I have a battery monitor question...

BB.

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

I am sorry--I thought I remembered that you have somebody that comes by once a week to help you--I did not remember what you called them...

And I have a brother and sister that are both in environmental fields (geologist specializing in cleanups and risk analysis, and local environmental inspector for the county). We had lunch over the weekend and talked about unknown issues of buried hazards and the current laws that seem to reward a "veil of ignorance" over people like your developer (the ability to claim no knowledge of problems with the property--and they go out of their way to not learn of any problems).

Your average low temperatures run in the mid twenties for three months out of the year--freezing pipes and condensation/mold would, seem to me, a real possibility. My average lows are only around 40F, and I have had frozen pipes before (in unheated garage) and we had mold problems in the cooler rooms of the home I grew up in (no central heat)...

Your system generates, roughly something like 40 kWhours of useful energy a month--Even in very expensive California, that is about:

cost per month = 40kWhr * $0.1143/kWhr = $4.57 per month...

That is just over the minimum connection charge in my area--or under $60 per year for a, very rough equivalent estimate, usage from your current solar system...

And, if I have the utility company correct, your rates are almost 1/2 mine... From this PDF file for PNM:

cost per month = 40kWhr * 6.7607¢/kWh = $3.04 per month

Not sure, but you appear have a $2.80 per month billing charge plus local taxes (whatever those may be)...

That still is around $70 per year for equivalent electrical power from your solar system...

Your $700 per year utility bills were probably based on your using more electricity than you use now (plus natural gas?)...

Again, I am trying very hard to understand your situation and not insult you Karen.

Obviously, you have other problems related to your home and such that I have no knowledge of, and no need to know about either. I can only make suggestions based on what I know--I really wish you the best of luck and hope that all works out well for you.

Sincerely,
-Bill

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

BB. wrote: »

I am sorry--I thought I remembered that you have somebody that comes by once a week to help you--I did not remember what you called them...

Ah. I see. When I had money I hired people. When I had tetanus I did have help from Adult Protective Services because it locks pretty much all the muscles and is really debilitating. Thank you, I see you were stating concern.

And I have a brother and sister that are both in environmental fields (geologist specializing in cleanups and risk analysis, and local environmental inspector for the county). We had lunch over the weekend and talked about unknown issues of buried hazards and the current laws that seem to reward a "veil of ignorance" over people like your developer (the ability to claim no knowledge of problems with the property--and they go out of their way to not learn of any problems).

Yes. When it first happened I had thought privy pits might be a relatively common problem in cities with old areas. But so far only a couple people have written me of privy pit problems. But that's just one kind of buried waste. And the attitudes that you describe are just as toxic.

Your average low temperatures run in the mid twenties for three months out of the year--

That's outside. Inside it seems to be warmer because of me breathing... I guess. I was really dreading it, but now that I'm relaxed and know how warm it is in my tent, I'm much warmer because I'm not scared and that makes more heat for the house in general.

freezing pipes and condensation/mold would, seem to me, a real possibility. My average lows are only around 40F, and I have had frozen pipes before (in unheated garage)

Hmmm. When I was first here I closed off my front room one whole winter, so it was really cold there, and that's where the water pipe comes in. It didn't freeze.

and we had mold problems in the cooler rooms of the home I grew up in (no central heat)...

I had mold problems here from leaks. There were leaks for years while I was sick and I could not get anyone to actually fix them. I paid about five hundred dollars and still one night the handle blew off the bath, and the water was mains pressure spouting across the room. So now I don't have hot water anymore and the Saltillo has finally dried, and I had the tiles in the shower (a different bathroom) taken down along the leak area and the wall board removed. It was black with mold. Then I sprayed the studs with Chlorox which whitened the black mold right up. And I had the molded pressed wood taken out from under the kitchen sink... but it's really hard to find reliable guys that stay reliable, and then when they are and do, I run out of money.
Sorry. Too long.

Your system generates, roughly something like 40 kWhours of useful energy a month--Even in very expensive California, that is about:

cost per month = 40kWhr * $0.1143/kWhr = $4.57 per month...

The thing is, this is irrelevant because I'm happy with my electricity. I used too much because I thought I had that much extra. I thought it would be a waste to have it and not use it. But the monitor was installed wrong. Drat!

That is just over the minimum connection charge in my area--or under $60 per year for a, very rough equivalent estimate, usage from your current solar system...

