Outback FX-series vs FXR-Series?

2twisty2twisty Solar Expert Posts: 199 ✭✭✭
I just ordered a VFXR3648 to replace the VFX3648 that suddenly stopped working saturday.  I plan to repair the VFX, but in the interest of getting the power back online right away, I ordered a replacement.

I consoled myself by saying, "once I repair this, I will be able to stack them and make 240 split phase."

Today I find out that the FXR manual says that I can't stack with FX! 

Is there an upgrade path for the FX to FXR so that I can stack them?

I can't find anything useful on Outback's web site, nor can I find any documentation that details the differences between the FX and FXR series units.

Please advise.

Comments

  • EstragonEstragon Registered Users Posts: 3,967 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Reading the sell sheet and manual, it's not entirely clear to me the fxr does split phase at all, even with another fxr. It mentions using up to none for 3-phase, but I didn't see anything explicitly about stacking for split phase.

    Maybe ask them directly?
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
  • 2twisty2twisty Solar Expert Posts: 199 ✭✭✭
    I've got a call into them and a support ticket.  No response yet.

    Since the chassis of the FX and the FXR are identical, I am hoping that I might be able to purchase the parts to convert my FX to an FXR so I can stack them.  Selling the FX and buying another FXR might cost me about the same, too.  

    Oh, and today I discovered that the FXR is incompatible with the MATE, so I had to drop another $430 on a Mate3.
  • bill von novakbill von novak Solar Expert Posts: 850 ✭✭✭✭
    Estragon said:
    Reading the sell sheet and manual, it's not entirely clear to me the fxr does split phase at all, even with another fxr. It mentions using up to none for 3-phase, but I didn't see anything explicitly about stacking for split phase.
    From a blurb from AltE:
    ============
    Multiple FXR inverter/chargers can be stacked for split and 3-phase systems. Up to nine inverters can be wired together for a 3-phase system with all voltage models, three inverters per phase. Split phase 240V can be created with the 24V and 48V models, to create up to a 36kW inverter (120V A) or 30kW (230V E).
    ============
  • 2twisty2twisty Solar Expert Posts: 199 ✭✭✭
    From reading in some manuals, it appears that the control and FET boards are different between FX and FXR.  Now, to find out if the AC board is different, and what are the costs of the boards vs selling the FX and buying another FXR.

    Outback seems to think that resale on FX is decent since there may be people out there with existing FX infrastructure that want another FX and don't want to pay to replace all their inverters.
  • EstragonEstragon Registered Users Posts: 3,967 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Good to know. I though it would be pretty weird to not support stacking for split phase.
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
  • 2twisty2twisty Solar Expert Posts: 199 ✭✭✭
    Estragon said:
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
    Can you send me pics or a diagram of how you have the autotransformer wired up to make the 120v output of your inverter into 240 split phase?  I've looked at some diagrams but it's not abundantly clear.  Maybe seeing how someone actually implemented it will help.

    If I can't get into abother FXR to go split phase, I'll do it with a transformer.
  • mike95490mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 8,380 ✭✭✭✭✭
    2twisty said:
    Can you send me pics or a diagram of how you have the autotransformer wired up to make the 120v output of your inverter into 240 split phase?  I've looked at some diagrams but it's not abundantly clear.  Maybe seeing how someone actually implemented it will help.
    If I can't get into abother FXR to go split phase, I'll do it with a transformer.
    What are the loads you are trying to power ? It might be a cheap transformer (2000VA) or expensive (8000VA) and will the heavy load be intermittent, or 10+ minutes at a time ?  (time % at high power influences the transformer requirement)
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

  • EstragonEstragon Registered Users Posts: 3,967 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Mine powers a 240v submersible pump, my only 240v load.

    I have a pair of Outbacks stacked for parallel 120v. One spends the vast majority of its existence sleeping, mainly there just in case multiple big loads come on at once (visitors do dumb things at inconvenient times). They feed a panel with bigger/non-essential loads, and optionally a smaller/essential loads panel.

    IIRC, the wiring was fairly straightforward. (fairly heavy, 8 or 10ga, I think) 120v hot/neutral/ground in from the big load panel, and 240v L1/L2/ground out to the pump switch. If you end up going that route and aren't sure hooking it up, I can open it up to confirm connections.
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
  • bill von novakbill von novak Solar Expert Posts: 850 ✭✭✭✭
    2twisty said:
    Estragon said:
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
    Can you send me pics or a diagram of how you have the autotransformer wired up to make the 120v output of your inverter into 240 split phase?  I've looked at some diagrams but it's not abundantly clear.  Maybe seeing how someone actually implemented it will help.

    If I can't get into abother FXR to go split phase, I'll do it with a transformer.
    A "true" autotransformer has three wires coming out - 120V, common or neutral, and 240 volts.  Most ones for sale out there have two windings and thus you get four wires.  One winding goes to 120V and neutral, the other winding goes to neutral and gives you one free end.  The free end is the opposite-phase 120 volts (so that to the other 120V gives you 240V.)

    In two-winding transformers (most of them) it's possible to get the winding direction backwards.  If that happens, you will measure 0 volts between the two 120 volt windings.  In that case reverse one winding.
  • 2twisty2twisty Solar Expert Posts: 199 ✭✭✭
    I plan to buy the Outback transformer that's not in a case and mount it to a wall.

    https://www.solar-electric.com/x-240.html

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