what is the best low speed unit out there now

Options
t12zh
t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
For a home in the country i want a grid tie unit to put up.
I have made a unit from a 1978 chevy truck but will want something more advanced soon.
Skystream 3.7 seams a little much for me.
Want to look at something that works arround the lower wind speeds.
Give me some of the newer units to look at.
Good one's, what do you guys like.
I have to go down to the power CO and sighn an agreement next week for grid tie digital net meter.
Greg

Comments

  • Solar Guppy
    Solar Guppy Solar Expert Posts: 1,989 ✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    There is no such beast as a good performing low speed wind genny

    Just as there is no such thing as a low light good performing solar panel

    You need wind ( or sun ) and lots of it to get useful energy
  • t12zh
    t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    What works the best in the 8 to 15 MPH range.
  • Windsun
    Windsun Solar Expert Posts: 1,164 ✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    What Solar Guppy said is correct. The power you get from wind is a result of the cube of the wind speed, thus making it physically impossible for low speed models to put out much power.
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    What wind speeds are you talking about? I assume that the information from your earlier thread is still correct...
    I have realized that for my area the wind is not that great. they call it Class 2 and will maybe touch on a little of class 3. Wind Power Density (W/m2) = 100 to 150 Speed (b) m/s (mph) = 4.4 (9.0 ) to 5.1 (11.5)

    Remember low speed winds are also low energy content. If you are looking at 6-10 mph winds--I am not sure that you will find any "home" unit that will give you more than a hand full of watts reliably.

    Are there any successful wind installations near your home? Do they have a good bit of data (ideally, at least 1 year history) where you can compare the output per $$$ vs a solar installation?

    In the end, it is your money. But spending $5,000 for a wind turbine vs the $5,500 for power over the last 10 years---does not make any financial sense. I am not sure there is any home style wind turbine that will last ten years, or generate anywhere near 400-500 kWhrs per month (assuming ~$0.10 per kWhr) over the next 10 years in your wind environment.

    Solar PV panels are going to cost more up front, but should last 25 years vs the 3-5 years that seems typical for wind turbines (ready to rebuild/replace that wind turbine 5-8x over the next two and a half decades?).

    In the end, if you have the "extra cash" available to conduct your own experiments with wind power, by all means, go for it!

    If, however, you will be financially harmed by this project--please look at the financial implications closely.

    Personally, I installed solar PV grid tie because it was getting close to a financial wash (base utility power is $0.12 per kWhr)--especially if I wanted more electrical power in the future (electric car, use A/C as we get older, etc.). California has very punishing rates if you use more than 300 kWhrs per month. Above 1,000 kWhrs per month, it gets up to $0.30 to $0.50 per kWhr and my installation (after rebates) provides me ~400 kWhrs / month at ~$0.14-$0.17 per kWhr (assuming I have to replace the GT inverter once or twice in the next 25 years).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • t12zh
    t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    Thankyou
    What i am looking for is what works ( most efficient )
    the best in 8 to 15 MPH wind.
    In that MPH range.
    Greg
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    Well, here is a 10kW Bergey data sheet (PDF) that produces about 1 kW in 12 MPH wind...

    If your "average" wind speed is 8-9 MPH at the top of your tower, it will produce in excess of 400-500 kWhrs per month...

    The Skystream 3.7 (pdf) only generates ~250 watts in a 12 mph wind...

    The Skystream will only generate ~100-150 kWhrs per month in 8-9 MPH "average" wind...

    If you want a lot of power from low speed wind, you are going to need a very big propeller (swept area) on the wind turbine.

    Plus, take monthly numbers with a large pinch of salt (look for independent validation of any wind turbine manufacturer's wind data--for some reason, most mfg data shows much higher generation figures...).

    Both units have a 5 year warranty.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • Telco
    Telco Solar Expert Posts: 201 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    Might also look at some of the vertical windmills, not just the horizontals. They have a lot of advantages over the horizontals according to my reading, sadly not due to personal experience. I have never used these myself, just passing along links I thought worth saving.

    http://www.earthcareproduct.com/wind_vertical_small.html

    Might also check these guys out, looks like you can configure the way you want including many different blade designs.

    http://www.tlgwindpower.com
  • t12zh
    t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    I have to say that is a positive responce.

    Vertical Axis Wind Turbine

    I like that idea.
    Greg
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    Here is an earlier thread on vertical wind turbines... The one in the Earth Care Products link is a PacWind vertical turbine.

