My battery soc

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  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    I am willing to take them down and lower then they get now and then recharge with no loads although on sunny days after a day like today I should get 5 or six hours of absorb even with loads as long as I go hit the force bulk after the first four hour absorb.
    Thanks
    gww
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    At around 48 volts or a bit above in the mornings the batterys sg was 1.222 before the sun comes out.
    That was the last time I checked it about a week ago.
    Thanks
    gww

    The battery manufactuer says 1.170 is 80 percent discharge and 1.140 is 100 percent. What percent is 1.220?
  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    I think you need to collate two things to see if they match, Volts per cell and the SG level. At 48 volts or 2v per cell and a SG level per cell it'd be around 60% soc.

    http://support.rollsbattery.com/support/articles/430-corrective-equalization-

    This a Industrial Battery chart with 1.280 electrolyte as you have. This one is easy to read ( 10% resolution ), again you can Google 100's of them.

    Attachment not found.
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    This from gb's web site. however what do you trust. on the website it says eq after every ten charges but the paper sent with the battery says every 5. The paper with the battery says 1.170 is eighty percent discharge and 1.140 is 100 pecent discharge. One place says don't cycle below 40 percent charge and another says take it to 80 percent discharge even if it takes a couple days before charging.

    100% Charged = 1.285 - 1.290 Sp. Gr.
    75% Charged = 1.240 - 1.245 Sp. Gr.
    50% Charged = 1.195 - 1.200 Sp. Gr.
    25% Charged = 1.150 - 1.155 Sp. Gr.
    0% Charged = 1.115 - 1.120 Sp. Gr.

    State of Charge
    12 Volt battery
    Volts per Cell

    100%
    12.7
    2.12

    90%
    12.5
    2.08

    80%
    12.42
    2.07

    70%
    12.32
    2.05

    60%
    12.20
    2.03

    50%
    12.06
    2.01

    40%
    11.9
    1.98

    30%
    11.75
    1.96

    20%
    11.58
    1.93

    10%
    11.31
    1.89

    0
    10.5
    1.75

    more later.
    cheers
    gww
  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    There is your answer, listen to GB and do your thing. You and Coot seem to have a plan, if it doesn't work out then, I guess you'll have to try something else. I know what I'd be doing, but you don't need my $.02.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc
    There is your answer, listen to GB and do your thing. You and Coot seem to have a plan, if it doesn't work out then, I guess you'll have to try something else. I know what I'd be doing, but you don't need my $.02.

    Yes we do. :D
    Different POV of the same problem can sometimes see the detail another missed.

    From what I saw of gww1's SG readings there were no glaring faults anywhere. Any given hydrometer/reading may have a variance that would appear as 0.010 difference and his readings barely show that.

    Temperature compensation (higher electrolyte temp = lower density = lower than real SG) may account for non-matching numbers, but really it is a significant difference between one cell and another that indicates a problem.

    It could well be that this battery has simply lost 10% capacity due to the inaccurate commission charging. It may come back or not, or there may not actually be anything to recover.
  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    I agree, I don't see that much of a problem. I believe with the HBX Mode activated, I can't see how you could ever drop to 45V if it was set correctly. With a Grid connection and some massaged settings it should take care of itself. That is what Grid-Zero is about, but you have to get the settings right. You can always lower them at the expense of the battery if you consider it expendable. A lot would probably correct it's self overtime with the proper absorbs and cycling.


    I have watched Industrial Battery service techs, what I saw them do is take a piece on masking tape and mark the 6 lowest cells SG level and then hammer it at 62v on a 48v battery for as long as it takes. They would check the SG every 30 minutes on those cells and look for a rise, as long as they were getting a rise they would keep on going. Yes, you need to monitor the temperatures and keep them below 115f - 125f. Even the Rolls - Surrette white paper recommends 3 hours after no rise as a stopping point on the lowest cell. This battery has 25" ? tall cells and at least .250 thick plates and will take a lot before you could cause any damage. Part of the issue here is the fact the these batteries have almost No electrolyte reserve and that has to be taken into account on any SG readings you take if you have to keep adding water. Any hard sulfate is really hard to break up and cleaning of the pores is even harder. Soft Sulfate on the other hand is easy on a daily basis to remove.

    I am sure it is possible to have a cell that will never come up. There are two ways to look at it, either live with it, raise the electrolyte concentration or drill it out and insert a new cell. If the voltage is good on it, ignore it. If it's shorted, then it's got be removed and replaced.


