Generator & Iota Battery Charger

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Mountain Don
Mountain Don Solar Expert Posts: 494 ✭✭✭
in Off Grid Solar & Battery Systems #1
I have a generator that is rated at 2800 watts; Onan Microlite 2800. I have used it with an Iota DLS-55 (12 VDC 55 ampere) battery charger. There is a high initial inrush current and the generator handles that well. (Iota specs state; Maximum AC Current (@108Vac) = 13.4 amps with an inrush maximum = 30 amps. )

Now I want to use a 24 VDC Iota on a 24 VDC battery string. I would like to use the 40 amp DLS-27-40 as it suits the battery capacity best. I wonder how the 2800 watt generator would handle that? (Iota specs on the DLS-27-40 are; Maximum AC Current (@108Vac) = 19.5 with an inrush of 40 amps). The generator could handle the 19.5 amps but I do wonder what would happen with the initial inrush surge. I might be better off as far as the generator goes, with the DLS-27-25 model charger.

Does anyone have any experience to base an opinion on?

Thanks
Northern NM, 624 watts PV, The Kid CC, GC-2 batteries @ 24 VDC, Outback VFX3524M
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  • vtmaps
    vtmaps Solar Expert Posts: 3,741 ✭✭✭✭
    #2
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger

    Iota makes a good, inexpensive charger, that works very well on grid power, but as you realize there are some issues with using it with a small generator. And it's not just the inrush... the Iota has poor power factor... if your generator can handle the inrush you will find that the Iota uses up most of the capacity of your generator even though it's only delivering about 1000 watts to your battery.

    I can see from your signature that you need a generator... 600 watts of panel is not enough to charge 630 ah of battery at 24 volts. Why do you not want to use your Outback to charge your battery?

    I don't know of any chargers that are as cheap as the Iota without the PF and inrush issues. There are some industrial chargers that cost a bit more and might work OK to bulk up the batteries... look into forklift battery chargers. Another option (but more expensive) is to buy a modified sine wave inverter/charger and use it as a charger.

    --vtMaps
    4 X 235watt Samsung, Midnite ePanel, Outback VFX3524 FM60 & mate, 4 Interstate L16, trimetric, Honda eu2000i
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #3
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger

    back in the old days, in high school electronics shop, we built a "Fuse Saver" to use for a new project's "first power up". It consisted of a light bulb socket and a shorting switch across it. Power came in, hot side went to the ctr pin of the socket, the ring of the socket continued to the narrow blade of an outlet. The neutral of the outlet went to the neutral of the line cord.
    To use, you install a 100 -500W bulb, and it would limit the amount of juice a potentially faulty gizmo could consume, saving a trip to the fuse box.
    Placing a 250W bulb (heat lamp?) in the socket would limit the inrush somewhat and after 5 seconds , you throw the shorting switch to bypass the bulb.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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  • Mountain Don
    Mountain Don Solar Expert Posts: 494 ✭✭✭
    #4
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger
    vtmaps wrote: »

    Why do you not want to use your Outback to charge your battery?

    --vtMaps


    Good eye.... and thank you.. I left out the detail that the system was whacked by some big lightning and we are working with some temporary equipment as the CC and VFX were toasted along with most of the cabin electronics. The Delta suppressors had their ends blown out, trace carbon tracking at some outlets, coax connections, etc...

    We're using a spare or emergency 24 VDC off-brand inverter until we get the VFX looked at / repaired / replaced or whatever. We're using the spare / backup CC instead of the FM60 that has a whole lot of silica chips rattling about its insides, with 2 panels instead of 3. "Temporary" may be several months as I do not want to place all new high quality equipment in service until I work through the new lightning protection equipment a repaired / new run of 325 ft conduit from PV to CC @ the cabin, and some other things. Hence the desire for a 24 VDC charger. I can keep it as backup or maybe sell it when all is done.


    BTW, the system usually runs fine on the three panels as we do have a lot of good sun here in NM as a rule. The battery bank is a little larger than normal too, as we use the place occasionally over the winter and there is no heat when vacant. The batteries are at outside temperatures all year and with the reduced cold weather power from cold batteries we went with more rather than less. It has been good to us since '09 and the batteries still perform well.



    Maybe I should adjust my sig line
    Northern NM, 624 watts PV, The Kid CC, GC-2 batteries @ 24 VDC, Outback VFX3524M
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  • vtmaps
    vtmaps Solar Expert Posts: 3,741 ✭✭✭✭
    #5
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger
    Mountain Don wrote: »
    I left out the detail that the system was whacked by some big lightning and we are working with some temporary equipment as the CC and VFX were toasted along with most of the cabin electronics. The Delta suppressors had their ends blown out, trace carbon tracking at some outlets, coax connections, etc...

    Understood. Actually your situation is why I have been researching battery chargers... I haven't been hit with lightning yet, but I would like to have a charger on the shelf in case I do get hit. My generator is smaller than yours, so PF correction is important.

