Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

mjp24coho
mjp24coho Solar Expert Posts: 104 ✭✭✭
in Off Grid Solar & Battery Systems #1
I'm debating going with satellite internet (my 3G aircard is proving unreliable with spotty coverage). One of my big hesitations is the power draw. This will be for my remote offgrid cabin - I don't want something that is drawing 50-100W 24-7, just to use to monitor my system and a few cameras. I'm looking into Exede/WildBlue. Has anyone here hooked up a wattmeter to one of their systems (newer components) to see what exactly the draw is (all components - dish, AC adapter/power brick, modem?, etc)? The installer I've been talking to has no idea, but the wattage draw could be a deal-breaker that I'd like to know the answer to before signing up.

Thanks!
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #2
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

    Well I've got two of them, both Xplornet.
    Modem, router, phone adapter is <50 Watts but it does fluctuate a bit with usage.

    That doesn't mean another brand will use the same amount of power, however.
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #3
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

    Any way you can use and external/directional antenna?

    http://www.amazon.com/AeriaLight2-External-Antenna-Wireless-AirCard/dp/B006O3MH1M (not cheap)
    http://www.antennagear.net/servlet/the-Sierra-Wireless-cln-AirCard-250U-3G-fdsh-4G/Categories

    The first one is a +12db directional (good for valleys and against mountains where you may have a lot of reflections)... The second does list an 11db omni-directional (not sure that is "really" possible).

    Anyway--if getting the antenna out of the house/on a pole (lighting protected?) may be interesting.

    The +6db antenna will probably not do a lot (and less will not do much of anything). Again, just getting the antenna out of the house/cabin may be good enough if you already have some reception.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #4
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

    A couple of things you should know about satellite Internet that they aren't going to tell you when they sell you:

    Sometimes it goes down for no particular reason. Usually it reboots on its own, but not always. If you're not there to power down the modem and reset it then it will stay down.

    If snow gets on the dish you have no signal until it gets off the dish. Again if you're not there to brush it off you've got nothing 'til it melts.

    T-storms or heavy rain will also knock out the signal, although usually temporarily.

    Yeah, it's fun. But where I am it's satellite or nothing.
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  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    #5
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    BB. wrote: »
    ... The second does list an 11db omni-directional (not sure that is "really" possible).

    -Bill

    yes, it is possible as they are collinear vertical antennas. i built one for the 1296mhz band before. the high gain antennas do work, but they work by concentrating the rf signal into a narrower focus area like a maglite flashlight can do. the vertical (omni) antenna will suffer in the high or low areas. in other words if mounted high on a hill the signal into the valley below will suffer as it will want to go more straight out horizontally from the antenna. for pinpointing to one location the beam will do well, but he will have to know what polarization they use. if they use horizontal and he puts up an omni vertical then this will be worse, not better so you do have to know a bit about this stuff to make it work right. cable losses can get to be quite high too when using frequencies in the uhf and higher bands.
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  • jcheil
    jcheil Solar Expert Posts: 722 ✭✭✭
    #6
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

    I was in the same situation as you about 3 months ago and now have a PERFECT solution that I am happy with.
    I am at the fringe of cell service where I am at (3g/4glte). I was lucky if I could get one bar once in a while.

    I ended up going with the "Verizon 4G LTE Broadband Router with Voice" router (free with 2 year contract) with 2 externally pole-mounted (on my roof) yagi/direction antennas pointed to the nearest tower (about 8-9 miles away) and now I get 4bars and 21mb both upload and download and a great SN ratio also. Antennas and cables were about $150 total and they require no power. [Note: "direction" antenna is the important part]

    Also, as a free "plus", since I am on a "share" plan for my cell phone and this device, they share the same data plan, and you get a free "home phone" (just plug a standard house phone into the router) with it's own phone number. So I get the best of both worlds, high-speed data (with ABGN wireless and a 3-port hub) that doesn't drop out and reliable phone service (on the "home" phone) that doesn't drop out either.

    I never measured the power consumption, I will this weekend, but I would doubt it would be much more than 15w or so. It only has a small wall transformer.

    I looked at satellite also, but the biggest problem I had with them was their "fair use" policy in that they clamp your speed after you use a certain amount of data each day. I am a software developer and use the Internet heavily and that would really cramp my style.
    Off-Grid in Central Florida since 2005, Full-Time since June 2014 | 12 X Sovello 205w panels, 9 X ToPoint 220w panels, 36x ToPoint 225w panels (12,525 watts total) | Custom built single-axis ground mounts | Complete FP2 Outback System: 3 x FM80, 2 x VFX3648, X240 Transformer, FLEXnet-DC, Mate-3, Hub-10, FW500 AC/DC | 24 x Trojan L16RE-B Batteries 1110ah @ 48v | Honda EU7000is Generator and a pile of "other" Generators | Home-Made PVC solar hot water collector | Custom data logging software http://www.somewhatcrookedcamp.com/monitormate.html
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #7
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    jcheil wrote: »
    I looked at satellite also, but the biggest problem I had with them was their "fair use" policy in that they clamp your speed after you use a certain amount of data each day. I am a software developer and use the Internet heavily and that would really cramp my style.

