New to solar. need some help

mverick160
mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
Ok, I have a lake house in Arkansas. Will be running led lights, a new energy star fridge 386 watt, radio and a laptop. I have 14 275 watt panels ill be mounting on the roof. Was looking at midnight charge controller and running 60 volts to 10 deka 370ah batteries. Not set on any inverter yet. Anyone see problems with this? There is no option for power. It sits in 100 ft of water 150 yards from shore. I also have 2 Yamaha 2000I and a 8000watt gen to run a/c. Propane for cooking, greatest, and heat.

Comments

  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,433 admin
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Welcome to the forum--And how do you feel about summer guests? ;)
    mverick160 wrote: »
    Ok, I have a lake house in Arkansas. Will be running led lights, a new energy star fridge 386 watt, radio and a laptop.

    First--I would suggest keeping your wallet closed for a few days. Solar power is usually a lot better and more cost effective if you make some basic plans first.

    If already have some sort of AC power available (aka generator, etc.)... A Kill-a-Watt type meter will tell you a lot of what you need to know. Running Watts and kWH (kilo-Watt*Hours) per day.

    And is this a seasonal home, or 9+ months of the year living? Any seasonal loads (like A/C?).
    I have 14 275 watt panels will be mounting on the roof.

    That is a good sized solar power system. So, with the loads mentioned so far, it sounds like a good start. Using PV Watts with a fixed array, 0.52 end to end system efficiency, fixed array tilted to latitude for Little Rock with 3.85 kW Array, your rough average available power would be:
    "Station Identification"
    "City:","Little_Rock"
    "State:","Arkansas"
    "Lat (deg N):", 34.73
    "Long (deg W):", 92.23
    "Elev (m): ", 81
    "PV System Specifications"
    "DC Rating:"," 3.8 kW"
    "DC to AC Derate Factor:"," 0.520"
    "AC Rating:"," 2.0 kW"
    "Array Type: Fixed Tilt"
    "Array Tilt:"," 34.8"
    "Array Azimuth:","180.0"

    "Energy Specifications"
    "Cost of Electricity:"," 7.4 cents/kWh"

    "Results"
    "Month", "Solar Radiation (kWh/m^2/day)", "AC Energy (kWh)", "Energy Value ($)"
    1, 3.78, 228, 16.87
    2, 4.38, 235, 17.39
    3, 5.19, 300, 22.20
    4, 5.67, 306, 22.64
    5, 5.89, 319, 23.61
    6, 5.81, 297, 21.98
    7, 5.93, 308, 22.79
    8, 6.08, 319, 23.61
    9, 5.41, 280, 20.72
    10, 5.16, 288, 21.31
    11, 3.69, 205, 15.17
    12, 3.56, 210, 15.54
    "Year", 5.05, 3294, 243.76

    So, you are looking at 205 to 319 kWH per month of available power... Very roughly, 1 kWH per day (30 kWH per month) is good for "simple" electrical life style (computer, lights, small fan, small water pump, etc.).

    ~3.3 kWH per day or ~100 kWH per month--You can have a "near normal" off grid electric lifestyle with a Energy Star Fridge, well pump, washing machine, lights, computer, perhaps even a microwave.

    At the energy levels you are looking at--You might be able to support a summer A/C system (perhaps even some winter heating with a heat pump version).

    Note that energy usage is a highly personal choice--And we suggest extreme conservation first (energy star appliances, lots of insulation, double pane windows, turning stuff off when not in use like computers, sat/digital receivers, etc.). It is almost always less expensive to conserve than to generate electricity.
    Was looking at midnight charge controller and running 60 volts to 10 deka 370ah batteries.

    Hold off on the battery bank for the moment. More or less, I look at the Battery Bank as the "heart" of your system. You need to know your daily loads to size the battery bank first. Then you can size the rest of the system in support of the battery bank and your loads.

    Also, I am not a fan of paralleling batteries together... It is difficult to share current between battery strings, can get expensive adding fuse/breaker per string (safety), and difficult to maintain (lot of cells to check water levels in, lots of parallel connections to keep clean and tight, learning how to monitor your bank for open/shorted cells/bad wiring connections).

    Also, battery bank voltage is important too... More or less if your average wattage/power use is 1,200 watts or less, you can get away with a 12 volt bank... Around 1,200 to 2,400 watts, you should look at a 24 volt bank. And above that, start looking at a 48 volt bank.

