Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

124

Comments

  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    ChrisOlson wrote: »
    I guess I don't understand that either. At C/10 during Bulk the voltage is going to gradually climb to Absorb, and then you hold it at the Absorb voltage. Right? You can't just make that sudden jump.

    Color me confused yet again :blush:

    --
    Chris
    I hear you, I told them I didn't have or know of a charger that had a algorithm like that. It's a blank wall.... I know they are in the business of selling Batteries and not writing manuals. They do have a warranty and a customer to satisfy, you'd think that they would have more interest.
  • ChrisOlsonChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    Well, thanks for posting that. We have an AIMS 3kW inverter/charger in our camper and it absorbs those SRM-4D's at 15.0 volts (non-adjustable). I always thought that was high, as I thought they are 14.4 volt batteries. But after seeing that I should maybe pull them out of the camper (which I hate thought of because they weigh about 150 lbs each), wire them in series, parallel them with the Surrettes and equalize them with a normal absorption charge. :p

    --
    Chris
  • stephendvstephendv Solar Expert Posts: 1,571 ✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    This is the same type of advice I've seen from a lot of traction battery manufacturers because their chargers typically use an IUIa charging curve (Bulk-Absorb-current limited high voltage bulk) and not IU (Bulk-absorb). So I think our RE chargers are not that "real world" in that they're a specialist type of charger that most other industries don't use because it's inefficient and takes too long to charge a battery.
    This is what the IUIa curve looks like (from Trojan): Attachment not found. and we've discussed this before here: http://forum.solar-electric.com/showthread.php?14738-Bulk-Absorb-Float-what-are-we-missing/page2

    I suspect what happens when we ask battery manufacturers what the absorb voltage and time should be, they look at their IUIa charger specs and point to that relatively short-low voltage absorb stage in the middle, fully expecting that our chargers will do a final Constant current stage at the end of absorb. Similarly, when we ask for current limits, most of their spec sheets have a safe current limit of 5A/100Ah of battery which you can use without limiting the voltage, and that's the current normally used for the last constant current charging phase, after absorb has finished.

    IMO, it's the manufacturers of the RE charging equipment that need to update their charging profiles to use this more standard IUIa method, rather than using a simple bulk-absorb-float method.
  • palausystempalausystem Solar Expert Posts: 122 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    One thing I'm trying to understand is the amperage needed for doing a proper full charge:
    People are saying I need an 8 to 10 hr Full absorption based on my 40 peak amps from my panels. This jives with Rolls formula of Time = .42 X C/I where C is battery capacity and I is peak charging amps. First could you confirm for me that we are not including Bulk charging in this equation - I may be totally wrong, but I'm assuming this number is for a battery that has finished its bulk charge and is just beginning to absorb at the set-point, and the timer is counting down beginning now. OK. My generator can feed the batteries maybe 55 amps max. Via the SMA Webbox, I can see that as soon as the absorption timer starts counting down, the amps drop off rapidly. Within 1/2 hr, the amps drop to 33. Within 1 hour, the amps have dropped to 23. My PV behaves the same, dropping from say 36 amps down to 20 pretty quickly.
    So what is the point of getting more panels/amperage if the batteries don't ask for those amps? What am I missing?

    Thanks for your time,

    John
    Off-grid 48v, 3 kw PV, Sunny Island 5048U, SunnyBoy, US Battery RE L16XC  6v, 800ah, Genset: Kohler 8.5 RES propane.
  • ChrisOlsonChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    stephendv - that's interesting. I never knew that before. But it makes sense. I think I have done that manually sometimes to create the IUIa charging profile when running the generator to charge the bank with the inverter/charger. As the current starts to drop off in the end of Absorb and unload the gen I have sometimes hit the EQ button on the inverter charger and bumped the voltage up for about 15 minutes to "finish off" the charging cycle quicker. When I see the current requirement to the charger level off in that short EQ part, and stay there for a bit without changing, I stop the generator and the bank is done.

    I would say it saves a good hour of running time on the gen doing it that way.
    --
    Chris
  • inetdoginetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    So what is the point of getting more panels/amperage if the batteries don't ask for those amps? What am I missing?