    They don't all have this. Our first systems did and it was a giant pain in the anatomy. The new ones have 20GB allowance per month (not 'X' per day which is what always caused trouble) and if you go over you simply pay for it; no speed slow down.

    Now if they'd only make arrangements to come and upgrade the other dish like they were supposed to last week. Not the most reliable service, of either type.
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #8
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

    Here is a review:

    http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2428259,00.asp

    Note that it will not work with 3G for data--You must have 4G available.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • jcheil
    jcheil Solar Expert Posts: 722 ✭✭✭
    #9
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    BB. wrote: »
    Here is a review:

    http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2428259,00.asp

    Note that it will not work with 3G for data--You must have 4G available.

    -Bill

    Agreed that you have to be in a 4g area, but 3g is starting to die out anyways and 4g is what they are focusing on now-a-days. I had the 3g version and used the same external antennas and it worked well. But, not sure I agree with everything they state in that review. Kind of misleading. As far as speeds, that has to do with your area and the number of users on the tower. Hence why they get totally different rates in different areas.

    As far as the cost, they are assuming that someone is just going to go out and ONLY purchase that device and a data plan, which, yes could easily be more $ than other options (if other options are available - that's the kicker) but when you drop it into an existing share-plan at Verizon, the price is much less. Basically $30/month access fee then share your data pool (which is $10/2gb).

    Nothing is gonna beat cable/dsl prices with unlimited data. But when you have no other choice (like myself and many other off-gridders), it is a viable solution - or at least was for me.
    Off-Grid in Central Florida since 2005, Full-Time since June 2014 | 12 X Sovello 205w panels, 9 X ToPoint 220w panels, 36x ToPoint 225w panels (12,525 watts total) | Custom built single-axis ground mounts | Complete FP2 Outback System: 3 x FM80, 2 x VFX3648, X240 Transformer, FLEXnet-DC, Mate-3, Hub-10, FW500 AC/DC | 24 x Trojan L16RE-B Batteries 1110ah @ 48v | Honda EU7000is Generator and a pile of "other" Generators | Home-Made PVC solar hot water collector | Custom data logging software http://www.somewhatcrookedcamp.com/monitormate.html
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  • Tobit
    Tobit Solar Expert Posts: 41 ✭
    #10
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

    jcheil, thanks for posting your experiences. I haven't quite figured out my plans yet but cellular alone will not work like I thought it would on my remote, off-grid, property. Although topographical maps make it look like my ridge is the highest around, the ridge to my south is blocking my signal. If I drive down and up, park in the woods on the next ridge, my ATT 3G works great. However, 0 bars on my land.

    Now, get this, some crazy fool at one point paid to have underground landline installed on the property. I am two miles, on the third ridge, away from the nearest black top. I really don't want to go back to dialup but at least I will have that option.
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  • jcheil
    jcheil Solar Expert Posts: 722 ✭✭✭
    #11
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    Tobit wrote: »
    jcheil, thanks for posting your experiences. I haven't quite figured out my plans yet but cellular alone will not work like I thought it would on my remote, off-grid, property. Although topographical maps make it look like my ridge is the highest around, the ridge to my south is blocking my signal. If I drive down and up, park in the woods on the next ridge, my ATT 3G works great. However, 0 bars on my land.

    Now, get this, some crazy fool at one point paid to have underground landline installed on the property. I am two miles, on the third ridge, away from the nearest black top. I really don't want to go back to dialup but at least I will have that option.

    ugh, that's too bad. Maybe Satellite is the way to go then...I can't imagine dial-up now-a-days :)