And, if I have the utility company correct, your rates are almost 1/2 mine... From this PDF file for PNM:

cost per month = 40kWhr * 6.7607¢/kWh = $3.04 per month

Not sure, but you appear have a $2.80 per month billing charge plus local taxes (whatever those may be)...

I'm unclear where you are going with this. I'm way happy with my electric. I am totally dissatisfied with the behavior of PNM. They were mean, I don't like that.

That still is around $70 per year for equivalent electrical power from your solar system...

Your $700 per year utility bills were probably based on your using more electricity than you use now (plus natural gas?)...

They charged me for gas even though I wasn't using any. They have imperative sur charges. My bills were such that they added up to $700 or so a year. I used to use electricity differently. Now I have LED lights and stuff.

Again, I am trying very hard to understand your situation and not insult you Karen.

Obviously, you have other problems related to your home and such that I have no knowledge of, and no need to know about either. I can only make suggestions based on what I know--I really wish you the best of luck and hope that all works out well for you.

You've been great. I now understand how to tell what my panels are putting into my batteries. That's what I thought the monitor was telling me.

Sincerely,
-Bill

I do think I'm going to have to get a little LP gas burning heater though, because my laser printer needs it to be warmer. And I'll need that to do the next part of my appeal.

(in five days...) I have a lot of trouble with the loss of full use of my cognition...

i.e. I don't really comprehend how close that is...

But, the thing is that they denied me due process repeatedly, so even if I had the time right, if they want to keep me from having my property... well, like the developer, they are the ones with the power... and isn't it interesting that they want a new judicial complex... I wonder who has the land they want to use...

icarus

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Be extremely careful of any L/P gas heater, but most especially one that is NOT vented out doors. The number of people killed each year with improper use of space heaters is very high. The dangers of Oxygen depletion, Carbon Monoxide poisoning, accidental fires etc. are very real!

In addition, any fuel burning device, be it a space heater, a kerosene lamp, or even a candle will add considerable moisture to the air, increasing the above mentioned issues with dampness, mold and mildew. There are several non electrical space heaters made that can be installed safely, with proper combustion air, and flue gas venting. http://www.cozyheaters.com/

DO NOT USE THIS TYPE OR SIMILAR HEATER IN A INCLOSED BUILDING NO MATTER WHAT ANYONE TELLS YOU!!!!http://www.mrheater.com/

I am not insensitive to you problems, I and all of us out here want to keep you safe! Good luck and stay warm,

Icarus

PS.

The above admonitions are stern warnings and they are meant to be. Every year, in the bush of Northern Ontario (our neck of the proverbial woods) some ill prepared city hunter for fisherman kills himself in a small cabin using an unvented space heater! DON'T DO IT!!!!

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

icarus wrote: »

Be extremely careful of any L/P gas heater,

I can't remember the other name for the gas.

but most especially one that is NOT vented out doors.

They have several now that are "ventless" -- I forget how they work. But, apprently they do. I checked out a lot of marine forums.

The number of people killed each year with improper use of space heaters is very high. The dangers of Oxygen depletion, Carbon Monoxide poisoning, accidental fires etc. are very real!

yes.

In addition, any fuel burning device, be it a space heater, a kerosene lamp, or even a candle will add considerable moisture to the air, increasing the above mentioned issues with dampness, mold and mildew.

Right. I do live in Santa Fe, though. It's very dry here. Hence the popularity of humidifiers.

There are several non electrical space heaters made that can be installed safely, with proper combustion air, and flue gas venting. http://www.cozyheaters.com/

Oh... I'll check out that link. Force 10 sold Cozy Cabin to... I forget who. The Big Buddy one had 56 reviews one place, and the high percentage were extremely favorable.

DO NOT USE THIS TYPE OR SIMILAR HEATER IN A INCLOSED BUILDING NO MATTER WHAT ANYONE TELLS YOU!!!!http://www.mrheater.com/

Oh, I think Mr. Heater is the one everyone likes. I have a lot of drafts. I left windows open in previous years, even during the most cold weather because of what I've learned the hard way about toxins in the air inside a building.

I don't know if you know this or not, but radon tests can be thrown off entirely by simply opening a door to the outside a few times a day.

People have boughten into the idea of air tight houses, and that is not necessarily wise. Better to lose a little heat and have a bit of fresh air.

I am not insensitive to you problems, I and all of us out here want to keep you safe! Good luck and stay warm,

Icarus

PS.

