What to do for Hurricane winds?

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CVN-71
CVN-71 Solar Expert Posts: 54 ✭✭
in General Solar Power Topics #1
Is there anything I should do to secure the panels during the strong winds? Ours are mounted with standard Unirac rails and mounting clips. I'm concerned that the small retaining edge on the clips won't be enough to hold them. Am I being overly concerned? Should I tie the panels to the rails with rope?? Any other ideas. I live in a non-typical hurricane area so not use to having to take any special wind precautions. Tks.
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  • Solar Guppy
    Solar Guppy Solar Expert Posts: 1,989 ✭✭✭
    #2
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    If your system is not engineered ie by a PE for high winds, take the panels down and store them. I can strip my roof in 6 hours if the need should arise and that's with 14kw of panels and two helpers
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  • solar_dave
    solar_dave Solar Expert Posts: 2,397 ✭✭✭✭
    #3
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    Call the insurance man.
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  • CVN-71
    CVN-71 Solar Expert Posts: 54 ✭✭
    #4
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    Does anyone know what wind speed/gusts the Uniracs clips are rated for? I'm not near the coast so don't think we'll get the full force winds, just higher than normal. Taking them down is an option but rather not have to if the clips could be shored up with some rope, etc. Yes, I 'm ready to call the insurance man if need be.:cry:
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #5
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    If taking panels off, better have the MC connector removal tool on hand.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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  • rollandelliott
    rollandelliott Solar Expert Posts: 834 ✭✭
    #6
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    maybe a few sheets of plywood over the top bolted to the rail system would protect from flying debris, but given the amount of work that would take taking them down would be easier!
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  • Solar Guppy
    Solar Guppy Solar Expert Posts: 1,989 ✭✭✭
    #7
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    The issue isn't the just the clips, unless you have an engineered solution, you don't know where the weak spots are, more than likely its the actual mounting point to the roof.

    All it takes is one gust and it will peel the array like the skin off an Orange. The uplift is typically in the order of 400-500 pounds per panel in hurricane force winds and structures in the Northeast are not designed like they are in Florida for winds loads ( I Lived for 35 years on Mass and was born in N.H ).

    Ropes are useless to secure panel and / or racking and will snap like a twigs or the attachment point will just rip out from what they are screwed/lagged too. As others mentioned, flying debris is almost a certainty, that alone is reason to store the panels
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  • Urbandialect
    Urbandialect Solar Expert Posts: 107 ✭✭✭✭
    #8
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?
    Solar Guppy wrote: »
    that's with 14kw of panels and two helpers

    Wait, are you saying YOU have a 14 kw array? OMG!!!
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  • PhilS
    PhilS Solar Expert Posts: 370 ✭✭✭
    #9
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    I experienced VERY high winds just before Memorial Day. I use Unirac ground mounts. One panel took a projectile from the rear, knocking it from the rails. The other 5 panels in that set departed from the rails too (two rail sets of 3 panels each). You must realize that if one panel comes loose from Unirac, the rest will too.

    Five other sets of panels mounted on Uniracs stayed mounted to the rails, but the whole assemblies were ripped from the ground. Those tiny clips held fine even through the air and landing.

    After the event, 3KW of panels were in a big pile, "tethered" by the tied cable bundle, about 5 feet from the original location since that's as far as the cables would allow.

    Out of 26 panels, only the one was damaged. Bolts had pulled out of the Unirac mounting channels which allowed them to "sail" from the hardware mounting them to the ground. But on reassembly, I just repositioned things so the mounting bolts were a few inches away from where they had been originally.

    The next morning I turned all the panels face up in the yard and was actually making excellent power since they had been aimed more toward a winter sun before this happened. It took me two months of weekends to get everything back up again since there wasn't any urgent hurry.

    Coincidentally (I think) the ONLY panels that came off of the Uniracs were the only MC4 panels in my system. All the rest are regular junction boxes and stayed with the rails.