    But, idea...perhaps a tower for the directional antenna? The antennas are very lightweight, could make a 50' one with 5 sections of 2" EMT and some guy wires. That 50' might just put you over the other ridge (signal wise)? Could always climb a tree on your land and see if that makes a difference. OR, just because you can't get any bars with your phone now doesn't mean you won't get any with a yagi antenna. Like in my case, I rarely could even get 1 bar with my phone, but the antenna got me 4 and the tower is 8-9 miles away. I had to "take a chance" because there was no way to "be sure", but I bought my stuff from wpsantennas.com and they take returns without and hassles if it does not work. The antenna will work with your 3g aircard (just need to get the adapter from the antenna company - hoping that your 3g aircard has a port for an external antenna [most do]).
    Off-Grid in Central Florida since 2005, Full-Time since June 2014 | 12 X Sovello 205w panels, 9 X ToPoint 220w panels, 36x ToPoint 225w panels (12,525 watts total) | Custom built single-axis ground mounts | Complete FP2 Outback System: 3 x FM80, 2 x VFX3648, X240 Transformer, FLEXnet-DC, Mate-3, Hub-10, FW500 AC/DC | 24 x Trojan L16RE-B Batteries 1110ah @ 48v | Honda EU7000is Generator and a pile of "other" Generators | Home-Made PVC solar hot water collector | Custom data logging software http://www.somewhatcrookedcamp.com/monitormate.html
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  • Tobit
    Tobit Solar Expert Posts: 41 ✭
    #12
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    jcheil wrote: »
    ugh, that's too bad. Maybe Satellite is the way to go then...I can't imagine dial-up now-a-days :)

    But, idea...perhaps a tower for the directional antenna?
    Yeah, I have been an amateur radio operator for 30 years. It is definitely something I should try. I just haven't been able to spend much time on my land yet.
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  • jcheil
    jcheil Solar Expert Posts: 722 ✭✭✭
    #13
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    Tobit wrote: »
    Yeah, I have been an amateur radio operator for 30 years. It is definitely something I should try. I just haven't been able to spend much time on my land yet.

    Just curious, what are the GPS coords of your land? if you don't mind.
    Off-Grid in Central Florida since 2005, Full-Time since June 2014 | 12 X Sovello 205w panels, 9 X ToPoint 220w panels, 36x ToPoint 225w panels (12,525 watts total) | Custom built single-axis ground mounts | Complete FP2 Outback System: 3 x FM80, 2 x VFX3648, X240 Transformer, FLEXnet-DC, Mate-3, Hub-10, FW500 AC/DC | 24 x Trojan L16RE-B Batteries 1110ah @ 48v | Honda EU7000is Generator and a pile of "other" Generators | Home-Made PVC solar hot water collector | Custom data logging software http://www.somewhatcrookedcamp.com/monitormate.html
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  • Tobit
    Tobit Solar Expert Posts: 41 ✭
    #14
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    jcheil wrote: »
    Just curious, what are the GPS coords of your land? if you don't mind.
    Standby, will reply in a PM.
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  • pleppik
    pleppik Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    #15
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    Tobit wrote: »
    Now, get this, some crazy fool at one point paid to have underground landline installed on the property. I am two miles, on the third ridge, away from the nearest black top. I really don't want to go back to dialup but at least I will have that option.

    If you have the landline wire, there's a chance DSL might be an option. Have you checked into that?
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #16
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    pleppik wrote: »
    If you have the landline wire, there's a chance DSL might be an option. Have you checked into that?


    DSL requires the central phone exchange be within several thousand feet of the customer. OK in the city, not so good in the hinterlands.


    I have the same issue, I'm using verizon 4g android phone as a hotspot for my internet. No video, streaming music, got a 6GB monthly cap.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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  • Tobit
    Tobit Solar Expert Posts: 41 ✭
    #17
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    pleppik wrote: »
    If you have the landline wire, there's a chance DSL might be an option. Have you checked into that?
    I am 18 miles from the closest town of less than 2K people. DSL is not an option.
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  • jcheil
    jcheil Solar Expert Posts: 722 ✭✭✭
    #18
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    Tobit wrote: »
    I am 18 miles from the closest town of less than 2K people. DSL is not an option.

    Now, this is dating myself, but, if you have copper, you might be able to get an ISDN/BRI line. I believe they are around 256Kb speed. Better than dial-up and they are "always on". Might want to check into it. Haven't installed/used one of them since the mid-90's but it might just fit the bill for you.
    Off-Grid in Central Florida since 2005, Full-Time since June 2014 | 12 X Sovello 205w panels, 9 X ToPoint 220w panels, 36x ToPoint 225w panels (12,525 watts total) | Custom built single-axis ground mounts | Complete FP2 Outback System: 3 x FM80, 2 x VFX3648, X240 Transformer, FLEXnet-DC, Mate-3, Hub-10, FW500 AC/DC | 24 x Trojan L16RE-B Batteries 1110ah @ 48v | Honda EU7000is Generator and a pile of "other" Generators | Home-Made PVC solar hot water collector | Custom data logging software http://www.somewhatcrookedcamp.com/monitormate.html
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  • DanS26
    DanS26 Solar Expert Posts: 269 ✭✭✭
    #19
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

    Just to give you another option, here is what I did.

    On Verizon with 0 to 1 bar before system upgrade.

    Installed an omni-directional truckers antenna and cell signal booster from Wilson Electronics. Then installed a panel antenna in the house. Signal went to 4 to 5 bars consistently. Then installed a Cradlepoint wireless modem attached to a UM175 USB data modem that receives the signal from the panel antenna. Works great and has not gone down for over two years.