The above admonitions are stern warnings and they are meant to be. Every year, in the bush of Northern Ontario (our neck of the proverbial woods) some ill prepared city hunter for fisherman kills himself

but anyhow, if he's out there hunting for fisherman maybe it's a good thing he bites the dust. not the best kind of guy, I wouldn't think. *

in a small cabin using an unvented space heater! DON'T DO IT!!!!

My house is a little larger than a fishing cabin. Also, I don't want to use it all the time, I primarily need it for my printer.

I don't like it warm at night. So this is for some hours use during the day. And getting the propane sounds like it will be a bore since I still haven't gotten my license back, primarily because I haven't been well enough to drive... Tetanus does a seizure type of thing, and after that I had involuntary movement in my legs, so I didn't want to drive and hurt someone...

I appreciate you guys, a lot.

* chuckle

icarus

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Be extremely careful of any L/P gas heater,

"I can't remember the other name for the gas."


L/P is liquid petrolium gas, also know as "Propane"

"They have several now that are "ventless" -- I forget how they work. But, apprently they do. I checked out a lot of marine forums."

These are what I'm talking about! Ventless means no vent of the burning gas to the outside of the building.

"Oh, I think Mr. Heater is the one everyone likes."

Just 'cause everyone likes it doesn't make it a good idea indoors. These
are used for camping heaters.


"My house is a little larger than a fishing cabin"

I stand by my warnings and opinion.

Icarus

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

The ventless ones work because the shut off when there is a lowered amount of oxygen.

I will just barely be able to use one here because of the altitude.



As an aside, the main reason that low vitamin B12 makes people feel tired and eventually causes congnitive dysfunction is that without enough B12 our blood cells get too large, they fail to divide properly, so when they are like that, too big, they can't carry around oxygen the way that they should and we are deprived of oxygen.

Similarly, when I was living in the hydrogen sulfide, it deprived me of oxygen... my skin began to look as if I smoked, which I don't and never did... except briefly in the 60s.

So, if you have ridges on your fingernails or are losing your moons, it is a serious thing. I know it doesn't seem like it in comparison to heaters... and electrical charges and things, but it is.

I hope you read the B12 parts of my web site.

icarus

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

It is not just low O2, but increased CO2, and most importantly, CO.
Carbon monoxide! silent killer.

I'm done

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Why do you sound as if you are angry?

I tried to kill myself with carbon monoxide in 1997 because of abuse by the IRS. They used a part of my IRS experience in a piece about IRS abuse in U.S. News and World Report...

mike95490

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

re: LASER PRINTER needing heat

The printer should function above freezing temps. It has it's own internal electrical heater, that preheats for about 5 minutes, up to a 1,000 watts AC, and it wants sine wave power, not mod sine power. A warmer house will only shorten the preheat time, then it will draw 1,000 watts for 3 minutes before it starts printing. When printing, it will still draw a lot of power.

Some models may draw less, but they all rely on a very hot roller fuseing the toner to the paper.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

mike90045 wrote: »

re: LASER PRINTER needing heat

The printer should function above freezing temps. It has it's own internal electrical heater, that preheats for about 5 minutes, up to a 1,000 watts AC, and it wants sine wave power, not mod sine power. A warmer house will only shorten the preheat time, then it will draw 1,000 watts for 3 minutes before it starts printing. When printing, it will still draw a lot of power.

Some models may draw less, but they all rely on a very hot roller fuseing the toner to the paper.

Hmmmm. That's really interesting. I've been turning it on prior to wanting to actually run it, but I didn't realize it was heating up.

I had to call HP to find out how many watts... it's apparently 475. I got pure sine for it. : )

In the manual it says it should be kept at, or used at, I forget which... some temperature that's way hotter than my home.

Why do they say that?

Boy... thank you for the response. That's a nice nugget.

mike95490

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

ConsiderThis wrote: »

In the manual it says it should be kept at, or used at, I forget which... some temperature that's way hotter than my home.

Why do they say that?

They likely say that because they made it, and it works better that way.

Maybe, when you need to use it, you can place a cardboard box, like a tent, over it, and make a little Easy-Bake-Oven, which will keep it warmer (but don't overheat it ! ) than the rest of the house, and avoid heating the entire house. Or just print in summertime.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

mike90045 wrote: »

They likely say that because they made it, and it works better that way.

Maybe, when you need to use it, you can place a cardboard box, like a tent, over it, and make a little Easy-Bake-Oven, which will keep it warmer (but don't overheat it ! ) than the rest of the house, and avoid heating the entire house. Or just print in summertime.