    I did have issues that I created for myself because I didn't realize the amount of cycles that it would form the plates ( 100 Cycles ) because I lacked the experience with new Industrial batteries. Even though I recognized that something loony was going on right away because I had Voltage but I couldn't get the SG level to match.

    Another thing already mentioned is that having a variable output power supply is almost a necessity to work on these voltage range cells.
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    coot
    The 9-23-2013 charge and eq was before adding loads. So you believe it was not an good enough commision charge? I never was sure but the morning after the battery rested all night and I got the good readings on the 4 cells I checked I thought I had it wupped. Perhaps I got lazy when I didn't check the sg of all the cells. I had checked every cell every hour untill that point and was so happy to see those readings that I guess I got lazy. I was using 57 volts absorb and around 62 volts eq. Now 61.2 absorb and 63.2 eq.

    voltage resting for atleast three hours
    100% 50.8

    90% 50

    80% 49.68

    70% 49.28

    60% 48.8

    50% 48.24

    40% 47.6

    30% 47

    20% 46.32

    10% 45.24

    0% 42

    When we discussed my low voltage disconnect being at 44.8 they had to have ment underload. (battery guys)

    So if I draw the battery down to 47 prior to recharging is that a safer bet then going to 45? Two do I want to use the sun with no loads and then extend with the grid and do a bulk full absorb and eq?

    I have my eq set higher per discussions with battery maker. On their web site they consider an eq cycle to be three hours longer then a normal charge at the same voltage.

    No sun again today I think photowhit jinxed us by mentioning sun today.

    The way the web site mentions full charge when they say it is between 1.285 and 1.295 almost leads me to believe they expect some discrepancy between cells. My first spot check of four cells at 1.285 and 1.295 made me believe some was normal.

    I use a extech optical hydro meter. It is much easyer to read then the squeeze ball one.

    Go with the plan of discharge and charge? What do I want to look for while doing it? How will I know when I am going to far and when I am making progress or not? Did I do the commissioning charge incorrectly?
    Thanks
    gww

    PS I have not started yet cause I wanted to start with a fairly charge battery cause it sit a bit at mid charge.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Problem with commission charges: companies never tell you how to do it. They tend to leave out key details like "do this 100 times before battery reaches full capacity". A few deep cycles/recharges simply may not be enough to bring the battery up.

    Another problem is that 10 day interval between grid charges. If the solar recharging is for any reason inadequate in that time the batteries may be spending too long below sulphating levels. For example the last three days of every 10 might be <75% SOC or some combination over five of the days that has a similar net result. Multiply by one year of use and you will have diminished capacity as a result of hard sulphation.

    You've got two conflicting processes to deal with as well: for getting the battery up to its full capacity you want the deep (80%) discharge and then full recharge cycling. For ordinary day-to-day operation you don't want it. So go with some deep cycling for a week and see if there is any improvement to how well it stands up to use. Don't expect much change in SG variations; I really don't think there's a problem there at this point. Capacity seems to be less than expected though. In ordinary use you should be able to cycle 40% or about 15kW hours daily average. If the PV can not make up for this then you will be drawing from the grid to compensate for the deficit. In theory this should work well enough that only once a month would an EQ cycle be necessary to bring up any cells that are "slipping".
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Blackcherry
    Another thing already mentioned is that having a variable output power supply is almost a necessity to work on these voltage range cells
    .
    I am not sure about what this is.

    My poblim was not going three hours past the sg leveling it was more one of trust. Did I trust my temp equiptment. Sears clamp thurmal stuck a foot down in the corners of the batteries and now inside outside thermomitor with the lead under the cap on the pos post of batteries.

    My sgs were dropping, not staying the same and I was scared I was over heating them.

    I am going to do the tape thing on the low cells.

    My eq rarly got to 90 degrees and some time I would see the temp run up 5 or 6 degrees and then drop just as fast,

    Mostly how long should a guy charge with dropping sgs? I have went a couple hours just to make sure it wasn't a fluke.

    Thanks
    gww
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    coot
    There may be a small misunderstanding of my ten day cycle. It doesn't change what you say being true (being below 75% level for extended periods) Except for finishing long eq and maby very few times of extending an absorb cycle, I never use the grid to charge.

    I use having loads or not having them or in late day turnning of the opertunity load so 1000 watts can keep the battery in absorb when I don't have 4000 watts to work with.