    And some PacWind discussion here.

    And Jim's original link to information from PacWind...

    I am not too thrilled with the extent of documentation and their sales material information/video...

    While I am sure there are working vertical wind turbines out there--I have not seen any specifications for one that produces any more power (and frequently less) than the standards horizontal wind turbine. The one advantage for VWT appears to be that they can continue to generate near max rated power in high wind (>35-40 mph) conditions without the need to shut down/furl like most HWT need to do.

    In the end, take my negative opinions about PacWind, and vertical wind turbines in general, with a grain of salt. IMHO, most VWT organizations seem to be more marketing machines than engineering organizations turning out kWhrs on ridge lines.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • t12zh
    t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    TLG Windpower Products Is a great web sight.
    It was very usefull.
    Thanks again
  • t12zh
    t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    Well i have learned lot here.
    Looks like i need a WindBlue Permanent Magnet Alternator for the unit i have built already ( Learned about why to run 3-phase AC )
    EBAY For 200.00 Plus rectifier box (sold separately)


    (((((((This guy on EBAY Looks good for that.)))))))
    His handle is windbluepower on EBAY
    http://cgi.ebay.com/Wind-Turbine-Generator-PMA-Permanent-Magnet-Alternator_W0QQitemZ180213474412QQihZ008QQcategoryZ121837QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

    I also am going to go build a Vertical Axis Wind Turbine to play with. I have a lot of the material already.
    Greg
  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now
    t12zh wrote: »
    I also am going to go build a Vertical Axis Wind Turbine to play with. I have a lot of the material already.
    Greg

    Keep us posted about how it comes out.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

  • t12zh
    t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    Well Jeromy from All Solar in my area came to my house Friday and see my property and wind generator project i built and installed.

    I am going to try and load a photo of what i did.

    He said i need to look at 48 volt and not the 12 volt i built and put up.
    He sugest to keep the 12 volt but find a use for it.
    Inverter he sugested for my home was a Outback GVFX 36-48.
    Still working with Power Co on getting a Net Meter hooked up also.
    That is where i am now.
    Need 48 volt info so i cand build a large vertical one.
  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    you will find that vawt are not as efficient as the horizontal types normally seen. also getting the vertical heights can also be problematic. it can still be done though and one advantage with the vawt is that it is directionless, that is in that it doesn't need aimed. you can research it and 2 common names you will encounter are savonius and darius(spelling). these are generally lower in rpms than that of the horizontal types so some gearing may be needed.
  • t12zh
    t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    OK
    I am still working on a few things

    1) On the one i have up now i picked up a sheet of 1/8 inch thick aluminum.
    I am thinking about going to three blade's on it instead of the two blade i have now.
    2) I think that by the time i get done with this project that i could have bought one.
    I do have a nice base done now. cost 175.00 for concrete that is 3' foot in dia. and 6 ft deep with 6-4' long ancore bolts 1" dia.
    Spent one weekend building a nice tilt up base out of 1" plate steel.

    Aluminum 28' pole was free as was a lot of other stuff for the project that 6other friends helped out with.

    I am still going to build a Vertical unit but want to finish this one first.
    I do have a good start thow, i have two 5 1/2 inch ouside dia. heavy wall pipe to go 80' up.

    3) I need a template for making the 3 blade's.
    Where can i look for template.


    Greg
  • Telco
    Telco Solar Expert Posts: 201 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    Might try the otherpower.com forum, they are all about making their own wind generators, including hand winding the copper and pouring their own resins to make the alternators. They also make their own blades, someone there likely can help you with it. Them folks is hardcore do-it-yerselfers. ;) Wish I were sometimes.

    I'll be looking forward to your vertical windmill attempt, and will be very interested in how much power it produces in how much wind.
  • t12zh
    t12zh Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    I am 50/50 on building and buying what i need.
    I would like to find a 48 Volt unit to use on the Vertical unit, where can i find them---- what do i look for.
    Some stuff i can make and some i will have to buy.
    Greg
  • n3qik
    n3qik Solar Expert Posts: 741 ✭✭
    Options
    Re: what is the best low speed unit out there now

    I looked on eBay and copied a set. Most will have a curve to them, We have a 8' break at work, so I just did 2 bends to get close to what I saw on eBay.

    I too got a lot of free parts for mine. The fip side is I put WAY more time in building it that I will ever get electricity from it.