    Thanks for your time,

    John

    Well, one advantage of more panels is that they can deliver the bulk charge current limit earlier in the day, even though they are not yet at full capacity. This leaves more hours for the Absorb stage before they can no longer deliver the Absorb current the batteries need. This could make the difference between routinely running the generator for Bulk and only running it occasionally for EQ or to catch up after cloudy days.
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
  • ChrisOlsonChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    inetdog wrote: »
    Well, one advantage of more panels is that they can deliver the bulk charge current limit earlier in the day

    Yes, this is right. I could put 10 kW of installed capacity on my Classic 150 if I wanted to, and the Classic could not use all of it. But it can limit the current to the battery. So the charging current limit can be set to ideal, and in theory with 10 kW installed capacity, I could get the full required charging current early in the day, the controller would not use the full capacity of the panels at solar noon, and it would finish charging before the sun ran out for the day.

    Installing more generating capacity than you need for a perfect day provides a better chance that you can get the job done on a marginal day without running the generator.
    --
    Chris
  • vtmapsvtmaps Solar Expert Posts: 3,741 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    inetdog wrote: »
    Well, one advantage of more panels is that they can deliver the bulk charge current limit earlier in the day, even though they are not yet at full capacity. This leaves more hours for the Absorb stage before they can no longer deliver the Absorb current the batteries need. This could make the difference between routinely running the generator for Bulk and only running it occasionally for EQ or to catch up after cloudy days.

    Considering how cheap panels are (historically), how expensive batteries are, and how expensive it is to run a generator, it makes quite a bit of sense. Could-cheap-panels-alter-the-panel-battery-ratio

    --vtMaps
    4 X 235watt Samsung, Midnite ePanel, Outback VFX3524 FM60 & mate, 4 Interstate L16, trimetric, Honda eu2000i
  • palausystempalausystem Solar Expert Posts: 122 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    That all makes sense.
    I still have one fat question: When people talk about absorption time, are they only referring to the time after the bulk charge, when the voltage is already up at the designated set-point?
    The Sunny Island is the only controller I'm familiar with. I enter the absorption time and it will start counting down once the voltage set-point is reached. So if I am told that I need 9 hrs of absorption, (based on my 40 peak amps of PV) both by people here and by Roll's formula, then we are not including any Bulk charging at all in that 9 hrs.
    Is this correct?
    Thanks,

    John
    Off-grid 48v, 3 kw PV, Sunny Island 5048U, SunnyBoy, US Battery RE L16XC  6v, 800ah, Genset: Kohler 8.5 RES propane.
  • inetdoginetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    That all makes sense.
    I still have one fat question: When people talk about absorption time, are they only referring to the time after the bulk charge, when the voltage is already up at the designated set-point?
    The Sunny Island is the only controller I'm familiar with. I enter the absorption time and it will start counting down once the voltage set-point is reached. So if I am told that I need 9 hrs of absorption, (based on my 40 peak amps of PV) both by people here and by Roll's formula, then we are not including any Bulk charging at all in that 9 hrs.
    Is this correct?
    Thanks,

    John

    Yes. [adding enough characters to allow posting]
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
  • inetdoginetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    ChrisOlson wrote: »
    Yes, this is right. I could put 10 kW of installed capacity on my Classic 150 if I wanted to, and the Classic could not use all of it. But it can limit the current to the battery. So the charging current limit can be set to ideal, and in theory with 10 kW installed capacity, I could get the full required charging current early in the day, the controller would not use the full capacity of the panels at solar noon, and it would finish charging before the sun ran out for the day.

    Installing more generating capacity than you need for a perfect day provides a better chance that you can get the job done on a marginal day without running the generator.
    --
    Chris
    Which brings to mind one more advantage, although only a hybrid system with two or more separate panel arrays could really take advantage of it:
    If the panels are able to deliver more current than the batteries can absorb, even above and beyond the current limit of the CC, the additional power could be used directly by an inverter to offset energy consumption by your opportunity loads during the day, while still allowing full charging current to the battery bank.
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
  • palausystempalausystem Solar Expert Posts: 122 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    I'm a little slow, but I think I'm understanding Cariboocoot's assessment of our inadequate PV array. Once I stop being distracted by the battery size, I could visualize it all better. Please let me know if this illustration of simply looking at Kwh in and out makes good sense or not:

    Let's look at our typical “summer” where we have 8 hrs of sun/day. That's 12.5Kwh based on 3K of PV panels. So, let's start with a fully charged bank at 4:30 pm. Between then and the next afternoon at 4:30, we consume our 6Kwh daily loads. So we want to offset that by about 7Kwh (?) We can do this and have 5Kwh “left over” for extra loads. Not a problem.

