Total new guy in need of help.

Islander · August 2014

Hello all. I find myself in what may be a bit of a uncommon situation (I could be wrong). I've just received all the parts i ordered to run my home off solar energy and now i'm a bit concerned. I've looked all over the internet but i can't seem to find any clear cut answers to the questions i have, it doesn't help that i know nothing about anything in terms of electricity. I live on an island that is isolated from any professional help so everyone are do it yourselfer (Okay we do in fact have a few electricians). Due to our isolation we sometimes rig things up because we may lack the proper part needed and that is where i have some concerns. Here is everything I ordered:

4 30 volt, 8 amp, 255 watt panels
4 AGM 6 volt 255 AHR deep cycle batteries
1 Aims PICOGLF60W24V240VS 6000 Watt Pure Sine Inverter Charger 24V Split Phase
and this http://store.mwands.com/charge-controllers/all-in-one-charge-controller-board/

My questions are:

1. The amps of the panels is basically the rate they can charge the batteries?

2. The battery bank will be 24 volts, is it alright to use 30volt panels?

3. If the 4 batteries are linked up in series-parallel, I could only get 12 volts as opposed to 24 volts if i just hooked it up in series correct? Assuming you only get 12 volt for linking the batteries in series-parallel, is there any way to get S-P to work in such a way to get 24 volts? I would really like to have those aph stacked but if I'm understanding this guide right (http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/articles/battery-articles/battery-bank-tutorial.html.
), i can't do it With only 4 batteries. i would need another 4 correct?

Sorry If these questions come off as stupid but i'm completely in the dark in these matters. Three of my dad's friends are coming to hook everything up. two of them have setups of their own and everything seems to work fine with them. But i just felt that i should educate myself in this matter seeing as there is a chance that despite two of the guys who are going to help hook me up have panels of their own, they may not have it set up as good as it could be (Or not hooked up safely to begin with).

Cariboocoot · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

Welcome to the forum.

You're missing a critical piece of equipment: a charge controller. Specifically an MPPT type charge controller as the panel Vmp of 30 is 'not right' for a battery system. It goes between the panels and the batteries and regulates the charge. For a 24 Volt system you will need to wire the panels as two parallel strings of two in series. All together you will have a 1020 Watt array capable of about 32 Amps on a 24 Volt system, more than enough for a string of 255 Amp hour batteries.

Frankly that's a pretty good start to a good 3kW hour system.

Except the inverter. The AIMS inverter is a piece of junk. Get rid of it.

Islander · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

Thank you very much fort the quick reply. Well i won't be able to add anything to the setup anytime soon. Hopefully what i have now could last a good 5 years, buy which time, the system would have paid for itself 3+ times over. Would a controller like this do the job? http://www.bluepacificsolar.com/charge-controller/morningstar-tsmppt-60.html.

Would the charge controller i already have be able to work with another one or do i have to get rid of it? It's a real bumper to have to take the thing down when ever the time comes. With voltage not right, just what could happen later down the road?

vtmaps · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

Islander wrote: »

and this http://store.mwands.com/charge-controllers/all-in-one-charge-controller-board/

Cariboocoot wrote: »

You're missing a critical piece of equipment: a charge controller

Islander did specify a charge controller in his post. But like the Aims inverter, it is unsatisfactory.

--vtMaps

Cariboocoot · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

vtmaps wrote: »

Islander did specify a charge controller in his post. But like the Aims inverter, it is unsatisfactory.

--vtMaps

I did not notice that. Thought the link was for the AIMS.
But yes, that's junk too.

Photowhit · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

Stop now and tell us what you want to run? We can figure out if this is enough system for you.
Where are you located? We can tell you what you can expect out of your solar panels with this information, NO you will not get rated wattage on par likely never.
In series voltage adds, but not amperage,... in parallel amperage adds but not voltage.

westbranch · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

There are a lot of other Controller units of equal or better quality. Prices run from $300 to $800 +- depending on what you want to run...

To properly design a solar system you must start with the loads to supply power for.
Lights are a snap to figure out, BUT do you want a refrigerator? THAT is a totally different fish! You will need to be model specific with your data.

hth

Islander · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

I live in the Bahamas, we tend to have a ton of sun for the most part. As for what we're looking to run:

2 1000 watt 10 amp AC (not at the same time their usage of course depends on how hot it is)
1 115 volt 6.5 amp refrigerator (whirlpool)
2 21 inch HDTV (these run for fairly long periods of time)
1 Computer
1 Whirlpool washer
1 Microwave oven

Ican't seem to find the exact info for The TV, Washer, oven and mirowave, But really I'm more concerned with how well the AC and the refrigerator will hold up with constant use since just about everything else don't run constantly. I'm expecting to be reserved until i get more batteries and and panels.

zoneblue · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

ok, yep a pity we found you a week or two late.

your going to have to nail your loads down a bit tighter.What we need is Wh/day for each appliance. Without that, you and we are just peeing into the wind,

its clear from your post that this system isnt a toy/hobby but meant to run your house, thus it merits a sound design and the very best bang for buck components, and somewhere in your future you need a person to wear the engineers hat. if thats you the best thing you can do now is spend some time reading here, the forum contains a huge wealth of knowledge, but it will take patience, there are no short cuts, especillay if you value the safety of your home and family.