    So basically I mark the day I know the sgs got as high as they get and then let the battery run the loads for the next 7 to 9 days and then I drop the loads till I have the battery sgs as high as they get and do it again.

    sometimes during this period I will get all the hot water i can use for two or three days durring this period. when I get hot water and check the batteries the sgs are usually very close to topping out. some times I hit clouds (like now) only thee days into my last charge and I am going to drop loads anyway due to no solar production but I am also only going to go maby 6 days before my next full charge. There may be times though very few where the battery slowly goes down the whole 9 days before I charge fully.

    To blackcherry's point that hbx should handle all this. If I took the oppertunity load off the system or didn't care if the hot water heater ran from the grid for an hour or so before switching to solar, hbx would work better. It is still a great saftey net if I ever didn't pay attention for a while. I also don't wan't hot water made by the grid cause it is what keeps the turbine loaded during high wind so I never want the whole 50 gal to be at 170 degrees cause I would have to shut the turbines down.

    Either way I had to get some relief so I took the studies from saudi labs (I am sure spelled wrong) which indicated best use was only getting full charge every 14 days and so I thought at ten I wouldnt be taking it to the limmit and inviting going to long with out a full charge. I wasn't getting the sgs up when watching every single day anyway.

    Some times it takes one day with out night time loads to fully charge and sometimes it takes more, tommorrow will be 4 days with all the clouds although it might make it today since I got 12kwh yesterday but it has also only been about 6 days from my last full charge. I would say the average of no loads is two days and I usually shave alot of solar production even if using the opertunity load due to being close to charged at the start of the second day.

    I don't know if any of my typing makes sense.

    Back to discharge and charge. Taking the batteries to 45 scare me a little when looking at the chart. 47 might be to high. 46.3 volts?
    Then charge with solar for as long as it will hold absorb and extend with grid. EQ every time I cycle? Also I think unless I leave the water running wash cloths and turn all the lights on I am not going to get a dischage and charge every day so doing for one week may or may not work. Better might be how many times should I disharge low and charge high, 5? then see where we are at?
    Thanks
    gww

    PS don't know if it matters but before the opertunity load was added I was getting about 18kwhs out of the pv due to shaving in absorb. After the opertunity load I can get 30kwh but it does keep the bateries a bit below absorb for longer and so shorter absorbs.
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    What is the absolute cheepest way to count the amps leaving my battery bank? If it uses a shunt do I have to worry about reduced flow? I put 4/0 cable from my battery to my inverter to keep flow high for easier running of high draw loads. Do they make a clamp meter for measuring this and storing what it sees? Also since I have two inverters and everything going in and going out is hooked to a bus bar (two stainless steal bolts) does this mean that the only way to measure the out going power is to have two meters one for each inverter?
    Thanks
    gww
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    In relationship to my last post, are there clamp monitors that can measure what comes from the ac breaker that goes to my sub panel. I have a watt meter that shows what is being drawn in a manual transfer switch breaker box. Do they have ac monitors that do this and record? it would be like using a watt meter on the stuff from the inverter. Would it be more expencive. searchin on the internet but having no luck. I did see a homemade one on idestuctables but fabracating it is above my pay grade.
    Thanks
    gww
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
  • PhotowhitPhotowhit Solar Expert Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: My battery soc
    gww1 wrote: »
    Would something like this work in the outback ac breaker box?

    Glen, It will measure the Ah of the AC current, but not the current flowing out of your battery(the DC waste in the inverter will not be included). Shunt based monitors can do this, they don't inhibit flow, much more than your 4/0 wire.

    Do you have a shunt in your DC wiring now? Most(all) Epanels have one, do you have a DC breaker box?

    Attachment not found.

    Here's an image I pulled of a trimetric setup, The thingy there with the multiple thin bars is the shunt, the thin 22 gauge(?) wires are from the monitor measuring across the shunt, the large wire is from the battery bank on one side and to the DC Bus on the other.

    Here is the shunt in my Epanel, which has the neg bus bar attached;
    Attachment not found.
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Prosine 1800 and Exeltech 1100, 660 ah 24v ForkLift battery. Off grid for @16 of last 17 years. Assorted other systems, and to many panels in the closet to not do more...lol
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Photowhit
    I realize the convertion and tare loss would not be part of my load consumption but it was suggested I use a kilowatt meter to determan my loads.
    That would take a year as most of my house is on solar but not all and it took several days to figure what circuits I wanted to move from my main panel to solar. If I hooked a trimetric or whatever battery meter up the way coot suggested I would need two of them cause I have two inverters and all we wanted to know was my loads so I could make an educated guess of what I was doing to my batteries.