    A 1,200 watt 120 VAC AC inverter needs ~175 amp or larger branch circuit+fuse/breaker for full power operation... That gets into some serious wire sizes (and costs). A 24 volt bank will require 1/2 the current. And a 48 volt bank will require 1/4 the current.

    Also, for some items like charge controllers--They are rated in output Current at 12/24/48 volts... I.e., a 60 amp controller at 12 volts = 720 watts. The same controller at 48 volts is 60amps*48volts=2,880Watts--So 4x the bank voltage, is 4x larger supported array with a single ($600) charge controller.

    So--Back to your power needs? 120 VAC? Do you need some 240 VAC (well pump, A/C?). Just the above loads? More?
    Not set on any inverter yet. Anyone see problems with this? There is no option for power. It sits in 100 ft of water 150 yards from shore. I also have 2 Yamaha 2000I and a 8000watt gen to run a/c. Propane for cooking, greatest, and heat.

    Go with the Kill-a-Watt (or whole house monitor) energy monitor first--To get a handle on you power needs. For the above loads, you could possibly get away with as small as a 1,500 Watt inverter (I would suggest TSW--But that is between you and your wallet--MSW have some "quirks" you need to understand and some AC devices just don't like MSW wave forms).

    You have a gensets right now--So taking a week to measure/estimate your loads is a good use of time (and fuel).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    The house is seasonal. Go down for the weekend or a week.

    I was looking at a 240 so as to be able to tie it to the breaker panel and feed all the outlets in the house. Use the wiring that is already there.

    It is 5 hrs away so getting a wattmeter on it isn't going to happen. But I do understand the need. It is cabin living. So the fridge is the main thing. I'm tired of the generator needing to be on at night for the fridge.

    The inverter I used was a samlex 600 pure sine. Worked well for the fridge. One car battery lasted 6 hrs.

    I did bring 4 car batteries down there charged and hooked one up to the refrigerator at night. Would get around 6 hours before invertor kicked off and alarmed. The other things are led lights at night only for getting around and dinner. And sitting on the screened in porch playing guitar or listening to a radio. Have 2 100lb propane cylinders on the boat so if needed a propane light can be used outthere and one inside.

    I'm pulling off 3 asphalt roofs and 1 steel and replacing a new steel in spring. So want to mount the panels then and get it hooked up.

    Lot of other work to do but its a fun retreat.
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,433 admin
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    You are right on the edge of a 12 volt system... There is a great 300 Watt TSW 12 volt inverter with some nifty power saving features (more or less a "sleep mode" and an remote on/off input that you do not find until you are spending some serious money).

    A typical refrigerator pushes you to ~1,500 watt minimum inverter--Right on the edge of 12/24 volt inverter. Also, some (most, all, ???) energy star refrigerators require 24x7 AC power to run their timers/electronics. If you put an inverter into low power mode (turns on ~once per second looking for AC loads), the defrost timers will set back to zero and start a new defrost cycle).

    There are options such as using a converted chest freezer as refrigerator--But that does not always please the spouse.

    Anyway, with the size of array you have--Running a full time fridge with larger battery bank is not a problem at all (note, a 12 volt at 400 AH battery bank stores the same amount of energy as a 24 volt 200 AH battery bank or 48 volt @ 100 AH bank == Power=Volts*Amps). So, two ways to size the battery bank... One based on load, and other based on array size.

    Starting with a 48 volt battery bank, and 3.8kW array--I like to start with a 5% to 13% rate of charge (with 77% panel+charge controller efficiency) to size the array to the battery bank (or the battery bank to the array in this case):
    • 3,850 watt array * 0.77 panel+controller derate * 1/58 volt charging * 1/0.05 rate of charge = 1,022 AH @ 48 volt bank (max size bank)
    • 3,850 watt array * 0.77 panel+controller derate * 1/58 volt charging * 1/0.10 rate of charge = 511 AH @ 48 volt bank (nominal size bank)
    • 3,850 watt array * 0.77 panel+controller derate * 1/58 volt charging * 1/0.13 rate of charge = 393 AH @ 48 volt bank (minimum size bank)

    So, from a purely solar array to battery bank ratio, you are looking at a 393 to 1,022 AH battery bank.

    From a daily power usage (1-3 days "no sun", 50% maximum discharge; use 2days*1/0.50 max discharge=4x daily load battery bank), using the 511 AH @ 48 volt "nominal" battery bank:
    • 511 AH * 48 volt * 1/4 days of storage * 0.85 inverter efficiency = 5,212 Watt*Hours per day "nominal" load

    Or roughly:
    • 5.212 kWH per day * 30 days per month = 156 kWH per month

    Which matches pretty nicely with the ~205 kWH per month (solar 3.85 kW solar array average output) for November (you may need to use the genset a bit during this time.