Oh.... I'm so glad you wrote again. I've been thinking about what you wrote: last thing last night and first thing this morning.

I hadn't thought about the heat it needs in terms of its processes, I had thought it was to prevent metal fatigue if the metal parts were caused to move at certain lower temperatures.

The box idea is really clever. Despite living in a tent myself, in the house here, I failed to extend the application.

I don't know that I have any boxes, but maybe I could put some fabric over it.

I have my large stainless bowl on a candle near it, now.

If I could use it, it would be great. I've been trying to think who I know on the internet that I could ask to print from an email for me and mail to the chief administrator of the courts, the risk management guy and the mayor, re my tort claim notice.

I could handwrite it, but I can't keep my mind focused on writing in a print form long enough to finish a whole piece... so in the end it's not very legible.

I'm pretty excited about warming the machine...

With court things you can't just wait for warmer weather... lol.

: )

Thanks so much for the idea!!!!!! I'm very keen to see how this works.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

mike90045 wrote: »

re: LASER PRINTER needing heat

The printer should function above freezing temps. It has it's own internal electrical heater, that preheats for about 5 minutes, up to a 1,000 watts AC, and it wants sine wave power, not mod sine power. A warmer house will only shorten the preheat time, then it will draw 1,000 watts for 3 minutes before it starts printing. When printing, it will still draw a lot of power.

Some models may draw less, but they all rely on a very hot roller fuseing the toner to the paper.

I was thinking that maybe I misled you. I think it's not a "Laser" printer, per se, it's a Laser Jet. So maybe that makes some crucial difference. I would guess it doesn't have to heat as much for the jet????

****

Yesterday when I went in to see how my MTTP numbers were doing, they showed my batteries up to 284, or 287, I forget. And, the little "Input" light was blinking on the inverter... which caused me to look closely to see if the FLOAT light was on... It wasn't.

So now I'm also concerned that the batteries have been overcharged many times during the summer...

What I mean is, if the input thing was blinking, did that mean that the inverter was sensing an overload of PV input?

I quickly went and turned on a Crock Pot just to use up some of the energy... I couldn't think what else to do with it.

Oh... so that reminds me, I can use my little 1,000 watt electric kettle to heat water to wash clothes when it's sunny out... because I think the energy goes through the system but doesn't ... doesn't lodge there...???? I'm a little unclear. But it was working great the other day until the sun went behind a cloud.

BB.

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen,

Yes, it does make a difference. A "laser printer" uses "black plastic dust" (toner) and static electricity to attract the "dust" to the paper and a very hot roller to melt the toner into the paper.

A "jet" type printer uses liquid ink and tiny "pumps" to spray a tiny drop of ink at a time onto the paper and where it quickly drys.

Freezing a laser "jet" printer can certainly damage/ruin the print head and spray jets. And, if the printer is too cold, the fluid might not flow correctly to the paper--but it will not hurt anything to try.

However, putting the printer in a cardboard box--with a "jet"--it may help--but don't use the un-vented gas heater to add heat under the box. Roughly, for every gallon of liquid fuel you burn (propane or gasoline) you create about 1.5 gallons of water (as steam). The additional humidity combined with the cold metal/electronics will probably dramatically shorten the life of your printer (typically, water from combustion is very acidic).

Regarding your battery voltage readings... You need to look at the temperature of your batteries and use the Battery Manual to look at the optimum/maximum charging voltage for your batteries

Example, if the batteries are 40-49F, then the optimum/maximum charge voltage should be 14.2 to 14.5 volts--or in your case, multiply by 2x and get 24.4 to 29.0 volts is perfectly OK for your batteries). And you need to maintain this voltage for hours/days until the batteries are fully charged (using your battery current monitor and watching it drop down even though there is full sun on the solar panels).

Since your batteries were basically 100% discharged, it is going to take a few days (2-5 days) of full sun/no power use, to get them backup to fully charged.

And, remember that you need to monitor the "resting voltage" (no sun, no loads, few hours of rest) of your batteries to know how charged they are. I suspect that you don't need to turn on your hotplate to "protect your batteries".

The indication that the system was "working OK" until the sun went behind a cloud... If you are indicating that the inverter started "beeping" or whatever when you loaded it when there was no sun, still indicates that the batteries are not getting properly charged. If you intended to say that the charge current dropped with the clouds covered the sun--that is, of course, normal.