    I probly have shunts and my turbines go through a doc watson but when I look at them little bitty wires on the doc going to the 6awg it just looks funny.

    I am a cheep skate and I though a monitor didn't mean much as long as I didn't take the battery to low and brought it back up in a reasonable time. It seems if I could provide my load people would be more comfortable in there advice to me. Now my curiosity is also perked.

    How would a trymatic or whatever it is called work if it was hooked to the positive or negative battery cable. Is it like the doc wattson and only measures one way or does it give a plus or minus reading based on which way the current is going while measuring both ways?

    Man I worked hard oversizing wire throughout so there would be no hickups.
    Thanks
    gww

    PS yes my dc box is outback.
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    I am not looking forward to it but am willing to spend money. I would like to understand what it will do for me and don't intend to pay someone else to install it. Thats why I bug people so bad with what are probly stupid questions untill I understand. I did everything myself so far and mostly I think I got it close to right but it took a couple of years bugging people that where dumb (smiley face) enough to answer my post.
    Cheers
    gww
  • PhotowhitPhotowhit Solar Expert Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Your4 fine, I had one but can't find it after the move. It measures both ways. and if everything goes through the shunt it should measure both the loads and charging to the battery. I really didn't want to get into what the heck the Outback system is doing as I'm not familiar with it.

    The Trimetric you set the meter for your batteries capacity and type/charging efficiency. These things change over time. The meter resets once it detects full charge so it should help bring things back together. I use 2 inverters, but the inverters are connected through the same shunt inside my Epanel. The picture is quite old. I have 2/0 coming to the shunt and 1 gauge going to the 1800 watt inverter and 4 gauge going to the 1100 watt inverter. It a very short run to either.

    I do better with others explaining things and better yet seeing and setting things up, You might read up on the trimetric site and perhaps find some videos.

    Hope you saw the sun today! We had a couple hours just before dusk. It's good to know the sun hasn't burned out...lol Starting to feel that way.
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Prosine 1800 and Exeltech 1100, 660 ah 24v ForkLift battery. Off grid for @16 of last 17 years. Assorted other systems, and to many panels in the closet to not do more...lol
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Whit
    you had to bring the sun up. I made 3.9 kwh today. counteded it up and I have made like 22kwh over the last 5 days with one of those days being 12kwh which aint good in its self. I did make a couple of kwhs with the wind. I wasn't trying to get you into the outback system. It is bad to the bone though.

    I guess I am going to buy the trimetric. It is self contained isn't it? No computer needed? I have been reading but still haven't figured out if it stores more then just a snapshot of where the batterie is at that moment. cc's let you look back daily for 27 days and give totals.

    The vidios is a good ideal and I think I will watch before pulling the trigger but have pretty much made my mind up. Have you decided you no longer need the trimetric or just haven't got to it since the move?
    Thanks for the imput.
    gww
  • PhotowhitPhotowhit Solar Expert Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Lots of funny things happen with the move, thought Ihad seen the trimetric, recall a box... but nothing now, my sears clamp meter started working again! so I gave my old ampro to they guy who bought my old system. Now I've lent out? or lost my sears clamp meter. I seem to recall someone working on a car and needing to run down some current issues....

    Look into which of the models will work better for you, I think most people like the RV version, has it's own box raised though. They are only slightly different in features. You can get them with or with out the shunts
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Prosine 1800 and Exeltech 1100, 660 ah 24v ForkLift battery. Off grid for @16 of last 17 years. Assorted other systems, and to many panels in the closet to not do more...lol
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    I am looking now, Going to have to buy the shunt, I dont know if I need the 30 dollar wires or will make my own but believe I can make them, Any comment cause shipping is a bitch if I end up needing them. I also may have to buy a 4/0 short cable. I have enough wire but maby not the ends to crimp on the wire.
    Looking for the cheepest place to buy. I hope I am looking for the right one (2025).
    Thanks
    gww
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Right at $188 didn't buy 4/0 short cable, will make do.
    gww

    PS naws still came in as low as I could find anywhere, Don't know why I try.
  • CALLDCALLD Solar Expert Posts: 230 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc
    Photowhit wrote: »
    gww, Hang in there we have a chance for sun Sunday, I've been gone the last 2 almost 3 days and my 24v battery was at 25v as grey skies went to dusk, don't know if the fridge had just kicked off, but it's the only thing running. We have a chance Sunday then 2 more grey days, that might make a week with no visible shape in the sky!, I'll have to call people out of area and ask them is the sun still exists... Bright enough today I'm out of bulk, but when it's rained a couple hours on the zero chance of rain day it leads to depression...lol.