    There are lots of other rules of thumb we can use at this time (average power, starting surge for well pump, using alternate devices like microwave, even possibly an induction cooker, mini-split A/C or heat pump system, etc.)... But it would be nice to know more about your measured power needs before we throw all that math at the problem...

    Of course, if you want to see what can be done, we can do that math too.

    For example, using a 511 AH @ 48 volt battery bank, the average draw would be:
    • 511 AH * 48 volts * 0.85 inverter eff * 1/8 hour discharge rate = 2,606 Watts "continuous" recommended load (flooded cell batteries)

    And the maximum recommended surge would be:
    • 511 AH * 48 volts * 0.85 inverter eff * 1/2.5 hour discharge rate = 8,340 Watts "maximum surge" recommended (flooded cell batteries)

    So, an inverter in the 2.5 to 4 kW range (assuming a good inverter has about 2x rated power for surge) would be a nice fit for that battery bank.

    By the way, the numbers are not "that accurate"--Just so you can reproduce my math (or find my errors).

    Anyway, that is how I go about a "balanced" system design... You can adjust battery bank larger or smaller--depending on your needs... I would not suggest going "big" unless you have specific needs. A large bank with "small" solar array is a bit more tricky to manage--plus when the batteries eventually fail, you have a larger battery bank to replace.

    Also, if this is your first system--You might want to get "cheap" batteries--There is a good chance they will be killed by accident the first few years of operation until you get everything dialed in and the family "trained". Also--If you want a larger (or smaller) battery bank after a few years of operational experience--then you won't feel so bad about changing out the first battery bank early.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • icarus
    icarus Solar Expert Posts: 5,436 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Even a small inveter wired on both legs of a 240 split phase panel will work if you switch it properly, and understand the shared neutral aspect of 3 wire 120 vac circuits. (discussed at length ithe past few weeks.)


    The fridge is your big draw item. You could certainly consider a LP fridge. The dollar equation of running costs favor a LP over a conventional when the use is short term, and or seasonal. We live with lp fridges just fine. For reference, we burn about 10# of propane a week, for the rqnge, water heater and the fridge. A fridge will burn about 1000BTUs an hour, with a duty cycle of maybe 30-50% depending on temp and loading. Pretty cheap compared to a larger inverter' more batteries, and more PV. Instead of using lp lights, use it in the frige (way less heat in the room too! ) ad light with LEDs. If memory serves, a propane light will burn~1# of LP in about 4 hours,,,not very efficient.

    LP fridges ar expensive up front, but they can be had from Rv wreckers pretty cheap.

    Tony
    Tony
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Thanks all.

    Yes, I've heard of Mini Splits. In fact, I have a 2 9000 head unit that I'm putting down there also. It will hook up to the big generator for power if it gets hot.

    I considered a LP fridge. But if you buy a new one 18cu/ft they are about $2400. I figured for that, i'd put $2000 into a solar array. My friends have 3 of them at there cabin in Georgian Bay. They like them. But they also spend 4 months on the island a year during the summer. The problem I have is they seem to take a day or 2 to get cold. And forever to cool something. So, I wanted a regular energy star one. Maybe a mistake though. As I plan on being at my cabin on a weekend. Or a week. So, it would take 2 of the 3 days to get cold.

    To telll you how little use this got. The 2 100lb cylinders have been on the houseboat for 25years. And never refilled. Just use for the Stove and a heater.
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    That is not where it's sitting now by the way. LOL
  • icarus
    icarus Solar Expert Posts: 5,436 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    If you keep an lp fridge running during the week, filled with jugs of water, (and the freezer filled with water jugs!) it will stay cold through the week, and burn nearly no LP. I have often said, that if I had to do it over again, I would go with an energy star fridge, but we re here full time so the equation is a bit different. (when we built the new house, PV was still expensive,, conventional fridges were not nearly so efficient) We have had a Dometic continuously burning for enter than 20 years! (my new ones with electronic control, shut off and relight as needed, ans so use very little propane once cold,, and full!

    That said, all fridge does take a while to get cold. Another trick is to add foam cord to the outside of the case, on top and on the sides, and then add a small computer fan on the evap coils to produce a good draft over the coils, making them cool faster. They are also expensive to buy, unless you are willing to take a gamble on a used one. I have bought several used ons over the years with no hard luck, but they are prone to cooling unit failures if not run level,k or if they are stored before being dried carefully. Cooling units are not hard to replace,,, only expensive. The last fridge I bought, I paid $200 for, the one before that was $550 shipped from a reputable rebuilder.