Islander wrote: »

I live in the Bahamas, we tend to have a ton of sun for the most part. As for what we're looking to run:

2 1000 watt 10 amp AC (not at the same time their usage of course depends on how hot it is)
1 115 volt 6.5 amp refrigerator (whirlpool)
2 21 inch HDTV (these run for fairly long periods of time)
1 Computer
1 Whirlpool washer
1 Microwave oven

Ican't seem to find the exact info for The TV, Washer, oven and mirowave, But really I'm more concerned with how well the AC and the refrigerator will hold up with constant use since just about everything else don't run constantly. I'm expecting to be reserved until i get more batteries and and panels.

Photowhit · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

Islander wrote: »

I live in the Bahamas, we tend to have a ton of sun for the most part. As for what we're looking to run:

2 1000 watt 10 amp AC (not at the same time their usage of course depends on how hot it is)
1 115 volt 6.5 amp refrigerator (whirlpool)
2 21 inch HDTV (these run for fairly long periods of time)
1 Computer
1 Whirlpool washer
1 Microwave oven

It would appear that you will need a much bigger system, I'm not sure what the demand will be on your Air conditioners, but consider a 30% duty cycle, or that they will run 30% of the day, that would be 1 Kw x 14.4hours = 14.4 Kwh (24hx.3=7.2h x 2 units = 14.4hours)

Solar systems are not 100% efficient. Panels tend to produce roughly 75% of their wattage, batteries are only 80-85% efficient, and inverters on 85-90% efficient, so you only have perhaps 50% of the energy/wattage as usable power to run loads, your 1000 watts of panels, assuming 6 hours, on average of sunshine, will provide 3 kwh's of energy. Your air conditioners will require 14+ at a 30% duty cycle.

For example, I run a small air conditioner around the clock when it's sunny in the summer time, likely 3-40% duty cycle, it draws only 430-500 watts running, I also have a energy hungry, fridge that lives in the unair-conditioned section of my home and likely pulls 2+Kwhs a day and other loads(Tv, Laptop, washer, water heater as an opportunity load) bring a daily usage up to 10+Kwhs in the summer time. My system has 4kw array, and a 800ah 24volt battery bank(this would be under sized if our heat didn't come with sun)

Islander · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

Thank you again for all the info. The set up isn't the end game for my home, i'm looking to have 10-14 panels total and more batteries. I had a feeling that what i have now may not have been quite correct. I pretty much mimicked what i saw my dad's friends had but when i saw tutorials and the items with my own eyes i started have doubts. On the bright side, it seems i won't need to get too much additional equipment from what i originally planned which is a big relief.

Cariboocoot · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

Islander wrote: »

I live in the Bahamas, we tend to have a ton of sun for the most part. As for what we're looking to run:

2 1000 watt 10 amp AC (not at the same time their usage of course depends on how hot it is)
1 115 volt 6.5 amp refrigerator (whirlpool)
2 21 inch HDTV (these run for fairly long periods of time)
1 Computer
1 Whirlpool washer
1 Microwave oven

Ican't seem to find the exact info for The TV, Washer, oven and mirowave, But really I'm more concerned with how well the AC and the refrigerator will hold up with constant use since just about everything else don't run constantly. I'm expecting to be reserved until i get more batteries and and panels.

Yeah, the A/C units will not run from a 3kW hour system. Even one of them running for 1/3 of the day: 8kW hours.

The other items would be fine, except for the washing machine. They can be pretty big power users too.

The Bahamas uses North American power standard: 240/120 VAC 60 Hz. Therefor you can get a Kill-A-Watt meter and measure those plug-in loads under real use conditions. It will be a big help.

Be prepared for needing a 12kW hour system, or even larger.

Which brings up the question: Got grid? Because if you do the solar may not be worthwhile investment, depending on the cost and stability of the grid power. Or grid-tie may make more sense for offsetting those big electric bills, if it is allowed.

zoneblue · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

Cariboocoot wrote: »

Which brings up the question: Got grid? Because if you do the solar may not be worthwhile investment, depending on the cost and stability of the grid power. Or grid-tie may make more sense for offsetting those big electric bills, if it is allowed.

Do we have a sticky for this? More and more people seem to be asking about hybrid/ grid backup systems.

Cariboocoot · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

zoneblue wrote: »

Do we have a sticky for this? More and more people seem to be asking about hybrid/ grid backup systems.

I don't know how we could nail it down to a sticky as prices on both sides of the equation vary by location and keep changing over time. You have to look at the per kW hour cost from the serving utility (and only that because GT will not displace base costs) and then work out the cost of an equivalent-providing system amortized over the lifespan, taking into account anything like tax credits.

The one thing people really need to understand is that solar power is not free.
It isn't even cheap.

westbranch · August 2014

Re: Total new guy in need of help.

How about

Title "Want to have a Solar system and have grid but want to be Off Grid'' or something along that vein

Total new guy in need of help.

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