I have a battery monitor question...

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

so is that what should be there?

I'm pretty bummed about my batteries being so badly discharged and the monitor being installed wrong...

And, of course, the array being in the wrong place...

Good grief!

It's cold and I don't have light because these guys did this stuff SO badly.

Darn it.

westbranch

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen here is a pic with a line showing what I think is a second red wire.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

westbranch wrote: »

Karen here is a pic with a line showing what I think is a second red wire.

Okay, well of course the question is, what do you think the second red wire is...

The fuse thing has the thick red wire going in on one side and coming out on the other... and the one end is clearly bare wire against the side of my electric box.

In terms of the little wires, I looked at them this morning, and maybe I put it on my site instead of here, but there is no red wire among the little ones.

But... I still wonder about that grey wire from the MPPT and why it's loose in the middle of the picture.

Please would you indicate where you think you see a second red wire.

westbranch

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen click on the attachment to enlarge it.
there is some added text and a line pointing to what I think is another small red wire...

Eric

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

I don't see an attachment

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Oh... found it...

I see why you think that...

I'll go check.

westbranch

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

look at the post I made at 11:47 this morning.

Eric

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Yes, there's a little red wire that goes up into the grey wire that goes up to the battery monitor.

Is that fuse workable? It's so honking big I can't believe that it's appropriate for the size of the rest of the wires...

I just tried to unscrew the phillips screws but my phillips screwdriver is too big, so I have to hold the littlest drill bit and try to do it that way.

westbranch

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen a couple of things:
just read over the instructions for the monitor

1. the wire used should be stranded not solid wire. They used solid. it will work for now but for good performance needs to be changed.

2. Right now that fuse is not doing anything as it is not connected to any other wires. I do not know where it should be connected.

3. without seeing the other end of the black wire, coming from the battery, I can not tell if the green and white do anything. Please send a pic of the other end, it should show a BLUE and a RED wire, possibly connected to the main battery wires. I can not tell from you battery bank picture.

4. I think the you need to geet the installer come back to fix the things that need changing. (the monitor connections, the unconnected grey wire and the ?? extra fuse we see )

cheers
Eric

PS it is best to use a properly sized screw driver on those screws, you dont want to damage them so that they wont come out.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Yes, ...
but no.

I don't want to have anything more to do with him.

What a jerk.

When the fellow who was building my battery box was critical of him because he wasn't there and he didn't give the laborer the right tools, I stuck up for him.

But look what he's done.

The fuse is not nearly as serious as putting my array in the wrong place or getting the monitor so badly installed that my batteries are ruined.

I would just be too angry to speak civilly to him.

What a complete jerk.

westbranch

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen, in the meantime cover over that large RED wire that is loose, If I am right it is a 'hot' wire. You do not want it to short to anything metal, like the Inverter it is close to, that might be connected back to the battery... lots of potential for sparks etc...

Eric

quid_non

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

I'm not an expert, but done some wiring in my time. Based on the photos you posted, it "looks" like:
1. The long grey wire hanging down from the battery indicator "needs" to be connected to another parallel source - another meter, controller, alarm????

2. The large red wire with the fat "black thing" is a fusible link (as mentioned earlier) and will only be "hot" if it has a fuse in it. Pull the black cover off the top of it an look inside - if you see 2 copper bare metal conductors - it does not have a fuse and is not hot. If you see a plastic device with a number on the top, it is hot and can cause serious potential problems if shorted (comes in contact with any grounded metal surface).

No matter what the situation - I'd take the advice already given and "cap" the end of that wire - either use a wire nut or electrical tape.

For what it is worth... call the installer to make it right, better to bite your tounge and "nurse" the wound than have this really nice system not working right.

Hope this helps!

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

westbranch wrote: »

Karen, in the meantime cover over that large RED wire that is loose, If I am right it is a 'hot' wire. You do not want it to short to anything metal, like the Inverter it is close to, that might be connected back to the battery... lots of potential for sparks etc...

Eric

Oh bother! And I was thinking when I was holding that little drill bit that it wouldn't matter if I dropped it.

I think I have some electric caps... I better go look.

I cannot tell you how depressing this is. To have three and a half hours of solar a day, and the batteries ruined when I was being so careful.

And, quite honestly, this is typical work for Santa Fe. I don't know if this is typical for other areas of the country, but here it's par for the course.

You should see the deck fiasco I had.

I haven't boughten one single home here that didn't have some serious, I mean SERIOUS defect.

And now that I was reading on the internet about Gerald Peters, I can see for sure why I couldn't get due process. It's such a matter of money and corruption... one set of rules for money, and no protections for those who are hurt by the ones with the money.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Okay, I've put the cap on.

