Perhaps a glossary of terms?

I can't help but notice that quite a few people, especially but not solely newcomers, get confused by the ocean full of terms used on this forum. Most people can handle Volts, Amps, and Watts (although may not understand the relationship between same) but stumble over other terms including device names (confusing a charge controller with a battery charger or inverter/charger for instance). This gets worse when we fall into the habit of using abbreviations for expediency's sake: half the time "SG" means "Specific Gravity" and half the time it's "Solar Guppy, tech expert". :D

Just tossing out a suggestion for Windsun, Niel, and Bill. Maybe it could be tucked under the FAQ if possible.
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Comments

  • mike95490mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,571 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?
    (confusing a charge controller with a battery charger or inverter/charger for instance).


    It's a converter ! I have a converter in my RV, and I plug a cord into it. The lights are dim, whats wrong.

    A. Take off your sunglasses indoors
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

  • nigtomdawnigtomdaw Solar Expert Posts: 705 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Marc u have a point but who will take the challenge and write such a explanation ru volunteering.??? b... if so you have my vote.....but although SG (guppy) may like it I doubt it will travel across the Atlantic well, Henry may dissagree.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    something like that would be nice and it could be placed into what i just proposed here:
    http://forum.solar-electric.com/showthread.php?p=39014#post39014
    technically we could all work on it right here if you would like and when done we could sticky it somewhere. if need be we'd cut the chit chat from it to give just the facts or pertinent info we want on it.
  • westbranchwestbranch Solar Expert Posts: 5,183 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Neil, I vote for your idea as long as it could be parsed every week or so, so that it stays short.

    Coot's topic's a good one; Glossary of terms

    Eric
     
    KID #51B  4s 140W to 24V 900Ah C&D AGM
    CL#29032 FW 2126/ 2073/ 2133 175A E-Panel WBjr, 3 x 4s 140W to 24V 900Ah C&D AGM 
    Cotek ST1500W 24V Inverter,OmniCharge 3024,
    2 x Cisco WRT54GL i/c DD-WRT Rtr & Bridge,
    Eu3/2/1000i Gens, 1680W & E-Panel/WBjr to come, CL #647 asleep
    West Chilcotin, BC, Canada
  • PhotowhitPhotowhit Solar Expert Posts: 5,804 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?
    nigtomdaw wrote: »
    Marc u have a point but who will take the challenge and write such a explanation ru volunteering.??? b... if so you have my vote.....but although SG (guppy) may like it I doubt it will travel across the Atlantic well, Henry may dissagree.

    I think it's a great idea!

    I'd say everyone contibutes and the moderators edit and place in glossary. I've done a few, and had done several in the New Solar section of the forum I use to contribute to.
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
  • D.I.M.1D.I.M.1 Solar Expert Posts: 59 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    I also agree with the installment of a glossary for each general topic, forum, or one mass glossary. It would help people like me who have only a minor understanding of everything on this forum.

    I'm not sure I have the right to but I'll try to make one and then upload it onto this thread and maybe then whoever oversees this place could place onto the site. I will try to work on it when I can, but also contributions could be made by posting words and their definitions as shown below:
    word-(definition)

    If you don't know a word just post it and me or someone else will look into it.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    So far nothing has been done with this. Partly because the idiot who came up with the idea (me) hasn't made any effort. Mostly because the people who know the terms & their meanings can't get to grips on what those who don't need explained. There's a tendency to think "everybody knows that" - when they don't. :blush:

    Do we start with the very basic Volt/Amp/Watt/Ohm stuff?
    Do we start with the endless list of abbreviations? (PV, DOD, A/hr, et cetera).

    I'd like to hear from some "newbies" on this: what explanation of terms would be of the most benefit?
  • D.I.M.1D.I.M.1 Solar Expert Posts: 59 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    For terminology of units of any kind I think it would look best like this:
    Volts(V)- I can't remember the definition
    that would be the general idea
    All definitions would be fine but I have no idea if this is actually going to happen.
  • WilisWilis Solar Expert Posts: 84 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Being very new-I would like to see the list start with solar terms. Some have been working with electrical and electronics much longer then solar. This would make the project easier and might help get it started. Wil
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Glossary of Terms project

    The definitions used in this glossary are to be correct as the terms are understood and used in the field of electronics (with respect to Renewable Energy) and on this forum. They are not technically detailed, as the aim is mainly to help newcomers understand the common use of the terminology and abbreviations.