    If you already have the energy str conventional, then design your PV system around it by all means. Just figure in another -.5-1kwh/day capacity,, plus the batteries to power it. Drawing the batteries routinely down to 50% or more is a recipe for short battery life. I prefer a 25% draw down, that then gives me several days of autonomy.

    If you haven't read these links,,, I suggest you might,

    http://www.batteryfaq.org/
    http://www.windsun.com/Batteries/Battery_FAQ.htm#Lifespan%20of%20Batteries

    Good luck, and keep in touch,

    Tiny
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Thanks for the info. I'm trying to size it for the needs. Or, oversize it. I'd like to add things later. Conveniences. So, extra panels would be fine. I figured on doubling the panels at a later date.

    I'd love to run a mini split A/C on it. And, like I said, I'm not down there regularly. Once a month during season. Plan is for a retirement home. Spend 3 months on it, and 3 months at home and 3 months in Florida. Last 3 months traveling diving.

    Yes, I know the batteries need looked after. And that is fine. Take a weekend to go down, babysit the batteries and chill out on the water is not a bad thing.

    I'm really starting to look at the forklift battery option. Have the solar array charge it back up while I'm gone for a week or two. Come down to stay and pull it down. So have a larger battery capacity since it can charge extra the 2 weeks I won't be there. Leave the fridge running so it has a draw.

    If that sounds feasible.

    Oh the reason I bought it is I'm a diver. And it is a good lake to dive on. Jump off my house and go to 100 feet. LOL.. Also, they allow spearfishing for game fish in season. Which is rare.
  • Photowhit
    Photowhit Solar Expert Posts: 6,002 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Though my experience with a forklift battery is just over a year long, I had read that they require water more often, so they might not be the best choice. My experience with a new forklift hasn't been that bad, only requiring water every 3 months or so, but it hasn't gotten enough of a work out as i bought a new property shortly after.
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
  • icarus
    icarus Solar Expert Posts: 5,436 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Remember,, it is critical to size a charging regimen for the battery size. Counter intuitively, one of the biggest causes of battery failures is not as you would expect to be chronic over drawing,, but rather chronic UNDERCHARGING. The big issue with e forklift battery is tht it is very expensive, requires lots of charge current. Not a good battery to be used as a "training set,, as most people new to solar tend to kill a set of batteries by a combintion of over use nd undercharging.

    Just. Thought,

    T
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Ok.

    I found 48v refurbished forklift batteries. Anything from 400 to 1000 ah. $2000. Or new t105 deka at $4600. So the forklift seems the cheaper option.

    With 3850 watts at 48v the amps are 80.2 amps. So the charge controller needs to be 80 amp model. Seems the midnight charge controller has a good reliability record. The inverter/charger I'd like to be 240 in case I can run a mini split. And around 4000watts pure sine.

    The last is battery capacity.

    The forklift route puts it at 400 amp hour minimum. As charging with the 80 amp potential I thought would need a big bank. That was why I thought the 1000.

    Like I said. My load right now is going to be a energy star fridge 18 cu ft. Lights in the house for night. Radio and laptop and a mini projector that has a 5 watt led in it that can run off a internal battery for 1 he. Its the size of a cigarette pack and projects a 120 in screen. No tv. Just for a movie night.
    If I wait to test draw on it I'd go 2 years because it wont all be finished for two years. So I'd have 14 solar cells on the roof doing nothing.

    Just wondering what would be a good start for a battery set. I also have 3 genders down there if needed to increase the charge in the bank.
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    And thanks for all the help. I'd be lost without it. Lot of great information.
  • Photowhit
    Photowhit Solar Expert Posts: 6,002 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help
    mverick160 wrote: »
    ...I found 48v refurbished forklift batteries. Anything from 400 to 1000 ah. $2000. Or new t105 deka at $4600...

    As your going 'down' to the lake, you may be speaking about a guy in Springfield, MO. We have had another person post about them, and it seemed like they only did a load test to about 1/2 the capacity, typically refurbished are done to 80 or 90% capacity.

    Also a moment on forklift battery capacity, they are typically done on a 6 hour discharge rate. Batteries have different capacities at different discharge rates, we typically use a 20 hour rate when comparing batteries. At a 6 hour rate the forklift(traction battery) I purchased has a 504 Amp Hour capacity, at a 20 hour rate it has a 800 Amp hour rate!