The power from the sun/solar panels goes into the batteries (for storage) and the batteries supply power for your use at night/during bad weather.

And yes, you can use your system during the day (computer and such) because you are taking the power that would be used to charge your batteries and instead using it to power your laptop. This is perfectly OK and normal operation when the batteries are fully charged--but in your case, if you have chronically undercharged batteries then you want to cut back your power usage to a minimum until your batteries have been fully recharged before using more power (day or night) again.

I don't remember the brand/model of your inverter to know what the flashing light(s) may mean.

Karen, is there anyone that can help you with this stuff? Some of these answers are getting repetitive and sometimes I fear that I cannot really help you much more from several thousand miles away. I (we) don't know all of the details with your system and your usage/needs--so I am concerned that the answers I give you may not always be appropriate and/or may lead you down the wrong road.

Sincerely,
-Bill

PS: At this point I will also add, for your application (daily living on your solar system), you should not worry about the "float" voltage (on page 11 of my above link 40-49F would be 2x 13.9-14.3 = 27.8 to 28.6 VDC) as it is for long term storage of your batteries (weeks and months of non-use). In your case, you are using the batteries daily so as long as you are between optimum and maximum charging voltage during a sunny day (based on the present temperature of your batteries)--you are just fine.

Your bigger problem is to try and ensure that your battery bank gets fully recharged again (watch for your charging current dropping during full sun and the correct battery voltages). When you see the charging current dropping during full sun, that would be the time to start using your optional loads (more computer, washing cloths, etc.) during the day.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

BB. wrote: »

Karen,

Yes, it does make a difference. A "laser printer" uses "black plastic dust" (toner) and static electricity to attract the "dust" to the paper and a very hot roller to melt the toner into the paper.

A "jet" type printer uses liquid ink and tiny "pumps" to spray a tiny drop of ink at a time onto the paper and where it quickly drys.


OH! Thanks. I was beginning to think that I'd spoken imprecisely and been misleading. Thank you so much.

Freezing a laser "jet" printer can certainly damage/ruin the print head and spray jets. And, if the printer is too cold, the fluid might not flow correctly to the paper--but it will not hurt anything to try.

It hasn't frozen. But it's pretty chilly. I don't want to hurt it by using it if it's at a risky temperature. (Years ago I bought my son a jacket, this was when he was tiny, and the zip broke. So they replaced it, and the zip broke again. This time I looked at it and could see that the casting had been porous, so when it got cold, I imagined, the metal which was thin to begin with, got more brittle and broke. The third time, John Lewis, the store where I'd gotten it, said I had to get a different type of jacket. I would guess that while they thought it was my fault in some way, it was actually happening for everyone who had the purchased the jacket, but moms who weren't also silversmiths probably thought their little boys had broken it...)

However, putting the printer in a cardboard box--with a "jet"--it may help--but don't use the un-vented gas heater to add heat under the box. Roughly, for every gallon of liquid fuel you burn (propane or gasoline) you create about 1.5 gallons of water (as steam). The additional humidity combined with the cold metal/electronics will probably dramatically shorten the life of your printer (typically, water from combustion is very acidic).

I don't have a heater yet. I don't think I'd be tempted to put the heater under the covering. Especially since they are designed to shut off if there is a lack of air...

Okay... dense here... how can a greater volumn of water be produced than there was fuel in the first place?

Regarding your battery voltage readings... You need to look at the temperature of your batteries and use the Battery Manual to look at the optimum/maximum charging voltage for your batteries

Example, if the batteries are 40-49F, then the optimum/maximum charge voltage should be 14.2 to 14.5 volts--or in your case, multiply by 2x and get 24.4 to 29.0 volts is perfectly OK for your batteries). And you need to maintain this voltage for hours/days until the batteries are fully charged (using your battery current monitor and watching it drop down even though there is full sun on the solar panels).

OHHHH. I had to read that several times to "get" it. 29.0 is more than 284, so I'd still be safe. Thank you. Sorry to be so slow!

Since your batteries were basically 100% discharged, it is going to take a few days (2-5 days) of full sun/no power use, to get them backup to fully charged.

Right.

And, remember that you need to monitor the "resting voltage" (no sun, no loads, few hours of rest) of your batteries to know how charged they are.

I do that at night when I turn off my inverter, and again in the morning before I turn the inverter back on. But I forget what it said. I forget because I try to remember the list of readings, and then I get confused. SOOOO irritating.