    Starting with "charge sources" and continuing though the circuitry to usable end power ...

    AGM: Absorbed Glass Mat. Also sometimes called 'starved electrolyte'. A type of lead-acid battery whose electrolyte is contained within a glass mat. It is therefor an SLA, but not an FLA.
    Amp Hour (Amp/hr or Ah): The current potential of a battery or battery bank in reference to an hour. Usually measured by the "20 hour rate" standard.
    Array or PV Array: A group of two or more PV's connected in series or parallel for additional Voltage or Amperage.
    Battery Bank: A group of two or more batteries connected in series and or parallel to increase Voltage or Amp Hour capacity. See also: http://www.windsun.com/Batteries/Battery_FAQ.htm
    Battery Meter or Battery Monitor: A device for measure the charge state of the battery as best possible based on Voltage levels and current flow in and out of the battery.
    Charge Controller (CC): An electronic regulator for controlling/converting array output to charge batteries. See also: http://www.windsun.com/ChargeControls/ChargeCont.htm
    Deep Cycle: Battery capable of being repeatedly drawn down 50%-80% of charge and re-charged to ~100%.
    Depth Of Discharge (DOD): Amount of power drained from a battery during usage and expressed as a percentage of the battery's total capacity adding that it is the reciprocal of SOC. 100% DOD = DEAD, 0% DOD = FULL.
    Electrolyte: Conductive fluid in a battery. It is comprised mainly of sulfuric acid.
    FLA: Flooded Lead Acid. Generic term for 'wet cell' batteries. On this Forum, usually refers to Deep Cycle cells suitable for Renewable Energy.
    Gel or Gel Cell: A type of battery whose electrolyte is contained in a gelatinous substance.
    Grid: The distribution network for utility supplied power. Usually in reference to Grid-Tie.
    Grid-Tie Inverter (GT): As defined for inverter, but specifically designed to feed AC to an active utility grid. Some versions also have battery back-up capability.
    HAWT: Horizontal Axis Wind Turbine.
    Hydrometer: A device for measuring the Specific Gravity (SG) of a fluid, as in battery electrolyte.
    Inverter: A device for changing DC Voltage into AC Voltage. See also: http://www.solar-electric.com/solar_inverters/inverters_for_solar_electric.htm
    Inverter/charger: As defined for Inverter, but with utility or generator input for a built-in supplemental battery charger.
    Load: On this forum, a reference to 'end use' devices such as lights, refrigerators, et cetera. Anything that consumes electrical power.
    Micro-hydro or Micro-hydro Turbine: Electro-mechanical device for generating electricity from flowing water.
    MPPT: Maximum Power Point Tracking. A type of Charge Controller method that adjusts its output to achieve the most efficient charge rate possible from varying input Voltage. Some are able to change the higher PV Voltage into a lower System Voltage we refer to as down-converting.
    MSW: Modified Sine Wave. Correctly, Modified Square Wave. Refers to an inverter whose output waveform is incremental square-wave 'steps' that 'mimic' a sine wave. While usually less expensive than Sine Wave inverters, they have limitations in that some devices do not work properly or at all. Some refer to these Sine Wave inverters as True Sine Wave (TSW) or Pure Sine Wave (PSW), but that is a bit of a misnomer as the waveform is not true or pure.
    Power Factor (PF): The ratio of real power (Watts) to apparent power (Volt-Amperes). PF = W/V-A. Although important to the efficiency of a load (and thus to conservation) this information is rarely included in manufacturer's specifications and must be measured by the user. Loads of a purely resistive type (heaters, incandescent bulbs) will have a PF of 1.0. Loads that include inductive or capacitive elements will have a lower PF.
    PV: Photovoltaic (electric solar panel). Converts sunlight into electricity.
    PWM: Pulse Width Modulation. A type of Charge Controller method that 'pulses' its output as needed to charge and then maintain battery Voltage.
    Renewable Energy (RE): A reference to natural sources of power that are non-polluting in the act of generating the power.
    RV/Marine "Deep Cycle": A 'hybrid' battery design whose plates are a combination of the thick 'true' Deep Cycle and the more porous SLI type. Not the best choice for Renewable Energy applications, but better than an SLI.
    Shunt: A device with known, fixed, temperature-stable resistance wired in series between batteries and inverter to facilitate the use of a Battery Meter. It allows a small, proportional amount of current to flow through the meter, enabling it to register the total current flowing to or from the batteries.
    SLA: Sealed Lead Acid. As FLA, but without the ability to open and inspect cells through 'caps'. Technically, AGM's are a type of SLA.
    SLI: Starting, Lighting, and Ignition. Standard 'automotive' type battery. Not really suitable for Renewable Energy use.
    State Of Charge (SOC): Amount of power available from a battery at any given point in its usage cycle and expressed as a percentage of the battery's total capacity adding that it is the reciprocal of DOD. 100% SOC = FULL, 0% SOC = DEAD.
    Sine Wave: aka, TSW and PSW. Refers to an inverter whose output waveform is close to that of an ideal sine wave by having its total harmonic distortion under 5%, the same as found on utility grid power or from a generator.
    Tracker, Solar Tracker, or Tracking Mount: a mounting for a PV Array which 'follows the sun', keeping the array in best possible alignment with solar radiation. There are two basic types: single axis, which follows the sun's movement through the day, and dual axis, which also adjusts for different angles per the time of year.
    Tubular Plate Battery: Deep cycle battery used chiefly in Europe for renewable energy and backup applications. For stationary applications, if the batteries are of the flooded lead acid type, they are called "OPzS", while VRLA versions are called "OPzV". When used in forklifts and other mobile applications the batteries are called "PzS".
    VAWT: Vertical Axis Wind Turbine.
    Vmp: Voltage at Maximum Power. The output Voltage of a PV when it is at its maximum current.
    Voc: Voltage Open Circuit. The output Voltage of a PV under no load.
    VRLA: Valve Regulated Lead-Acid. A type of SLA.
    Wind Generator or Wind Turbine: Electro-mechanical device for generating electricity from moving air current.