It just makes me so sad that there's all this sunshine that is no good to me because of the shadow... just a few inches further and it would have been fine.

That makes me even more sad than the damage to my batteries, because the array will be in place for a lifetime.

Darn, oh darn!

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

quid_non wrote: »

I'm not an expert, but done some wiring in my time. Based on the photos you posted, it "looks" like:
1. The long grey wire hanging down from the battery indicator "needs" to be connected to another parallel source - another meter, controller, alarm????

2. The large red wire with the fat "black thing" is a fusible link (as mentioned earlier) and will only be "hot" if it has a fuse in it. Pull the black cover off the top of it an look inside - if you see 2 copper bare metal conductors - it does not have a fuse and is not hot. If you see a plastic device with a number on the top, it is hot and can cause serious potential problems if shorted (comes in contact with any grounded metal surface).

No matter what the situation - I'd take the advice already given and "cap" the end of that wire - either use a wire nut or electrical tape.

For what it is worth... call the installer to make it right, better to bite your tounge and "nurse" the wound than have this really nice system not working right.

Hope this helps!

Thanks for saying my system is nice. I'm so depressed about this.

I'll look inside the fuse container tomorrow. I've put a cap on it.

I'm afraid I didn't quite understand what you wrote about the grey wire from the MPPT that's hanging down...

There's no way I can call him and be civil. The man who built my battery box was highly critical... and I just wouldn't say a bad word... now there are too many bad words straining to get out...

icarus

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Remember that you are (almost) at the worst part of the year for insolation. After the solstice the shading will get better, if I understand your photo properly.

Icarus

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Of course. But the fact is that the installer showed up late, didn't show up for days on end, didn't have the right tools for workers who then sat around... and now my array is in the WRONG place.

He did a horrid job. Just horrid.

And this is when I need the extra current.

What a creep!

westbranch

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen, can you post a clear picture of the battery box showing ALL the wires ? we need this to try to trace what is connected to what.

Eric

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

westbranch wrote: »

Karen, can you post a clear picture of the battery box showing ALL the wires ? we need this to try to trace what is connected to what.

Eric

I put the best picture I could get on my site yesterday...

http://www.health-boundaries-bite.com/Solar.html

I just looked at it, and it's not very good. I'll try again tomorrow... Now that I know how little wires I can barely see turn out to be important.

Thank you.

westbranch

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

try a close up and don't compress it so much, makes it easier to look at when blown up..

Eric

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

westbranch wrote: »

try a close up and don't compress it so much, makes it easier to look at when blown up..

Eric

I began to realize that if the batteries are wired wrong, that it's going to be way over my head to do any alterations... (given that putting the end caps on seemed challenging...)

The weather is warmer today, it's 41 degrees out, so I'm not quite as spooked... and having that list of charge amounts and the percentage of charge they indicate has been GREAT. I'm so thankful for that!

I'm not going to connect the battery monitor right now because I have so little energy (solar energy)... in about three six weeks there will be more sun than this every day...

I have been noticing on the internet that lowering parapets is not unheard of... so maybe my best shot would be to lower the parapet by a couple of inches...

I need to ask my neighbor if he'd allow the parapet on the edge of his garage where it connects to mine, to be lowered... maybe if my workman mended all the stucco cracks at the top of his parapet where it faces my house....

We'll see.

I've gotten in a supply of candles and a couple of thermometers... and it turns out that its 5 degrees warmer in my room than the other rooms ... apparently that's just from me being in here.

This morning I quickly heated a large stainless steel bowl of water on a candle and then put the hot bowl in the livingroom, thinking that the goldfish might like a little warmth.

Also, I ran into a "tiny house" web site where the designer used marine heaters ... and that was very interesting. They have a very small profile and appear to be efficient. And, they are pretty reasonably priced, way less than a wood stove.

So I was thinking of getting a Big Buddy... but now that the candle was so quick... maybe I should just get a couple more stainless steel bowls...

Oh... this is sort of funny... I needed my hammer today and could not find it. I looked everywhere... then I remembered that when they were putting my solar in they asked me if I had a hammer and could they use it... and after that when I didn't get it back I asked for it quite a few times... with no luck... and I guess I forgot about it in the end... and, I don't have my hammer.

So it goes.

I am resigned to the fact that I'll have to get new batteries years sooner than I had planned.

Oh... once batteries are worn down, do they hold less of a charge? as well as holding it for less long?

n3qik

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

"LPM 10u battery monitor.
12/24/48 volt ranges ."