I suspect that you don't need to turn on your hotplate to "protect your batteries".

I know... but why was the inverter blinking...

The indication that the system was "working OK" until the sun went behind a cloud... If you are indicating that the inverter started "beeping" or whatever when you loaded it when there was no sun, still indicates that the batteries are not getting properly charged. If you intended to say that the charge current dropped with the clouds covered the sun--that is, of course, normal.

Yes, I meant the latter. : )

The power from the sun/solar panels goes into the batteries (for storage) and the batteries supply power for your use at night/during bad weather.

I love the batteries! I didn't mean to hurt them.

And yes, you can use your system during the day (computer and such) because you are taking the power that would be used to charge your batteries and instead using it to power your laptop. This is perfectly OK and normal operation when the batteries are fully charged--but in your case, if you have chronically undercharged batteries then you want to cut back your power usage to a minimum until your batteries have been fully recharged before using more power (day or night) again.

Yes. I have cut back. I don't watch telly news anymore, and only a scant evening entertainment program here and there, and, in the dark.

I can't quite remember, but I think my batteries show 254 or 248 in the morning before I turn anything on... That's charged, isn't it? They can't show the high numbers, like 274 or 284 because those numbers reflect active charging. Is that correct?

I don't remember the brand/model of your inverter to know what the flashing light(s) may mean.

It's a Go Power, and I read the manual, and I thought it meant that the flashing was a warning. I have to read it several more times, I suppose, to "get" what it is saying.

Karen, is there anyone that can help you with this stuff? Some of these answers are getting repetitive and sometimes I fear that I cannot really help you much more from several thousand miles away. I (we) don't know all of the details with your system and your usage/needs--so I am concerned that the answers I give you may not always be appropriate and/or may lead you down the wrong road.

Oh... I'm sorry. I don't always get things. It's extremely weird with this disability, sometimes I just do not get something even if it is extremely clear... it sometimes has to be in some exact set of words for me to get it... I feel as if my mind had been turned into an old fashioned lock and key set up, where unless words are arranged exactly right to be a key, they don't work for my mind any more, it just remains lock.

I didn't mean to take so much time. Sorry. I really appreciate your help. Yours and everyones. I think I've mostly got it now.

No, there's no one here. But I don't think that matters. The situation is what it is. I think the glass mat batteries sound great. I'll work as hard as I can to get my condo or its value back so I can get those when replacement is necessary.

Thanks.



Sincerely,
-Bill

PS: At this point I will also add, for your application (daily living on your solar system), you should not worry about the "float" voltage (on page 11 of my above link 40-49F would be 2x 13.9-14.3 = 27.8 to 28.6 VDC) as it is for long term storage of your batteries (weeks and months of non-use). In your case, you are using the batteries daily so as long as you are between optimum and maximum charging voltage during a sunny day (based on the present temperature of your batteries)--you are just fine.

Oh dear... see this isn't making sense to me...

When there was a lot of sun this summer, and I wasn't using much electric because I wanted to stay in the 90% full range, the float light would come on most days. So I thought that was excess energy. Now I worry that if the things aren't connected right, the excess is charging my batteries without any control from the charge controller, which is what I thought the MPPT thing was (a charge controller)... And I still don't know what that loose wire from it is...

Your bigger problem is to try and ensure that your battery bank gets fully recharged again (watch for your charging current dropping during full sun and the correct battery voltages). When you see the charging current dropping during full sun, that would be the time to start using your optional loads (more computer, washing cloths, etc.) during the day.

Oh. It will drop when they are full? OHHHHH.

Gosh, thank you for all of this. I'm going to go check them out right now.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Wow, that was a really interesting check of the MPPT readings. They were in the 280s and the light was blinking and the FLOAT light was on. So I quickly connected my 1000 watt electric kettle and heated water to put in the stainless steel bowl above the candle. I forgot to trim the wax on the candle so the flame was really small.

That was exciting.

I had a cup of coffee and decided I should check and see how much energy had been depleted from my batteries… and low and behold, same thing: a reading in the 280s, a blinking light on the inverter and the FLOAT light on.

So it didn’t use any stored energy to heat my water.

And in that case, I’m heating more. (but seriously)

And, that water boiled and the MPPT read 269. So… I’m sure glad I watched Chuck last night.

mike95490

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Wow, that was a really interesting check of the MPPT readings. They were in the 280s and the light was blinking and the FLOAT light was on. So I quickly connected my 1000 watt electric kettle and heated water to put in the stainless steel bowl above the candle. I forgot to trim the wax on the candle so the flame was really small.