    This could, of course, be more detailed and formatted differently. Would it be better arranged alphabetically?

    Please do suggest/request additional terms and/or further clarification. But remember, we're trying to keep this somewhat shorter than Tolstoy's "War And Peace"! :p

    Are we going to include basic electrical terms such as Volt, Amp, Watt, and Ohm? I think this is a bit too basic, as anyone with a dictionary should be able to find the definition of these.
    Are we going to include other abbreviations such as CFL, LED, and LCD?

    Addition suggestions can be PM'ed to me. (I think I have that working now!:blush:)
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    keep going with it marc and put it in your same post to condense looking for it. i tweaked a few of them that you gave and other input can be mentioned so we can modify it in your post. same goes for new definitions as bb, marc, and myself can transfer it to marc's original definitions post. once we get enough of them we can put it into a sticky in our new links and info thread. future terms can still be brought up here or there, but we will try to condense posts there so as to not over comment the thread to death.
  • D.I.M.1D.I.M.1 Solar Expert Posts: 59 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    How's this going to work?
    Whose going to oversee this and organize this?

    I'll volunteer if no one else wants it but I cant' say I'll be efficient or fast about working on this since I also got school work.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?
    D.I.M.1 wrote: »
    How's this going to work?
    Whose going to oversee this and organize this?

    I'll volunteer if no one else wants it but I cant' say I'll be efficient or fast about working on this since I also got school work.

    I've been volunteered, it seems. By myself! :p With the help of Moderators Bill & Neil we can piece this thing together.

    What we need from everyone else is suggestions for what needs defining (we don't want to get too much in here, like defining 'wire'). And feed-back on whether or not it makes sense (it's sometimes difficult to explain things you already understand yourself - your own words might not be clear to someone else).