From their website.

I wander if it is set for a 12v system instead of a 24v system. I could not find a wiring diagram on their site. My guess there would be only two wires from the monitor to the battery bank.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Thank you for looking. I appreciate it.

I don't think I can handle changing it right now. I'm pretty sure you are right. Only since I drained my batteries when I thought my monitor was working, only it wasn't, I don't have very much power now, so I may as well not run the monitor.

Thank you a LOT for your reply.

This is a pretty good forum. I reviewed it on Stumble Upon so that others would find it. I got such good information here (and just a bit of grief.)

Thank you again.

crewzer

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Oh... once batteries are worn down, do they hold less of a charge? as well as holding it for less long?

Unfortunately, the answer to both questions is "Yes".

Regards,
Jim / crewzer

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

crewzer wrote: »

Unfortunately, the answer to both questions is "Yes".

Regards,
Jim / crewzer

Yes... that's what I began to think... At first I was thinking, wrongly, that they would be just like before, only they'd be like that for fewer years...

Then I began to realize that it would probably be more like my computer battery, which when it runs out gradually becomes all but useless... so then it's just a matter of time till it's no longer bearable.

Well... Thanks.

I hope lots of people come here from Stumble Upon

Maybe some will buy their systems through you. That would be good.

crewzer

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen,

I’m sorry that your PV energy system hasn’t worked out as you expected. I wish I could drop by and spruce it up a bit for you, but that’s just not practical when ~1,800 miles away.

It would appear that your PV system doesn’t meet your electrical energy needs. Additionally, the system appears to be slowing dying. In the meantime, you’re living in an environment that is unhealthily cold, and you’re using candles to heat water. The real winter is yet to come!

Replacement batteries won’t be cheap. Figure on somewhere between $1,000 and $1,500 to replace the four you have. This will be in addition to the several thousands of dollars you’ve already spent to buy the system and have it installed.

At this point, therefore, I’d like to suggest that you objectively assess your situation and environment. While I’m sympathetic to the notion of “fighting back”, I’m not sure that falling on one’s sword to single-digitly “salute” the local power company makes much sense under the circumstances.

In the long run, it might be possible for you to build, operate, and maintain a PV system that meets most/all of your energy needs. We can help you with a range of ideas. One option would be a grid-interactive system that results in “net zero” energy use. In effect, you’d use the grid as a big battery, selling to the grid in the summer and buying from it in the winter.

In the meantime, however, I would like to suggest that you reconnect your home to the grid so that you have enough electrical energy to meet you basic needs. You could then buy a charger to help charge, recover, and maintain your batteries.

Although your present inclination may be to stick it to the local utility and deny ‘em any more of your resources, I just don’t believe that your health and safety are worth that price. Instead, I recommend you reconnect, then figure out an alternative energy source, deploy and verify it’s operation, and then “pull the plug”, so to speak.

Please think this through.
Jim / crewzer

BB.

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

Karen,

I am 100% with Jim on this too... Besides the possible damage to your home (condensation in walls/wood, burst pipes from freezing weather, mildew, molds and fungus, etc. which could lead the eventual condemnation of your, and possibly your neighbor's property), your own heath is at stake from the cold and molds.

Your solar system is an expensive reaction to your present troubles. Even if your solar system operated 100% for supplying your needs, the actual costs for the electricity would be, very roughly, 4-10x your costs if you purchased the power from your local utility.

Get some help from your social worker and get back on your feet (so to speak). There are many things in life that are unfair, but don't let those problems cause you to hurt yourself in the process.

Take care Karen,
-Bill

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

crewzer wrote: »

Karen,

I’m sorry that your PV energy system hasn’t worked out as you expected. I wish I could drop by and spruce it up a bit for you, but that’s just not practical when ~1,800 miles away.

It would appear that your PV system doesn’t meet your electrical energy needs. Additionally, the system appears to be slowing dying. In the meantime, you’re living in an environment that is unhealthily cold, and you’re using candles to heat water. The real winter is yet to come!

Replacement batteries won’t be cheap. Figure on somewhere between $1,000 and $1,500 to replace the four you have. This will be in addition to the several thousands of dollars you’ve already spent to buy the system and have it installed.

At this point, therefore, I’d like to suggest that you objectively assess your situation and environment. While I’m sympathetic to the notion of “fighting back”, I’m not sure that falling on one’s sword to single-digitly “salute” the local power company makes much sense under the circumstances.