    Whit I can really associate with the feelings of helplessness a few days of gloomy weather can bring! Spent 3 months waiting for the spring upturn and with it came the longest stretch of cloudy weather I've ever noticed. The months of May, June & July being the months of the lowest sun saw an average of 3 sunny days for every 1 gloomy day, then came August, September and the first half of October. The higher sun stifled by incessant cloudy weather! Since around mid-August I've been seeing an average of 1 clear day per week, 3 gloomy days and 3 sort of mixed days. Looking at satellite images has become my latest depression inducing pastime - staring hopelessly at the southern ocean churning out cold front after cold front and thrusting them north... The clear weather, if any seems to appear at night which adds to the frustration! There has been a recent improvement but it doesn't appear convincing yet. One can only hope the clear weather doesn't wait until the fall-equinox in March before it decides to stick around for a while..........
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    calld
    Well one thing is for sure, going to have to wait one more day for sun cause it is miserable again today.
    gww
  • jtdiesel65jtdiesel65 Solar Expert Posts: 140 ✭✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Not sure if this was mentioned, but after no recent significant charge, the electrolyte will be stratified in the tall forklift cells. That means the SG reading will be lower than actual. That would mean if you took the SG reading to figure out an SOC from an SOC/SG chart, the actual SOC would be higher than what the chart says because the actual SG is higher than the measured SG due to stratification. How much more? Who knows. It would vary anyway, but up to 5%?

    On a side note, I've noticed that if I take an SG reading and then squeeze the bulb somewhat forcibly to eject the electrolyte back in the cell to stir it and then take a second SG reading, the second SG reading will almost always be higher than the first reading.
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Maby a bit of sun later today. The low cell is about 1.272. I can't tell about the temp as the stupid moniter on it has faded. I got almost 4kwh solar and 4 kwh wind. I didn't get enough at one time to reach absorb voltage and it kept kicking the day time loads on and I didn't change the settings to stop this. I just made sure I didn't run night time loads. The voltage may get to absorb today if The sun comes out enough to get over the 3000 watt mark from the solar. I haven't started the discharge recharge thing yet. I am going to try and get my little chores done so I can pay attention to it and need to get something to measure temp. I might even wait till I get the trimetric installed, which should happen when it arives in the mail. .
    Thank you for the info
    gww
  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    I guess it's not a secret that I don't put to much stock in Battery Monitors. My time goes back through the Heart Interface and all the Link models with shunts ( built in 1991 and still working ) , Trace and all of the Xantrex re badged units and Vitron BMV's. Some of my issues may be in the way my charging schemes work, a full recharge only occurs every 4-5 days, during those days there could be as many as 10 -20 bulk recharges ( 50 - 85 % ). In the old days you used the Peukert Exponent on the discharge and adjusted the back end, now it's the battery charge factor + capacity + voltage +Time + Ending amps ( if you use them ). If I have to still verify the battery level with the SG's and voltage, what have I accomplished. I just have more numbers that have very little meaning in a different metric . It's like using the Float gauge in a tank or a Flow meter to measure fuel use, if your going to keep looking at the Float gauge then the Flow meter is just extra data. With my batteries I have to stop charging as 1.250 SG and by morning they will come up to 1.265 after resting. If I overcharge the them with longer time or amps I'v just hurt myself and the Batteries. With adjusting all the points I can bring them in line so that they come in line with the Battery Monitor, but they don't stay there, either the temperature or the BCE changes, so it's a every week job.

    They may work fine for someone that pulls their SOC to 80% and charges back to 100% everyday, but thats not the way I charge.

    Another Issue with some, if the new Monitors ( wiz bang jr and Vitron for sure ) that have the circuit board on the shunt is you cannot allow them to be exposed to the Sulfuric acid fumes or allow any acid to be dripped on them or they are history. I recommend that you take a gallon zip lock bag and cut a small slit and allow the battery cable out the top and tape it and all the other wires come in the zip end and seal them the best you can or you'll major erratic readings or they quit functioning. The Trimetric seems to use twisted pair wires and that is a plus in my book.