    Often the best bang for the buck in batteries are golf cart batteries, Many here have had good service from golf cart batteries purchased from Costco and/or Sams club, at @$80 each for 6v 215-220Amp hour batteries. They do require exchanges but Sams club (and I've heard Costco) will take auto batteries as exchanges.

    The weight of a forklift battery migh give you pause as well, a 1000 Amp hour 48 volt battery at 6 hour rate, will weight @ 4000lbs! Even if your house boat is built on a barge, it might have a new slant!
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    One thing on the refurbished forklift battery. They claim 85% charge capacity. So that puts a 1000 at around 850 which is right in the middle of the estimated need for my array. As long as I don't pull it down more then 30% I figured it was a good set. For me. If it started to go down to far just shut everything off and only let the fridge run. For the lake having only the Yamaha run during the evening is ok for me. Shut it off when I go to bed. It's what ive been doing.
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Lol, I think the big one was estimated at 5000lbs. Lol...

    I'm taking 3 asphalt roofs off. Too that works out to removing around 5000 lbs from the thing. I had planed to put the batter close to dead center of the house and build a vented cabinet around it. Maybe a stripper pole over it. Lol.

    The thing that was told to me on the golf cart batteries was with 80 amps from my array I'd need 2 banks of them as they only have 220ah/he load. And I need a minimum of 400.

    So 16 of them Plus taxes is around $1450.... which is fine.... and they are new.... oh, plus core on 16 batteries.

    The lake for me is Bull Shoals. There is one guy in St. Peters mo selling them. Forklift that is.
  • Photowhit
    Photowhit Solar Expert Posts: 6,002 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Well you missed totally that what your calling a 1000 amp hour battery is actually a 1600 amp hour battery, here's a retailer who lists both the 6 hour and the 20 hour rates.

    As batteries age they will need more servicing, and forklift batteries require fequent equilizing, so you sould plan on the out gassing and vent to the outside(as you've said).

    Other considerations are transportation and instalation costs with a fork lift.

    FWIW- I think your spot on, in terms of size of battery, just not understanding the capacity of the batteries your looking at. I had planned on being close to max with my 800 amphour 24v battery, and I will have an extra 2.6Kw of array to add to it. I won't worry about the 'extra' current. I think I can dial down the delievered current with the midnite classic, or shut down strings when not needed, but have plenty of extra for cloudy days, just another way of thinking about things...
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Ok, that I missed

    I was worried about the 400 being the minimum. And the 80 amps potential going there. So much so that i was considering going to 60 volts. That way if I added to the array I could without going over the 80 amp capacity of the charge controller. But that brings in no way to use a forklift battery as I don't find any 60v ones. But 3850watts at 60v is around 60 amps.
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    At 60v I'm looking at an array size of 18 275w panels. But then I'd imagine I should really be at the 800am/he size on the battery. But no way to use forklift unless I use a 36 and a 24 tied together. That. Would get ridiculous. So. I guess maybe the forklift one with 400 rating would be better. Moving them. I own trailers, a really, bobcat with forks. The issue of moving that solid mass onto the boat is real though. Trying to figure how to do it.
    Just figured 2000$ giving me a better ah/he might be better then pushing 16 batteries with 80 amps. Wonder if they sell the batteries in sections without being tied together. 200lbs a cell I can deal with. Then tie them together when onboard.
  • Photowhit
    Photowhit Solar Expert Posts: 6,002 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Before your too disappointed, you will typically see 3850watts / 48 volts = 80 Amps x .75 = 60 Amps charging. If you check your panels liturature you should find some NOCT (normal operating cell temperature?) values which are often @80% of panel rating. Then there is some wattage used at the charge controller and wiring...
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
  • Blackcherry04
    Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help
    mverick160 wrote: »
    At 60v I'm looking at an array size of 18 275w panels. But then I'd imagine I should really be at the 800am/he size on the battery. But no way to use forklift unless I use a 36 and a 24 tied together. That. Would get ridiculous. So. I guess maybe the forklift one with 400 rating would be better. Moving them. I own trailers, a really, bobcat with forks. The issue of moving that solid mass onto the boat is real though. Trying to figure how to do it.
    Just figured 2000$ giving me a better ah/he might be better then pushing 16 batteries with 80 amps. Wonder if they sell the batteries in sections without being tied together. 200lbs a cell I can deal with. Then tie them together when onboard.
    I don't know what kind of a boat and how close you can get to shore. To put on big generators they use a knuckle boom or a cherry picker with a extending boom. The alternative was is to load it on a pontoon boat and make a Portable traveler that looks like a kids swing set with a I beam so you can slide a trolly with a chain hoist down it's length, you put one end on the pontoon and the other on the boat and pick it up and roll it on. Then you move the hoist and move the battery to it's resting place.