    Have you seen this thread? http://forum.solar-electric.com/showthread.php?10123
    The OP ended up with a Meanwell charger, but research that carefully... there have been some issues that others have reported with that charger.

    The Xantrex (Schneider) Truecharge2 look promising, but they are expensive... You could buy a Magnum modified sine wave inverter/charger for just a bit more.

    I have begun researching some of the chargers here: http://www.batterystuff.com/battery-chargers/24-volt/

    One more thing... as you rebuild your system, consider using the Midnite Solar SPD lightning arrestors. The Midnite site has some impressive movies demonstrating their effectiveness.

    --vtMaps
    4 X 235watt Samsung, Midnite ePanel, Outback VFX3524 FM60 & mate, 4 Interstate L16, trimetric, Honda eu2000i
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  • Blackcherry04
    Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    #6
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger
    Mountain Don wrote: »
    I have a generator that is rated at 2800 watts; Onan Microlite 2800. I have used it with an Iota DLS-55 (12 VDC 55 ampere) battery charger. There is a high initial inrush current and the generator handles that well. (Iota specs state; Maximum AC Current (@108Vac) = 13.4 amps with an inrush maximum = 30 amps. )
    It would only be a guess, I believe that it will. I personally have and use a DLS 27-25 @ 24V and a DLS-75 @ 12 V on a Honda EU 2000 without issue. I have 100' of 10/3 from the generator to the charger and I am sure it limits the inrush some. Buy it and try it is about the only way you'll know.

    Your situation is that your Generator is a somewhat " Use it or Lose it " ( fixed RPM ) it's going to use about the same amount of fuel loaded as unloaded at a reasonable level. The DLS-75 @ 12v pulls about 7.50 amps @ full output. You have to be careful with " Smart " chargers as the see any draw on the bank while charging as a fault and will continually drop out or cut back their output, the net amps into your battery bank is less than that of dumb " Poor PF " charger. If you shut the inverter off, they will work ok. No one has any data to support how much the PF really means when running a low PF charger, at best it's just a opinion and guess on paper.
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  • Mountain Don
    Mountain Don Solar Expert Posts: 494 ✭✭✭
    #7
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger
    vtmaps wrote: »

    One more thing... as you rebuild your system, consider using the Midnite Solar SPD lightning arrestors.

    --vtMaps

    Already done that. I have three with one already installed on the AC panel.



    I've heard of the Meanwell... have to have another look. Thanks
    Northern NM, 624 watts PV, The Kid CC, GC-2 batteries @ 24 VDC, Outback VFX3524M
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  • Mountain Don
    Mountain Don Solar Expert Posts: 494 ✭✭✭
    #8
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger
    Blackcherry04 wrote: »
    It would only be a guess, I believe that it will. I .......use a DLS-75 @ 12 V on a Honda EU 2000 without issue.

    That DLS-75 is only 100 watts shy of the DLS-27-40 rating and if the EU2000 runs it fine I believe there is every chance the Onan should work too.

    The Onan was free; liberated from an RV wreck. It's not bad, still quieter than the typical construction generator. I also have a EU2000 but I prefer to leave it with the RV that it was bought to service as needed. Thanks
    Northern NM, 624 watts PV, The Kid CC, GC-2 batteries @ 24 VDC, Outback VFX3524M
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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,749 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #9
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger
    Mountain Don wrote: »
    That DLS-75 is only 100 watts shy of the DLS-27-40 rating and if the EU2000 runs it fine I believe there is every chance the Onan should work too.

    The Onan was free; liberated from an RV wreck. It's not bad, still quieter than the typical construction generator. I also have a EU2000 but I prefer to leave it with the RV that it was bought to service as needed. Thanks

    Don, the iota 40 amp charger is easily run by the EU 2000i. A neighbor has one. The nice thing about what happened to you is you still get to live in that beautiful place.

    When you visited here, the people who burned up in the Telegraph fire in 2008 are still looking at a moonscape. Have a good summer!
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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  • Mountain Don
    Mountain Don Solar Expert Posts: 494 ✭✭✭
    #10
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger

    Thanks for the info, Dave. This July and August so far we have been getting enough rainfall that not only has the fire danger been dampened but now I have road work to do in a couple spots. Better that than a moonscape.
    Northern NM, 624 watts PV, The Kid CC, GC-2 batteries @ 24 VDC, Outback VFX3524M
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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,749 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #11
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    Re: Generator & Iota Battery Charger

    Rainfall? All we get is the DC-10, 5 sky-lift copters and assorted spotters flying overhead. If they ever start using drones at night it will be worse than a jetski with headlights here. Wow to have some mud would be a treat in summer!
    Mountain Don wrote: »
    Thanks for the info, Dave. This July and August so far we have been getting enough rainfall that not only has the fire danger been dampened but now I have road work to do in a couple spots. Better that than a moonscape.
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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