    Now let's take mid-winter sun: We've got maybe 5 good hours. 5 * 3 * .52 = 7.8Kwh. So again, if we start with our fully charged bank, and we use 6K, we've been able to offset that, plus a little.

    OK, same winter scenario except a day of clouds: at 9:30 am to 2:30 pm we get some of our loads met by the PV, but there is no battery charging. So by 2:30pm we are in deficit by whatever we used the previous evening, say it was 3Kwh. Now we have to pay back say, 3.5Kwh. Then let's have 1 more cloudy day, this time there is even less PV to meet loads, so we dip into our reserve another 4Kwh. Now we are roughly 8Kwh hours short of a full charge. The sun comes out at 9:30 am the next morning and now we have to replace the 8Kwh (plus) and get another 6Kwh to use for loads. That's 14 or 15Kwh we need. We can get our 6Kwh load needs met from the sun today, but the battery will be short by about 8Kwh. We will stay in deficit until we run the generator, even with nothing but sunny days ahead.
    In conclusion, our batteries will go into deficit cycling frequently in the winter, even after just one cloudy day.

    So what I want to do is come up with a generator schedule for the winter months, until we can get more panels.
    When sunny: Once a week generator assist full charge.
    When cloudy: every 3 days generator assist full charge

    What do you think?
    Off-grid 48v, 3 kw PV, Sunny Island 5048U, SunnyBoy, US Battery RE L16XC  6v, 800ah, Genset: Kohler 8.5 RES propane.
  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    It's amazing when the Light Bulb goes off in your head. It's all about what you put in and what you take out, just like a bank account. Over time things will change with the capacity of your batteries, panels and your appetite for energy. Right now while panels are cheap it might be a good time to add some reserve capacity.

    If your going to use a generator to supplement look at Bulk Current as a place you can save some money. I am on Year 2 of using this and it not showed to be Untrue. You are on your own, as I have only done it on a $900 set of batteries, 250 AMP's into a 1100 Amp hr Bank @ 12V. I staged 3 charging sources and have 150 Amps dropping out @ 14.2 volts and finish off the charge with 100 amps.

    The motivation to try this came from a EV forum.

    "" The most basic rule is that you can charge at any current you like until the battery reaches 2.4 volts per cell at 25 deg. C (77 deg. F). That's the familiar 7.2v per 6v battery, or 14.4v for a 12v battery. Below this voltage, essentially 100% of the current goes into charging the battery, so there is negligible heating or gassing. The batteries won't reach 2.4v per cell until they are about 70-80% charged. Therefore, to charge the quickest, charge with as much current as your charger or AC line allows.""
  • ChrisOlsonChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    We will stay in deficit until we run the generator, even with nothing but sunny days ahead.
    In conclusion, our batteries will go into deficit cycling frequently in the winter, even after just one cloudy day.

    We basically have the same problem in winter. 7.5 kW of wind power nicely "fixes" that here. Without it we'd be running the generator all the time like you propose to do below......
    So what I want to do is come up with a generator schedule for the winter months, until we can get more panels.
    When sunny: Once a week generator assist full charge.
    When cloudy: every 3 days generator assist full charge

    Timed generator runs to "catch up" work great. You're well within the "safe" time limits for the battery bank with the above proposed run times. But I doubt anybody here could tell you, yes - these are the times you should run it. You have to monitor that and decide for yourself what is going to work best for your situation.

    In the winter time when it is extremely cold here (minus 20-40F) so we use tremendous amounts of power overnight just to to keep things thawed out, I start the generator and run it all thru the evening peak loads. The wind rarely blows much when it's that cold because it's a high pressure area set in. So we use the generator to heat extra water in the water heaters, and take the loads off the bank and maintain it at float before we go to bed. It's not "economical" by all the standards that are supposed to be used for off-grid standby power. But it insures we have plenty of power to make it thru the night, it keeps the generator from getting "cold soaked" to stiff as a board in the morning in the event we need it for power, and helps keep the bank a little warmer without requiring so much heat input to the utility room so the batteries have decent capacity in extreme cold.

    So you have to do what you feel is best to meet your long term power needs. And don't get too worried about burning an extra quart of generator fuel to do it right - that generator fuel is way cheaper than batteries in the long run.
    --
    Chris
  • palausystempalausystem Solar Expert Posts: 122 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    What is the 0.52 efficiency figure?
    Over-all system efficiency from nameplate rating of panels to end AC power: 3000 Watts * 4 hours good equivalent sun * 0.52 efficiency = 6240 Watt hours per day. You lose a lot because of having batteries at all; once they are charged the panels could harvest more energy but there's no place for it to go unless you have "opportunity loads" available.