Have you ever gotten an equalize cycle in ? you may want to try one of those (if you have flooded cells) Plan on a distilled water top-off afterwards, and acid mist to clean off your hands.

What is the 280 # you are seeing ? Is that your battery voltage ? 28.0V ?
The Blinking Light means what ?

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

mike90045 wrote: »

Have you ever gotten an equalize cycle in ?

no clue what that means...

you may want to try one of those (if you have flooded cells)

Oh... maybe that's why I've not heard of that... my cells are gell

Plan on a distilled water top-off afterwards, and acid mist to clean off your hands.

What is the 280 # you are seeing ? Is that your battery voltage ? 28.0V ?

Yes, I think so. There isn't a decimal point.

The Blinking Light means what ?

Apparently, having now read the manual several times, it means either that the charge is going up, or that the charge is going down.

As far as I can tell, the only way to know which of the two the blinking means, is to have been looking at the MTTP to see which way the numbers are going...

But... at least now I know it's not a worrying thing.

You know what, you were right about waiting for summer... it turns out we're having some summer like days... and that's actually pretty typical periodically.

I was trying to heat my house up today when I suddenly realized that all I had to do was open the door.

Which reminds me, I probably better go close it, now.

I'm going to print tomorrow.

crewzer

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Have you ever gotten an equalize cycle in ? you may want to try one of those (if you have flooded cells) Plan on a distilled water top-off afterwards, and acid mist to clean off your hands.

Karen's four batteries are size 4D gel (VRLA), and her controller is a BZ MPPT500. The batteries should not be equalized (at least, not in the traditional flooded-cell sense), and the controller doesn't include an EQ function.

HTH,
Jim / crewzer

mike95490

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

re your type of printer

If it's from HP, and called a Laser Jet, and you replace a 9" wide, heavy cartridge, that is a Toner Cartridge, costs $60 or more, comes in a large cardboard box half the size of the printer, you have a laser printer with heated fusor roller.

If it takes a little cartridge with a number like 27 on it, and is same size or smaller than your fist, that is a liquid ink cartridge, about $30.

Please, do not put a flame/candle under a fabric tent or cardboard box. I suggested a cardboard box only as a way to contain the printers own heat.

Burning fuel combines with oxygen in the air, to make moisture, that's how you can end up with more moisture than the fuel you started with.

Are you anywhere near Santa Fe? I'm going there next week on vacation with my wife, and could swing by and give you my opinion of what's hooked up, and what to do with the extra wires, how to read the meter & the lights.

icarus

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

You could go to the Sally Anne or a used electronics store and get a cheap injet that uses way less energy. I use a Canon BJC that has it's own battery and it works great. Not too slow, and it only draws about 5 watts when it's plugged in.

Icarus

Lasers are great when you want a bunch of copies fast, but they are energy hogs and most require a true sine wave inverter.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

mike90045 wrote: »

re your type of printer

If it's from HP, and called a Laser Jet, and you replace a 9" wide, heavy cartridge, that is a Toner Cartridge, costs $60 or more, comes in a large cardboard box half the size of the printer, you have a laser printer with heated fusor roller.

Yes, it's an "or more" -- it's really heavy or I could bring it in here.

If it takes a little cartridge with a number like 27 on it, and is same size or smaller than your fist, that is a liquid ink cartridge, about $30.

Please, do not put a flame/candle under a fabric tent or cardboard box. I suggested a cardboard box only as a way to contain the printers own heat.

No, I wasn't going to do that. I understood what you meant about the machine creating some heat, so that if I contained the heat it would warm the metal of the machine...

Burning fuel combines with oxygen in the air, to make moisture, that's how you can end up with more moisture than the fuel you started with.

OH! I'm so glad you explained. I've been puzzling over that.

The year I had Crock Pots in each room there was a lot of moisture in the air because I had to refill them at least once a day... I was leaving the covers off. So by Spring I could see there were drawbacks to the idea... (i.e. there was a lot of moisture on my windows.)

Are you anywhere near Santa Fe?

I live in Santa Fe. But toward the city limits on the south side... near the Rodeo Grounds.

I'm going there next week on vacation with my wife, and could swing by and give you my opinion of what's hooked up, and what to do with the extra wires, how to read the meter & the lights.

Oh, wow! I mean, WOW! That would be dynamite. It would be great to know what's going on with what I have.