    It's up for additions, refinements, and corrections!
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?
    D.I.M.1 wrote: »
    How's this going to work?
    Whose going to oversee this and organize this?

    I'll volunteer if no one else wants it but I cant' say I'll be efficient or fast about working on this since I also got school work.

    it will work by anyone defining a term and input from others on it may modify it. from there it will go to the original post that cariboocoot made or if we have the sticky it will go into that new thread for the terms as comments can then be kept to a minimum on the glossary.
    windsun, bb, and myself can oversee and organize this into its proper thread and we can make any modifications to it if needed.
    your part if you choose to take it would be by selecting some terms to give definitions to.
    i also may think that like a dictionary allows further descriptive sentences that we could also adlib by descriptiveness beyond the definition and that could even be pictures or diagrams in some cases.
  • D.I.M.1D.I.M.1 Solar Expert Posts: 59 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Well some terms that I would liked to have known before, and then wouldn't have started some unnecessary threads would be:
    Grid Solar power
    Off-Grid Solar power
    Terms I kind of understand but cant really define would be:
    Turbine
    Fan
    Voltage(V)
    Current(I)
    Resistance(Ohms)
  • bryanlbryanl Solar Expert Posts: 175 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Neil suggested this thread for glossary entries related to grounding.

    From the list provided here, though, I would first make a suggestion: tie your definitions to something measurable or observable if they are of that type. I am looking at the 'deep cycle battery' terms as an example. I get burned something fierce when I suggest examining that one objectively.

    The precision and the accuracy of any measure must be clear in any definition based upon it.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?
    bryanl wrote: »
    The precision and the accuracy of any measure must be clear in any definition based upon it.

    All measurement systems are arbitrary standards applied by common agreement. They are only accurate with respects to other arbitrary measurement. This includes 'time'. For example, over the years, the 'definition' of a meter and of a kilogram have both changed. If you look up 'horsepower' you will find several definitions and standards.

    I have no intention of bringing manufacturers' claims into the glossary, nor providing endless caveats in respect to the potential mis-use of the terms.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,601 admin
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    DIM1,

    Some of the "real" definitions are not really understandable or practical in day to day life... For Example, current, or the unit of current "Ampere":
    The ampere (symbol: A) is the SI unit of electric current.[1] The ampere, in practice often shortened to amp, is an SI base unit, and is named after André-Marie Ampère, one of the main discoverers of electromagnetism.

    In practical terms, the ampere is a measure of the amount of electric charge passing a point per unit time. Around 6.242 × 1018 electrons passing a given point each second constitutes one ampere.[2] (Since electrons have negative charge, they flow in the opposite direction to the conventional current.)
    Things like Volts, Amps, Resistance can be compared to other things--like water:

    Volts--electrical pressure
    Amps--electrical flow or (volume per second)
    Resistance--resistance to flow (restriction to flow)

    But what is really needed to understand how to use the terms in a practical manner is to understand the mathmatical relationships between them...

    V=I/R
    P=I*V
    Work=P*Time=Power (Watt) * Hours = Watt*Hours...
    Etc.

    Here is a Electricity for Boaters link -- Close enough for Solar RE (off Grid) type folks to understand the basics of electrical power.

    Unfortunately, many of the basics for solar power really require a rough understanding of the math behind the concepts to do things safely (using the correct size wire, correct fuses/breakers/switches, understand how energy flows, the relationship between power and work, etc.).

    It is not that difficult to gain the knowledge--but it is hard to do it in a haphazard listing of definitions and links...

    We are more than happy to answer specific questions (if I have 100 watts of solar panel in San Francisco, how long can I power my 7" LCD in an emergency and how big a battery shall I get)... But, if you are interested in designing your own integrated system (solar yacht for example)--there is little we can do to help you buy answering "small questions" here and there... At best, we are probably confusing and frustrating the heck out of you.

    If you can take some electrical / mechanical / engineering / science classes -- that will go a long way to giving you the tools to make the first cut decisions about your own designs -- what is possible and what is not...