    So now I'm into finding out what my PV actually is capable of producing in winter.
    I saw a pv panel-nameplate to AC derating number of about .77 on a website. That would give me 2.35Kw per hour of good sun.
    I saw Cariboocoot's figure of .52, which would give me 1.6 Kw. If I understand him correctly, the reason for the 25% difference would be from getting the energy into and out of the battery bank....and during the 5 hrs when the sun is feeding our loads directly (.77 derate), that's maybe only 10% of our 24 hr load needs. So...I think I see how the .52 figure works.
    Off-grid 48v, 3 kw PV, Sunny Island 5048U, SunnyBoy, US Battery RE L16XC  6v, 800ah, Genset: Kohler 8.5 RES propane.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    also would be the other losses of efficiency like inverter losses and maybe resistive losses. in conclusion you could tweak that to a better figure by going with the best efficient means like agm batteries, low wire losses, good efficiencies on the inverter, etc. it wouldn't make it a radical change, but a change it would all make. some are actually worse than the .52 as well so overall the .52 represents a good rough figure,
    from sun to fun.;)
  • stephendvstephendv Solar Expert Posts: 1,571 ✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    So now I'm into finding out what my PV actually is capable of producing in winter.

    Instead of working with rough derating estimates, couldn't you just read the kWh value directly off the sunny boy? EDIT:

    You can also read the cumulative kWh of what was stored in the battery with setting 320-04 and what was drawn from the Sunny Island with setting 310-02.

    You can configure the Sunny Island to auto-start the gen for both full charging and EQ charging with setting 235-18- (the default is to start the gen for both)
  • SolarMusherSolarMusher Solar Expert Posts: 176 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    Hi everyone,
    A few explanations on this post, but before I have to say that I agree on all that was written here in this thread except a few things… I want to say also that I would never have design an off grid system like this one, I believe that there are better and more efficient off grid products available that could be used in such system. But before hanging this installer, I wonder if Palausystem told to his installer that he would need 6kw/day all the year… From what I could see everyday, people buy a pre-designed system that could produce 6kw/day and add loads after loads, until problems arise. I would like to know also if it was the only quotation this installer made, maybe there was another more expensive quotation that Palausystem had refused. From my experience, the installer proposes a system and the customer bargains and decides to adapt this system to his budget, sorry for the C/10 rule but it’s real life. Recent example: I have quoted a 48V system (8x Rolls S-600 450Ah) to a customer with 2.54kw/44A/PV on roof (perfect) but at the end he bought only 1.89kw. So, if you guys are right here on this forum, my customer should take legal recourse against me, because his batteries are sulfating? Great.
    Palausystem,
    As Stephen said, charge rate depends on DOD and on loads and C/10 is for a 50% DOD and NOT for a 25/30% DOD especially on a 800AH battery bank. And for those who need deeper discharges, there are generators and chargers and I want to believe that your installer told you that your batteries need to be 100% SOC twice a week minimum to be in good shape, no matter it's by solar or generator.
    Why don’t you call your installer (or another) and tell him that you have a problem with your batteries/PV ratio. I can’t believe that this installer could be satisfied with a system that doesn’t perform and fit your needs. Off course you will have to pay for one more string and a better MPPT controller but Off grid is not an inexpensive way of life. Buy a Classic CC, at least you will have the best from your array!
    Wish the best,
    Erik
    PS: Sorry if this post is not politically correct.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    Hi everyone,
    A few explanations on this post, but before I have to say that I agree on all that was written here in this thread except a few things… I want to say also that I would never have design an off grid system like this one, I believe that there are better and more efficient off grid products available that could be used in such system. But before hanging this installer, I wonder if Palausystem told to his installer that he would need 6kw/day all the year… From what I could see everyday, people buy a pre-designed system that could produce 6kw/day and add loads after loads, until problems arise. I would like to know also if it was the only quotation this installer made, maybe there was another more expensive quotation that Palausystem had refused. From my experience, the installer proposes a system and the customer bargains and decides to adapt this system to his budget, sorry for the C/10 rule but it’s real life. Recent example: I have quoted a 48V system (8x Rolls S-600 450Ah) to a customer with 2.54kw/44A/PV on roof (perfect) but at the end he bought only 1.89kw. So, if you guys are right here on this forum, my customer should take legal recourse against me, because his batteries are sulfating? Great.
    Palausystem,
    As Stephen said, charge rate depends on DOD and on loads and C/10 is for a 50% DOD and NOT for a 25/30% DOD especially on a 800AH battery bank. And for those who need deeper discharges, there are generators and chargers and I want to believe that your installer told you that your batteries need to be 100% SOC twice a week minimum to be in good shape, no matter it's by solar or generator.
    Why don’t you call your installer (or another) and tell him that you have a problem with your batteries/PV ratio. I can’t believe that this installer could be satisfied with a system that doesn’t perform and fit your needs. Off course you will have to pay for one more string and a better MPPT controller but Off grid is not an inexpensive way of life. Buy a Classic CC, at least you will have the best from your array!
    Wish the best,
    Erik
    PS: Sorry if this post is not politically correct.