    I guess I feel that it's kind of like the old parable, you give a man a fish, he can feed himself for a day, Teach him to fish, he can feed himself for life. Being in touch with your Batteries and their health and learning to deal with them is part of having them, It all still comes down to SG level and Voltage.

    I also have other issues, 90 % of the Inverter / Chargers I deal with have fixed Charging Algorithms, I can fake the 2% Ending amps baked in by raising or lowering the Battery bank capacity, the charging voltage can be adjusted by removing the the Thermistor on the RTS and replacing it with a potentiometer. So the Battery Monitors end up something else to deal with. With all my setups I use two charging sources that puts charging amps in at least C/25 -30% in Bulk, at gassing I drop one source with a Active high VCS and finish absorb with one source at C/10 - 15%. For my customers it's about Fuel consumed vs battery cost, batteries are expendable when you are talking about $200 a day in Fuel costs vs $100. 6 weeks they'v saved the cost of a new set of Batteries.

    In your case if it work's for you and you get good data you can use, then it was a good Investment for what you paid for it. It will be interesting to see how it works with your Fork Lift battery and how you charge, keep us informed.
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Blackcherry
    I made the point that I couldn't understand why I needed to know my loads or anything else as long as I didn't let the battery get to low and made sure it got fully charged at least every ten days. The point that was made to me was letting them sit too long at below 75% charge could cause problims. I knew I needed to bring them up to about 80% or better daily for the ten day thing to work. The battery maker does say if your loads are not big enough to let them go longer before charging (couple of days).

    I kind of thought having a battery monitor wouldn't change my loads or give me more production and that I could live without it.

    I also thought that if I just wanted to know my loads that an ac whole house monitor would tell me that and be cheeper. I brought all these points up and really didn't get many comments except from photowhit that said that the ac moniter wouldnt have the convertion and tare losses recorded.

    I would have liked your imput on this sooner though I may have ended up where I am anyway. Now is too late as I have done spent the money. I still can't hook it up as coot suggested, to just find what my battery loading is and not worry about the charging part, cause I have two inverters and am not buying two battery monitors.

    I also hate the ideal of putting a shunt on them big wires I wired everything with.

    I got it now so I guess I will see what it does for me. If nothing else it should give me a bunch of numbers I can type on here so those that know more then me can have more to try and help me if I need it.

    Now that I have pulled the trigger on the purchase I guess my aditude is, "don't worry, be happy".

    Thanks for the post.

    gww

    PS I don't let my batteries rest after charging so I may be going under or over when measuring the actual sg at the time. I have seen sgs raise over night with no load but I don't go overnight without load very often. I also have turbines and such not going through the cc. so time value absorbs and watching sgs is my answer, not end amps. I have watched end amps trying to set the time value but mostly watch sgs while charging. Spot checking the low cell.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    There's a bit of a difference between using a battery monitor to watch how much power is going in or out and relying on it for SOC. The latter can mess things up really fast if it is programmed wrong, and over time it will be wrong because the real capacity of batteries goes down with time no matter what you do. Installing one when everything is new and programming it correctly is one thing; putting one in after the batteries have already been in use ... little chance the capacity will be correct.

    I'm not a big fan of battery monitors either because it is something people take the readings from as 100% correct and yet they can be so easily made 100% incorrect. For sealed batteries there's not much choice, but for flooded cells the hydrometer wins every time.
  • gww1gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    Re: My battery soc

    Bad luck today, I set the top and bottom elements in my hot water heater opertunity loads to 170 degrees. I just came down to the basement where I spend most of my time. It is flooded. The pop off valve had triped and I have water every where. I ran a bunch of water down the sink till the pop off reset, opened the cover and lowered the elements 10 degrees and hope that is enough. Got me worried though.

    Battery.

    I was wrong on how I could wire the trimetric. I had thought two inverters ment two negatives going to them but it doesn't. It does have two pos going from the buss bar but only one negative going to the dc breaker box. The only thing I don't know is if it will make a differance as the cc might be using that negative also for chargeing. If it is then I might as well put the trymetric on the battery side of the buss and capture the turbine output also. Does anyone know if it matters which side of the buss that I put the shunt? I am trying to measure what leaves the battery.

    I made up a short 4/0 wire so I am ready.

    I didn't buy the wiring kit , so I will still have to make the small wires.

    Well guess I will grab the shop vac now.

    Just shampooded the carpet so it needed a new stain.
    Cheers
    gww
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