Baja Sea of Cortez sunshine.

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  • Fry999
    Fry999 Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭✭
    #16
    Thanks all i'm now looking for more information about batteries for my system. I've made a specfspe topic in the general section. 
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