    erik,
    i'm having trouble wrapping my head around why you are putting yourself in a defensive posture in believing that all of us here are anti-installer. i do not see the evidence here in this thread off hand of it. the world does not revolve around installers as some diy and i don't see why you think all installers are above reproach either. you do bring up good points and i can see you have very good standards you adhere to as an installer, but you can't speak for all installers and there are some bad ones out there.
  • SolarMusherSolarMusher Solar Expert Posts: 176 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    niel wrote: »
    erik,
    i'm having trouble wrapping my head around why you are putting yourself in a defensive posture in believing that all of us here are anti-installer. i do not see the evidence here in this thread off hand of it. the world does not revolve around installers as some diy and i don't see why you think all installers are above reproach either. you do bring up good points and i can see you have very good standards you adhere to as an installer, but you can't speak for all installers and there are some bad ones out there.
    Hi Niel,
    Sorry Niel, but it's not the first time that I could read anti-installer comments on this forum.
    I was just thinking this forum was to help RE community. Maybe some commercial website have financial interests to b*tch installers...
    Oups! Really not politically correct.
    I'm better click to a friendly forum which I know their goal is to sell their products honnestly and to help people to better use them.
    What a wonderful world!
    Erik
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    Reality: there are a lot of installers who do not know what they are doing. Their presence in the industry makes the good ones (of whom several are members of this forum) and the industry as a whole look bad. Their involvement with a system can often be detected by the fact people come here and say "my system doesn't work right" just as the OP did. Simple analysis of said system shows that it is wrong in its design. The fact that they come here asking shows they aren't getting help from the installer and/or want a second opinion.

    Should an installer be sued if batteries sulphate due to improper charging? No, not if it isn't his fault. Sometimes people do not listen to advice. Boy do I know that! It is prudent for anyone in the solar installation business to put it in writing what the maximum output that can be expected is (minimum will always be "zero") and to include a caveat regarding the design not meeting the needs of the user if such is the case.

    The installer here had the charging parameters for the batteries wrong and the OP had to figure out for himself what they should have been. Unfortunately this took some time and he is now in a battle to save some very expensive batteries that have clearly been chronically under-charged.

    We are not here to sell product. None of the moderators have anything to do with the host company Northern Arizona Wind and Sun. This forum operates "at arms length" from them. The advice you get here comes from people with real experience with solar electric systems, not salesmen.

    Most of the forum members, including the professional installers, would disagree with your assessment of us. Disagreement is allowed. You can even say someone is wrong, but you'd better say why as well.
  • SolarMusherSolarMusher Solar Expert Posts: 176 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    Hi Marc,
    I agree with you that in this case there is a problem on how this installer has designed the whole system and on the choice of components. Obviously he had no experience on how an off grid system should be designed. I don't know about the parameters he entered into the system. But in my opinion, this could also happen on a well designed system. 3.2kw/PV is not a bad design for a 800Ah/48V battery bank and it could work very well with 4/5kw daily loads, who can afford 4 or 5kw PV array to meet C10. There is no problem here as long as these batteries are fully charged twice a week (with the right parameters). But from my experience, i do not trust new owners when they claimed: my system does not perform well. There could be so much reasons and the main one is that they don't want to take the time to understand their system. No matter what an installer could explain or not. How an installer could explain a whole system in 2 hours? Im still learning after more than 10 years. I have several custommers who didn't equalize their batteries for more than one year and call me, some of them didnt even open their inverter manual after one year... I could tell you several stories , +- funny.
    Nothing is black or white and it is hard to form an opinion with just one side of the story.
    Erik
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    Erik;

    You have to consider the whole scenario which includes the OP's location. That info wasn't included in the posts but some of us have the inside scoop. ;)
    My habitual short-reference to the 10% rule-of-thumb confounds people sometimes as it doesn't make it clear that obtaining that current is the key part; it's just a short way to make sure you have enough panel to provide the power needs under most circumstances. With a typical install the 10% peak charge current and 25% DOD will be a balanced system about 90% of the time. But since every install is different you can't just leave it at that of course.