    The omni-directional antenna allows the system to receive signals from any tower. Thus friends and relatives with non-Verizon tower signals have cell service in my house.

    The booster is powered 24/7 and uses 8 watts per hour.
    23.16kW Kyocera panels; 2 Fronius 7.5kW inverters; Nyle hot water; Steffes ETS; Great Lakes RO; Generac 10kW w/ATS, TED Pro System monitoring
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  • Tobit
    Tobit Solar Expert Posts: 41 ✭
    #20
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede

    I've been doing a lot of analysis lately, thanks to jcheil's help, and although I have a few towers within a few miles radius of me, it looks like I may have to switch to Verzion. No one in the immediate 20 mile radius appears to have more frequencies and service types available. Verzion with a directional antenna as high as I can get it may be my best bet.

    Attachment not found.
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  • jcheil
    jcheil Solar Expert Posts: 722 ✭✭✭
    #21
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    DanS26 wrote: »
    Just to give you another option, here is what I did.

    On Verizon with 0 to 1 bar before system upgrade.

    Installed an omni-directional truckers antenna and cell signal booster from Wilson Electronics. Then installed a panel antenna in the house. Signal went to 4 to 5 bars consistently. Then installed a Cradlepoint wireless modem attached to a UM175 USB data modem that receives the signal from the panel antenna. Works great and has not gone down for over two years.

    The omni-directional antenna allows the system to receive signals from any tower. Thus friends and relatives with non-Verizon tower signals have cell service in my house.

    The booster is powered 24/7 and uses 8 watts per hour.

    I have that also (in addition to my direct direction antenna to the air-card router. However that model you have (like mine) is likely only for 3g (which the OP has). It was about $400. The 4g version is closer to $1500! It was cheaper to have the 3g wilson just for calls and the direct antenna for the 4g router.
    Off-Grid in Central Florida since 2005, Full-Time since June 2014 | 12 X Sovello 205w panels, 9 X ToPoint 220w panels, 36x ToPoint 225w panels (12,525 watts total) | Custom built single-axis ground mounts | Complete FP2 Outback System: 3 x FM80, 2 x VFX3648, X240 Transformer, FLEXnet-DC, Mate-3, Hub-10, FW500 AC/DC | 24 x Trojan L16RE-B Batteries 1110ah @ 48v | Honda EU7000is Generator and a pile of "other" Generators | Home-Made PVC solar hot water collector | Custom data logging software http://www.somewhatcrookedcamp.com/monitormate.html
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  • jcheil
    jcheil Solar Expert Posts: 722 ✭✭✭
    #22
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    Tobit wrote: »
    I've been doing a lot of analysis lately, thanks to jcheil's help, and although I have a few towers within a few miles radius of me, it looks like I may have to switch to Verzion. No one in the immediate 20 mile radius appears to have more frequencies and service types available. Verzion with a directional antenna as high as I can get it may be my best bet.

    Attachment not found.

    And if you get on their "share" plan (especially their "edge" plan), it can be somewhat cheaper sharing your data between all devices. $160 for 4 smartphones/devices and 10GB shared data per month. Less $ if you have less devices obviously.
    Off-Grid in Central Florida since 2005, Full-Time since June 2014 | 12 X Sovello 205w panels, 9 X ToPoint 220w panels, 36x ToPoint 225w panels (12,525 watts total) | Custom built single-axis ground mounts | Complete FP2 Outback System: 3 x FM80, 2 x VFX3648, X240 Transformer, FLEXnet-DC, Mate-3, Hub-10, FW500 AC/DC | 24 x Trojan L16RE-B Batteries 1110ah @ 48v | Honda EU7000is Generator and a pile of "other" Generators | Home-Made PVC solar hot water collector | Custom data logging software http://www.somewhatcrookedcamp.com/monitormate.html
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  • DanS26
    DanS26 Solar Expert Posts: 269 ✭✭✭
    #23
    Re: Exact Satellite Internet Wattage Draw - WildBlue.Exede
    jcheil wrote: »
    I have that also (in addition to my direct direction antenna to the air-card router. However that model you have (like mine) is likely only for 3g (which the OP has). It was about $400. The 4g version is closer to $1500! It was cheaper to have the 3g wilson just for calls and the direct antenna for the 4g router.

    Yes, 3G only and yes, I did look at the LTE (4G) model and the cost was too much. I'll just live with 3G until a less expensive option becomes available, hopefully soon.
    23.16kW Kyocera panels; 2 Fronius 7.5kW inverters; Nyle hot water; Steffes ETS; Great Lakes RO; Generac 10kW w/ATS, TED Pro System monitoring
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