    As for what YOU should do, you'd have the best judgement there. Roof mount vs ground mount could make a difference. Having MC4 connectors would make a HUGE labor difference if you were to remove the panels and store them safely.

    Knowing what I now know (of course, it wasn't like we had a lot of warning) I could've loosened a couple of dozen bolts, then laid each set face down on the grass and covered the backs with moving blankets and plywood.

    But those little clips held better than I would have ever guessed.

    Phil
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  • RCinFLA
    RCinFLA Solar Expert Posts: 1,484 ✭✭✭✭
    #10
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    You can design mount that will take the winds but you can get creamed anyway by flying debris.

    I had branches from tree bust up my 1" thick cement roof tile during 2005 hurricane season.

    You can design shutters covers just like windows but you might as well take down the panels as go to the hassle of trying to shutter them.
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #11
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?
    RCinFLA wrote: »
    ....

    You can design shutters covers just like windows but you might as well take down the panels as go to the hassle of trying to shutter them.

    Then recharge your cordless tools while you still have power, so you can bolt them back on.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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  • strawbale
    strawbale Solar Expert Posts: 31 ✭✭✭
    #12
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    Other than debris hitting the panels, is the main concern wind getting under them and lifting them off. If so, has anyone tried blocking the wind from getting below them by fastening some kind of "wind ramp" around the edge of the array?

    Strawbale
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  • ggunn
    ggunn Solar Expert Posts: 1,973 ✭✭✭
    #13
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?
    strawbale wrote: »
    Other than debris hitting the panels, is the main concern wind getting under them and lifting them off. If so, has anyone tried blocking the wind from getting below them by fastening some kind of "wind ramp" around the edge of the array?

    Strawbale

    Sunlink routinely does this with their ballasted designs.
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  • solarix
    solarix Solar Expert Posts: 713 ✭✭
    #14
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    I would say the #1 concern is flying debris, #2 is the wind pressure either positive or negative, breaking the modules. Negative pressure or suction / lift can pull modules loose. Doesn't even have to get wind under the modules so blocking the edges will not help. Don't ask how I know.
    Unfortunately, this whole scenario is a bad caveat on coastal located solar.
    As they say, solar is free power, you just have to work like the dickens to collect it.
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  • CVN-71
    CVN-71 Solar Expert Posts: 54 ✭✭
    #15
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    OK, the Hurricane was a bust! Way over hyped. It got a little windy, no more than 20mph. No limbs of trees broken, just a bunch of leaves thrown around. I'm happy that we "survived" the ordeal, never had to tap the battery bank. Lights only flickered a few times, we never even lost power. Funny because we always lose power during regular summer thunderstorms. As a side, I did discover that standard mounts can withstand quite a bit of wind. One even said 120mph. Even with updrafts and negative pressure, etc.
    I'm going to research this a little bit more for the next "big one".
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
    #16
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    Prepare for the worst and pray for the west...

    And don't get cocky "kid".

    About the only thing you can say out here is that earthquakes don't necessarily happen in bad weather.

    -Bill;)
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • halfcrazy
    halfcrazy Solar Expert Posts: 720 ✭✭✭
    #17
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    We are getting 25mph sustained and 50mph gusts here in Maine most of the state is without power. So what to do but watch my Bergey XL1 charging my off-grid battery's through my Classic. Here is a shot at about 28mph
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  • RCinFLA
    RCinFLA Solar Expert Posts: 1,484 ✭✭✭✭
    #18
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    News says about half of Connecticut out of power, about third of Maine, due to trees coming down on power lines. Lots of flooding all around.

    Looks like Irene's track along the coast did a good job on covering the most populous areas with a lot of rain.

    NYC seems to have got lucky.