    If this one had had correct parameters programmed and started the gen as needed the batteries wouldn't have gotten to such a state. Since gen power is even more expensive than solar it's best to try and avoid using the gen unless absolutely necessary. Dave Sparks has put in many (all?) systems that are 100% without generator back-up, although not in the frozen wasteland known as Canada. :p

    I know what you mean about people not understanding. Much of my time is spent correcting systems that do not function well or sometimes even at all. Yet my own neighbour listened to what I had to say about his system this year and flat-out said he wasn't going to change it because it "always used to work". By that he meant he was happy buying new batteries every year because the old ones had died from chronic under-charging. Or more accurately that he doesn't know they should last five years or so. His system is crackers too, but he has only himself to blame.
  • SolarMusherSolarMusher Solar Expert Posts: 176 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question
    Erik;
    You have to consider the whole scenario which includes the OP's location. That info wasn't included in the posts but some of us have the inside scoop. ;)
    Marc,
    What were the parameters and location?
    I would need a great laugh before sleeping, iced rain here :cry:
    Tell me more :p
    Erik
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    That's odd; we're getting ice/rain/snow too. It keeps warming up then cooling down. And we're headed for those 6 hour days.

    One of the odd things about the Surrettes is that some people have found even their recommended Voltage settings are low. Chris Olson had fun getting his wound up to 15 Volt Absorb and he's not alone. I had similar experience with some Interstate batteries. Some day maybe the battery makers and charge control makers will get together in a room and settle their differences. RE apps are still relatively new for batteries and the shake-down certainly isn't over yet.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,748 admin
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    The way we "moderators" use to guess were people are posting from is something like:

    http://www.geobytes.com/iplocator.htm

    Seems to get within 2-10 miles for my location... And overall seems to be close enough for solar work about 90%+ of the time.

    We try not to get to "exact" with people to respect their privacy (unless the volunteer the information and/or fill out the "Location"/"Signature" information in the User Profile).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • PhotowhitPhotowhit Solar Expert Posts: 5,881 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    I kinda quit this thread after my requests about trimetric reading went ignored by the original poster, I felt we were all talking about what we didn't know and there were facts available that were not provided. but...

    Having been Photowhit on solar forums and active in usenet groups before the WWW, this is the "friendly forum". Heck I've even been banned from a forum in which my last discussion was being too busy to be a moderator. If your looking for someone not friendly toward solar find a forum with a sunking lurking!
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,748 admin
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    "palausystem" is in the East Bay (A bit north/east of SF across the bay)... For lack of any better information, the solar view is something like:
    Month    Solar Radiation
    (kWh/m 2/day)
    1      3.62     
    2      4.59     
    3      5.22     
    4      6.11     
    5      6.36     
    6      6.47     
    7      7.01     
    8      6.67     
    9      6.62     
    10      5.41     
    11      3.87     
    12      3.35     
    Year      5.45      
    

    Depending on where he is relative to mountains and the Delta--He could get quite a bit more sun (or not) vs San Francisco Intl Airport (where the solar data was collected).

    By the way, lets not let this thread get too far ahead of the original poster--Some of this is getting a bit off topic (I think).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • SolarMusherSolarMusher Solar Expert Posts: 176 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    You're right Bill.
    Erik
  • palausystempalausystem Solar Expert Posts: 122 ✭✭✭
    Re: Sunny Island/Rolls 530-S charging question

    Wow,
    I'm really impressed by all the help here on this forum,
    I'm out at the site on the weekends so I have limited time to do EQ's and SG tests and the like, but I totally appreciate all the support coming in.
    I'll read all the latest and will post again this Sunday,

    Thanks again,

    John
    Off-grid 48v, 3 kw PV, Sunny Island 5048U, SunnyBoy, US Battery RE L16XC  6v, 800ah, Genset: Kohler 8.5 RES propane.
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