    Very sincerely,
    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    bill,
    i was thinking the same thing when it comes to volts and amps. those definitions would seemingly confuse more than answer, but the water analogy is a good one sufficient enough for purposes here i would think.
    check these for definitions.
    current-the volume of electricity and one of the components that make up the power in watts.
    voltage-the pressure of electricity and one of the components that make up the power in watts.
    i thought the wattage reference important because power doesn't exist without both of them.
    thoughts?
  • bryanlbryanl Solar Expert Posts: 175 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?
    All measurement systems are arbitrary standards applied by common agreement. They are only accurate with respects to other arbitrary measurement. ... I have no intention of bringing manufacturers' claims into the glossary, nor providing endless caveats
    this is what happens ...

    now, if the goal is to actually learn something rather than argue about things, consider these ideas:

    A standard is one thing. Accuracy is another. Precision is a third. Standards for RE or RV needs are well enough defined. Accuracy when it comes to lead acid batteries is very poor (many factors have variances of up to 20%), and instrument precision is now inexpensive for many measures.

    When it comes to volts, amps, and so on, the critical issue is to make the distinction between what is being measured and the units used to measure it (then you can get into how it is measured). For instance, energy is the ability to do work and is measured in joules; power is the rate at which is energy is moved from one place to another and is measured in watts; current is the flow of electricity and is measured in amps; voltage is the push that moves electricity and it is measured in volts; resistance impedes the flow of electricity and is measured in ohms; and so on.

    What makes high school physics hard is that these ideas are not as easy to understand properly as they may appear. The lack of understanding is why I get responses such as I quoted above and why bad decisions are sometimes made.

    The idea of a glossary is somewhat deceiving, I think. To use a glossary effectively, you have to already have a pretty good basis of understanding about the context. When you start talking about the water analogy for electricity, for example, you are out of the glossary regime and into the tutorial regime.

    I have seen the efforts to try to make concepts and abstract knowledge concrete and specific. These efforts often come down to trying to program a human is if he was a computer. One text for Algebra was exactly this (and there are computer programs that do algebraic manipulation, too). Students using that text could solve problems but many did not understand algebra.

    Amateur radio is another case in point. Since the 70's, license education has changed to training and now is even more a perfunctory memorizing of specific questions. The questions are the glossary terms and the answers the definitions. Passing a test requires no knowledge to speak of, just the ability to remember the steps in the 'computer' program.

    So a first step is to define the objectives. If it is a glossary, then simple and specific definitions are needed. If it is a tutorial guide, then you can get into concepts, abstractions and analogies. Figure out what is really needed and what the 'consumer' will actually use. My guess is that the consumer has his problems because he has no interest in purchasing what is needed to solve them. That should be a clue about where effort would be best spent, I think.

    Sorry, Niel for mispelling the name earlier. I know about getting i's and e's backwords in names!
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,601 admin
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Bryanl,

    I think what Marc was trying to avoid are the arguments of what device is best, or what is a deep cycle vs RV vs car battery is, etc... That the definitions should be simple and straight forward (sometimes "useful definitions" simplify to the point where they can almost be technically incorrect--but do a good enough job of getting the point across--such as comparing the properties of electricity to those of water).

    Many times, tests of knowledge (such as those for the old HAM licenses) were really a from of social engineering (in my humble opinion)... If somebody took all of that time and energy to learn the subject--then they would treat their license well and not do "stupid" or "illegal" things under threat of losing the license--and keep the total number of users down where too many users could make the limited frequency allocations useless with clutter (for example CB where people tell porn and put 1kW linear amplifiers on 3-5 watt legal limit sets because they don't care).

    Of course here, the idea is to help people use solar--not to make them go through some sort of right a passage before they are "allowed" to install a solar system/do conservation.

    In reality--we also have those requirements that must be met... Safety is the big one (dangerous electrical power levels, chemical reactors filled with sulfuric acid that emit hydrogen gas, dams that can fail, wind turbines that can fall off towers, etc.). So, having codes, licensed electricians, building inspectors, engineers etc. are all still necessary here too--to reduce the hazards associated with the solar RE systems.

    The "dictionary" here--is probably going to be of the entry level form... And not of the technically complete model. One people understand the basics--then they can search elsewhere for the details (or open a thread and have a discussion).