    If you have PV with GT Inverter and no grid power it really hurts especially with almost immediate sunny day after storm.
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  • bmet
    bmet Solar Expert Posts: 630 ✭✭
    #19
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    exactly,

    Times like that off-gridding isn't quite so expensive after all.
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  • Urbandialect
    Urbandialect Solar Expert Posts: 107 ✭✭✭✭
    #20
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?
    halfcrazy wrote: »
    We are getting 25mph sustained and 50mph gusts here in Maine most of the state is without power. So what to do but watch my Bergey XL1 charging my off-grid battery's through my Classic. Here is a shot at about 28mph

    here in GA we don't get much wind, but we do get wind durning Thunderstorms, and I was thinking of making a wind generator to haverest the winds from the storms that do come threw... 25 to 50 mph sustain winds sounds like alot of power
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  • ggunn
    ggunn Solar Expert Posts: 1,973 ✭✭✭
    #21
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?
    CVN-71 wrote: »
    OK, the Hurricane was a bust! Way over hyped.
    This kind of thinking gets people killed. "The last time I got ordered to evacuate it was for nothing, so next time I am staying put." Famous last words.

    There are tons of examples of this, but the one that sticks in my mind is Hurricane Audrey that hit south Louisiana in June of 1957. Residents of Cameron were tired of evacuating "needlessly" in previous storms, so most folks elected to ride it out. It was a big mistake. Between 500 and 600 people perished in that storm, which was a significant percentage of the population of the area.

    Hurricanes are to a large extent unpredictable, despite the tech we have today. It is a fact of life that in every storm many, sometimes even most, precautions will turn out to have been unnecessary in retrospect. Call it "hype" if you wish, but I believe it is more properly termed "prudence".
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  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    #22
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    Re: What to do for Hurricane winds?

    my 2 cents on this comment,
    "OK, the Hurricane was a bust! Way over hyped."

    keep in mind this is not about the member who made the comment because i'm sure many others may think the same. also, do not take offense to my comments as they can seem blunt or callous to some as it is not meant to be.

    if officials or the nwa don't get it exactly right would not be surprising, but would the 20+ victims in the u.s. of this hurricane say the same thing as the quote if given the opportunity to come back and make a comment on this? it is not hype to the ones killed, hurt, or displaced by it. exactly what will happen isn't an exact science. some may have been saying it is a doomsday scenario, but odds are they were politicians or newspeople as a weatherman would say a potential doomsday scenario for some in a certain area so many percent of the time.:roll: as goofy as this sounds it is better to give it this way as one can then gauge it on odds, but know it won't be without a chance yea or nay. yes, i was tempted to say the sky is falling, but let's face it, during a hurricane the sky is falling.:p

    as an example, many people don't take lightning lightly, and they shouldn't, but do we say the storms are overly rated and back off of our protections we have employed? then if one is off in a valley (akin to being outside of the predicted worst case path of a hurricane) do we say the lightning can't or won't touch or affect us? that kind of thinking can be a very fatal mistake.

    now the deaths that occurred you might say are varied and not because they got blown away by the hurricane. the conditions and circumstances that the hurricane introduced can force a person into a scenario and die whereas it's conceivable that they otherwise might not have. heart attacks, car accidents, floods, trees and their limbs falling, or even the panic introduced by those fleeing a danger area are just some that are attributable to it. it could even be somebody who needs a piece of medical equipment they plug into the wall for their survival. these things can happen day to day from other circumstances, but if it is the hurricane that introduced the circumstances then they died as a result of it and obviously they were not taking all of the precautions they should have because they thought that the odds were it would be overblown hype or would somehow never touch them and they take their chances.

    i could go on, but i think everybody gets the idea of what i'm conveying here. i'll summarize my thoughts here. to you they may be saying the sky is falling or it's doomsday or whatever, but keep in mind that as implausible as it seems it is possible that it is true or at least true for you. never take the possibility their warnings are not applicable to you because they say it all of the time or it is rare or you just think things like that can't happen to you or you are special. i site the stupidity of those that were rescued in the waters off of new york city as that type of thinking and they put those rescuers in danger too.:cry:
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