    One thing you might want to remember, that much weight will change the way the boats CG is and the way it sits in the water. You might need some ballist to off set it.
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Awesome. So the rating for the controller is for 80 real amps. So ive got plenty of room for play.

    The boat is in a post on this thread. I own a commercial boat that can haul it out there. And a a frame to move it in. Butgoing across wooden floors is a worry. Where it would sit is new and stable. The places I'm moving in from are weak. Probably take a wall out and put in a dual French door. Then boom the battery through it. But if I did it by cell it is a deck of a lot easier. Lol....

    Sorry about misspellings. On a tablet or phone that keeps doing weird autospell things.
  • Blackcherry04
    Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    The HUP one Solar Battery is essentially a fork Lift battery with the Jars unsealed. You set the Box and then put the Jar cells in. Most fork Lift batteries have solid cell connectors thats the biggest problem. They can be drilled off with a hole saw, thats a pain, then you'd have to reconnect them, not easy.

    I saw the picture of the boat. Not quite what I had in mind, but it's fine. Any day on the water is a wonderful day.
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,433 admin
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Just to be clear... What do you mean by 60 volt battery? There is a48 volt battery standard that is charged near 60 volts.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    10 6volt cells or 30 2v cells. for 60 volts worth of cells.

    From what it says. 3850watts at 48 volts is 80 amps
    3850watts at 60 volts is 64 amps. Multiply by .75 for the losses it's only 48 amps. Which would be pretty sweet for expansion too. Fit maybe another 10 solar panels to it for a total of 6600 watts at 115amps multiply by .75 for losses gives me 82.5 amps.


    The house boat is to chill and live on. I have 3 other boats to run around on. One Commercial mullet fishing boat that drives from the center on a 6 ft tower with a 150hp motor that goes through the center of the boat about 5 ft back from the bow and its 30ft. I dive off of it Motor is up front to run in shallows and not get tangled in the old mullet fishing nets. Great for diving with no motor near the back.. It's a sight to see. LOL Then, a Mastercraft comp ski boat. Kayak. And I also take a commercial dive boat down on occasion.

    I was wondering how the got the clean cut. I saw the new attachment straps for them. You can buy and slip over and reheat or melt I guess. That would be a pain but perfect. Hmmm... Might try it.


    BB. wrote: »
    Just to be clear... What do you mean by 60 volt battery? There is a48 volt battery standard that is charged near 60 volts.

    -Bill
  • Photowhit
    Photowhit Solar Expert Posts: 6,002 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    I think you should first find a 60V inverter...
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
  • Blackcherry04
    Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    Re: New to solar. need some help
    mverick160 wrote: »
    10 6volt cells or 30 2v cells. for 60 volts worth of cells.

    From what it says. 3850watts at 48 volts is 80 amps
    3850watts at 60 volts is 64 amps. Multiply by .75 for the losses it's only 48 amps. Which would be pretty sweet for expansion too. Fit maybe another 10 solar panels to it for a total of 6600 watts at 115amps multiply by .75 for losses gives me 82.5 amps.


    The house boat is to chill and live on. I have 3 other boats to run around on. One Commercial mullet fishing boat that drives from the center on a 6 ft tower with a 150hp motor that goes through the center of the boat about 5 ft back from the bow and its 30ft. I dive off of it Motor is up front to run in shallows and not get tangled in the old mullet fishing nets. Great for diving with no motor near the back.. It's a sight to see. LOL Then, a Mastercraft comp ski boat. Kayak. And I also take a commercial dive boat down on occasion.

    I was wondering how the got the clean cut. I saw the new attachment straps for them. You can buy and slip over and reheat or melt I guess. That would be a pain but perfect. Hmmm... Might try it.
    If your going to try to take one apart, I'd try to get some advise about how to do it from some of the Forklift battery sites. I can't find the site that had a video on how to do it. The straps are like you said, are slipped over the posts soldered in place. You'll need to know the ID of the hole saw.
  • mverick160
    mverick160 Registered Users Posts: 14
    Re: New to solar. need some help

    Good point.. I just looked for one that I thought said 60v and 72v. But now, I can't find it. Hmmmmm.....

    Photowhit wrote: »
    I think you should first find a 60V inverter...