    My 2 cents worth.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    contrary to what you think, anybody who looks up a word is looking to be educated to one degree or another and a small degree of education is warranted. we don't propose to be that exacting, but to just give enough for a general understanding. i suppose we will need a disclaimer in our glossary that aspects may not be true to exacting definitions and could have some inadequacies.
  • bryanlbryanl Solar Expert Posts: 175 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    re "I think what Marc was trying to avoid are the arguments of what device is best, or what is a deep cycle vs RV vs car battery is, etc... That the definitions should be simple and straight forward" --
    The way to do this is to provide unambiguous definitions that are fundamentally truthful. That is, there is some measure that will show the distinctions you are trying to make.

    re "contrary to what you think, anybody who looks up a word is looking to be educated to one degree or another and a small degree of education is warranted" - well, thanks for the insult, I guess. But wouldn't it really be better to try to understand the point I was making rather than create your own?

    I tried to provide advice based on experience and expertise. I am sorry it was not in line with what you wanted to hear.
  • stephendvstephendv Solar Expert Posts: 1,571 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?
    • OPzS battery - Ortsfeste Panzerplatte Spezial, Stationary Tubular Plate Special Batteries. Flooded lead acid batteries used for deep cycle applications. Often sold in 2V cells.
    • OPzV battery - Ortsfeste Panzerplatte Verschlossen, Stationary Tubular Plate Sealed Batteries. VRLA sealed batteries used for deep cycle applications such as backup and renewable energy.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    stephendv,
    these terms i have never encountered at least in the form i see it and i'm sure most have not and i don't see the relevance in putting them into the glossary at this point.
  • stephendvstephendv Solar Expert Posts: 1,571 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Hi Neil,

    The terms are in common use in Europe, although they're German in origin, they're used all over, UK, Spain and the rest of the continent. They're a standard type of deep cycle battery technology rather than a brand name. A few examples:
    Perhaps the definitions would be clearer without the German?

    Stephen
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    "Tubular plate" sounds like Optimas to me.
  • stephendvstephendv Solar Expert Posts: 1,571 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?
    "Tubular plate" sounds like Optimas to me.
    The Optimas appear to be more a leasure type battery - the OPzS are heavy duty deep cycle with typically 3000 cycles @ 50% DoD. There's some more detail on the tubular plate design here: http://books.google.es/books?id=fMo3jJZDkpUC&pg=PA302&lpg=PA302&dq=opzs+tubular+plate&source=bl&ots=gr8xuLuPkU&sig=qJDDpx_51Zm-3H48PqM2t7kJTmU&hl=en&ei=eV7SSqTYBsiv4Qb8jpX8Ag&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CA0Q6AEwAQ

    Manufacturers include: BAE, Enersys, Hawker, Hoppecke, Exide, Victron, FIAMM, TAB.

    The exact same design is used for modern forklift batteries. A google for "tubular plate battery" throws up quite a few papers.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Yes, this one was interesting: http://www.battcon.com/PapersFinal2006/RuschPaper2006.pdf

    Perhaps we should include the more generic term "tubular plate battery"?
  • stephendvstephendv Solar Expert Posts: 1,571 ✭✭
    Re: Perhaps a glossary of terms?

    Ok, how about:
    • Tubular Plate Battery: Deep cycle battery used for renewable energy and backup applications. For stationary applications, if the batteries are of the flooded lead acid type, they are called "OPzS", while VRLA versions are called "OPzV". When used in forklifts and other mobile applications the batteries are called "PzS".

    I think it will be useful to keep the OPzS and OPzV in there somewhere, because that's the term manufacturers and retailers use. For example, these online stores:
    - http://www.shop.solar-wind.co.uk/acatalog/exide_classic_battery_deep_cycle.html
    - http://www.teknosolar.com/batteries-stationary-batteries-c-31_73.html?osCsid=72cfe296163bac16d69b9a3e24db89a7
    - http://www.spanishsolar.com/batteries/show.php?id=12
    - http://www.mysolarshop.co.uk/batteries-accessories-hoppecke-batteries-c-21_27_82.html
    - etc.
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