In the long run, it might be possible for you to build, operate, and maintain a PV system that meets most/all of your energy needs. We can help you with a range of ideas. One option would be a grid-interactive system that results in “net zero” energy use. In effect, you’d use the grid as a big battery, selling to the grid in the summer and buying from it in the winter.

In the meantime, however, I would like to suggest that you reconnect your home to the grid so that you have enough electrical energy to meet you basic needs. You could then buy a charger to help charge, recover, and maintain your batteries.

Although your present inclination may be to stick it to the local utility and deny ‘em any more of your resources, I just don’t believe that your health and safety are worth that price. Instead, I recommend you reconnect, then figure out an alternative energy source, deploy and verify it’s operation, and then “pull the plug”, so to speak.

Please think this through.
Jim / crewzer

The thing is that my system does meet my electrical needs. I over used it due to trusting the installation of the battery monitor to have been correct. It was not.

Boiling water over a candle is fine. So is cooking over a candle. You believe it isn't because you don't have experience with it. Truly, it's fine.

I don't know, it was 14 degrees the other night and I was pretty cozy in my tent. I now understand why there were four posters... I'm sure in the old days it was to facilitate tenting the bed.

The power company shut me off and left me with no phone, heat or light. I will not encourage that kind of mistreatment of people by paying them and giving them power over me again.

It was much colder when they did that because I was unprepared. I didn't have light. No phone to call for help, and the PNM man laughed when I said I didn't have phone.

They could have had their money by waiting two days as I asked so I could transfer money. But they preferred to punish me for being poor. Well, I would much rather be comfortable in my tent than a peasant under their control.

I'm happy.

The only problem I have is how to run my laser printer when it needs to be... I forget how warm it needs to be, but way warmer than me. So ... That's still a challenge.

I love challenges. I hate to be subjugated by people who put force before ethics.

My grandfather was friends with Barry Goldwater. I mention that as an aside since it appears this forum may be out of Arizona.

I have a new batter and MPPT question, but I'm redoing a bit of my site and I should stick with it.

Thank you again, very much, for your help. You guys were great. I can understand that the fellow who began attacking me slipped under the radar.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

BB. wrote: »

Karen,

I am 100% with Jim on this too... Besides the possible damage to your home (condensation in walls/wood, burst pipes from freezing weather, mildew, molds and fungus, etc. which could lead the eventual condemnation of your, and possibly your neighbor's property), your own heath is at stake from the cold and molds.

Your solar system is an expensive reaction to your present troubles. Even if your solar system operated 100% for supplying your needs, the actual costs for the electricity would be, very roughly, 4-10x your costs if you purchased the power from your local utility.

Get some help from your social worker and get back on your feet (so to speak). There are many things in life that are unfair, but don't let those problems cause you to hurt yourself in the process.

Take care Karen,
-Bill

Okay, your imagination is getting away from you. My house is above freezing inside.

I take it you think I somehow spent over $8000 on a solar system thinking it would be cheaper than paying $700 a year for power company power...

Hmmm.

I'm bad at maths, and I figure that it's proof that opposites attract that I lived with a pure mathematician whom I met when he was here thinking for our government, but I'm not that bad.

Every time that someone pays a power company and gives them the finger rather than actually taking a stand they are hurting some poor person who is being abused by the power companies.

Why on earth our government gave huge tax breaks to the oil and gas companies is beyond me. Probably it relates to corruption.

In any case, I encourage you to take moral stands. For the good of all.

System2

Re: I have a battery monitor question...

BB. wrote: »

Karen,

I am 100% with Jim on this too... Besides the possible damage to your home (condensation in walls/wood, burst pipes from freezing weather, mildew, molds and fungus, etc. which could lead the eventual condemnation of your, and possibly your neighbor's property), your own heath is at stake from the cold and molds.

Your solar system is an expensive reaction to your present troubles. Even if your solar system operated 100% for supplying your needs, the actual costs for the electricity would be, very roughly, 4-10x your costs if you purchased the power from your local utility.

Get some help from your social worker and get back on your feet (so to speak). There are many things in life that are unfair, but don't let those problems cause you to hurt yourself in the process.

Take care Karen,
-Bill

I missed that.

My goodness... my social worker?

I really resent social workers since they need poor people to make a living. I don't think they do the kind of job they should or perhaps believe they will do when they idealistically (if they are ever that) enter the field.

Please don't insult me. I have a brain injury in large part because a well know real estate broker here in Santa Fe developed and built my condo over an old privy pit... and that eventually caused hydrogen sulfide to be in my condo and to damage my nerves.

He has way more power and influence than me, so he's gotten away with it, the way that many in high places in government get away with profit schemes that are unconscionable.