I wish I'd been able to finish out my solar room... the battery box is supposed to look like a window seat... but I totally ran out of money.

I'm sooooo glad I can print today. I'm pretty sure it will be warm enough. I need to do court things. (basically re my condo)

You know, when I was going to get solar, I spoke with a wide range of the instlallers here, and learned that some won't even look at a system under $17,000... one man sounded great, but then he disappeared for a bit and came back to say he'd been partying... I did look at the web page for the ... I forget what it's called, but like an association of accredited solar people, and none of them worked out. Many were actually a bit to far away, like in Taos.

I'm sooooo excited.

I'm so daunted by cleaning tasks ahead.

I better post this and go see how my candles are doing. : )

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

icarus wrote: »

You could go to the Sally Anne or a used electronics store and get a cheap injet that uses way less energy. I use a Canon BJC that has it's own battery and it works great. Not too slow, and it only draws about 5 watts when it's plugged in.

Icarus

Lasers are great when you want a bunch of copies fast, but they are energy hogs and most require a true sine wave inverter.

Hi Icarus,

I'm pretty much housebound. So it costs me $15 to $20 an hour to hire someone to drive me... and no one will do it for one hour.

I have a LexMark ink jet. The ink ran out so fast it used to leave me in the lurch all the time. So when I sold my rental I bought my LaserJet, which I love. It is a dynamite, reliable, hard working machine. It has saved me so many headaches, and it's really fast.

My appeal "Corrected Revised Brief" was 40 pages, and I had to have a lot of copies, and it printed it very quickly. My old printers were sooooo slow in comparison.

I have true sine. I got it so I could use my laser printer. : )

crewzer

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

All,

I think it’s great that so many of us have offered up so much time and effort to trying to help Karen understand, maintain and operate her PV energy system. I’d also like to offer a big “Bravo!” to Mike for offering to visit Karen and provide on-site assistance.

At the same time, I’m concerned that some of the discussions wander a bit too far from the this forum’s area of interest, which is “the basics of solar electricity, solar in general, and PV systems”. Related health and safety issue are probably fine, but printer maintenance, the cost of hiring a driver, and miscellaneous legal issues are outside the forum’s purpose and areas of interest.

My fundamental concern is that our PV forum not descend into a free-for-all for any and all topics. Accordingly, I ask that we reign in the non-PV energy discussions. Feel free to conduct those discussions directly via e-mail.

Thanks, all.
Jim / crewzer

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

crewzer wrote: »

All,

I think it’s great that so many of us have offered up so much time and effort to trying to help Karen understand, maintain and operate her PV energy system. I’d also like to offer a big “Bravo!” to Mike for offering to visit Karen and provide on-site assistance.

At the same time, I’m concerned that some of the discussions wander a bit too far from the this forum’s area of interest, which is “the basics of solar electricity, solar in general, and PV systems”. Related health and safety issue are probably fine, but printer maintenance, the cost of hiring a driver, and miscellaneous legal issues are outside the forum’s purpose and areas of interest.

My fundamental concern is that our PV forum not descend into a free-for-all for any and all topics. Accordingly, I ask that we reign in the non-PV energy discussions. Feel free to conduct those discussions directly via e-mail.

Thanks, all.
Jim / crewzer

Oh. Sorry.

I felt that the printer questions were somehow related... but I forget how. Probably because I wore down my pv system batteries with an attempt to heat with solar energy I thought I had, but didn't...

I feel that some of the time I'm viewed as making poor choices or decisions either because I'm a woman or because of my disability. So when I feel my decision making is being called into question, I try to provide explanations of why I made the decisions I did.

I clearly make huge numbers of mistakes that I didn't make when I didn't have a disability, but I also make good decisions. And getting solar was an excellent decision.

Finding this forum was just plain lucky. And I hope that by reviewing your forum on Stumble Upon I will be sending you people who may not only use your forum but possibly buy using your expertise from the people who maintain this forum.

I'm WAY grateful.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

I think I should mention that Mike's proposed visit....

Why, to try to make him look bad?

Mods, please delete this garbage.

crewzer

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

:grr Done.

Jim / crewzer

crewzer

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen,

I deleted your last two posts. It's unfortunate that Mike was unable to visit with you. You have you view of what happened (or didn't happen), and Mike has his. The forum is no place for a public pissing match.

And now, I'm going to lock this thread. It's time to move on.

Regards to all,
Jim / crewzer