Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

ywhicywhic Solar Expert Posts: 612 ✭✭
Since I start back to work Monday..

I am looking (window shopping) at the these 2 Samlex inverters in 24v flavor.

Samlex SA-2000-124 2000w pure sine with hardwire 0.3 A Power Save / 1.5 A Non-Powersave
Samlex SA-3000-124 3000w pure sine with hardwire 0.35A Power Save / 1.6 A Non-Powersave

Both have wattage power save mode (see above) I can set from 40-280 watts..

In non-powersave mode they use 1.5 -1.6 amps.. which is like 36-38.4 watts based on the 24v DC.. << can someone confirm that as I really don't know if I figured that correcly..

If I can figure out what my refrigerator uses (in watts) do you think I can set these to match the watts to get it to kick on when the refrigerator kicks in?? (seems like I could by just ballparking under the running watts of the refrigerator..) and then it will revert back after the wattage drops out..

Help appreciated as always..

Al

Comments

  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

    Well 1.6 Amps @ 24 Volts is indeed 38.4 Watts.
    And 0.35 Amps @ 24 Volts is 8.4 Watts for standby.

    Wow. I thought my Outback was bad for sucking down 20 Watts running and 6 in standby!

    So the Samlex has a minimum load demand of 40 Watts to restart. Hmm. Shall I mention you can program the OB down to nearly zero? Okay; it's a $2,000 inverter vs. a $1,200 one.

    I don't know of any refrigerator that would not trigger the Samlex on start-up. The running Watts of most full size units is over 100, and the start surge is generally close to 1 kW +/-.

    Keep in mind this may not save you as much power as you think. I have tried this method with mine, but since the refrigerator runs 1/3 of the time even during the 10 hours at night when nothing else is on. Hence: for about maybe 4 hours a day I saved 14 Watts, or 56 Watt hours per day. I've stopped using that mode, so the phone stays charged over night too. :roll:
  • waynefromnscanadawaynefromnscanada Solar Expert Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??
    ywhic wrote: »

    If I can figure out what my refrigerator uses (in watts) do you think I can set these to match the watts to get it to kick on when the refrigerator kicks in?? (seems like I could by just ballparking under the running watts of the refrigerator..) and then it will revert back after the wattage drops out..

    Help appreciated as always..

    Al

    Unless you have other small loads that you only want running when the fridge is running, there is no need to try and match the trigger point of the inverter to the running watts of the fridge. Just leave the trigger set at 10 or 20 watts, or whatever the factory setting is or was, and whenever the fridge demands power, the inverter will power up.
  • ywhicywhic Solar Expert Posts: 612 ✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

    Well if mine is off a 1/3 of the night I can save 30 watts * 3 or about 90 watts I guess..

    Nothing else will be running at night to my knowledge for what I have planned in..

    I can get the SA-2000 for about $690 and the SA-3000 for $989 or so..

    The powersave options are 40, 80, 125, 170, 210, 245, or 280 watts..

    I also noticed the Magnum MS2000 (12v) with 7 watt search and 25 watt on modes.. and again I need a controller for it..

    The other one I noticed was an Outback FM2524T model (2500w & 24v).. but then I would need a MATE to set it up and monitor/controller for it.. uses 20 watts continuous and 6 watts in search..

    What other simple stuff would I need for the Outback?? Just the mate to get it running correct?? Or is that needed just for setup?? it sounds like the Outback is ready to go mostly with factory settings??
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??
    ywhic wrote: »
    Well if mine is off a 1/3 of the night I can save 30 watts * 3 or about 90 watts I guess..

    Nothing else will be running at night to my knowledge for what I have planned in..

    I can get the SA-2000 for about $690 and the SA-3000 for $989 or so..

    The powersave options are 40, 80, 125, 170, 210, 245, or 280 watts..

    I also noticed the Magnum MS2000 (12v) with 7 watt search and 25 watt on modes.. and again I need a controller for it..

    The other one I noticed was an Outback FM2524T model (2500w & 24v).. but then I would need a MATE to set it up and monitor/controller for it.. uses 20 watts continuous and 6 watts in search..

    What other simple stuff would I need for the Outback?? Just the mate to get it running correct?? Or is that needed just for setup?? it sounds like the Outback is ready to go mostly with factory settings??

    I thought you were on a budget? What are you doing looking at a $2,000 OB inverter? :confused:
    And yes you would need a MATE or MATE II; the factory default settings usually aren't what you want to use, I find.
  • vtmapsvtmaps Solar Expert Posts: 3,738 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??
    ywhic wrote: »
    What other simple stuff would I need for the Outback?? Just the mate to get it running correct?? Or is that needed just for setup?? it sounds like the Outback is ready to go mostly with factory settings??

    You really need a mate. You could, I suppose, borrow a mate to get set up, and then run it without a mate. The outback does have default settings, but I can't imagine that you wouldn't need to change at least some of them. --vtMaps
    4 X 235watt Samsung, Midnite ePanel, Outback VFX3524 FM60 & mate, 4 Interstate L16, trimetric, Honda eu2000i
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??
    vtmaps wrote: »
    You really need a mate. You could, I suppose, borrow a mate to get set up, and then run it without a mate. The outback does have default settings, but I can't imagine that you wouldn't need to change at least some of them. --vtMaps

    Yes; step one is to adjust the AC IN limits to match whatever generator you're using. Step two is up the LVD to system Voltage. Step three is adjust the charger parameters to match your battery bank.

    Et cetera. :D
  • ywhicywhic Solar Expert Posts: 612 ✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

    Hey you mentioned them.. LoL.. (I start back to a JOB on Monday)..

    Well the Samlex is 38 watts per hour 1.6 amps.. so that would be 38.4 amps in 24 hours from the battery bank correct??

    So basically 1 hour of my SUN would go just to run the inverter :cry:

    The SA-2000 and the meter for that is like $755.. figure $1064 for the SA-3000 with meter..

    The Magnum pricing is close to the SA-3000, but its only a 12v setup.. surely more robust than the SA2 or SA3.. has a 5 second surge of 3300 watts and 30 second surge of 3100 watts.. and it has the Xfer switch built-in..

    Ideally I'd want the MS4024 but thats in the Outback range of pricing.. But the Outback is 5 years and the Magum is 3 years..

    Probably going to be just the SA-2000K-24 model with the LED meter.. 2000w and 2200W surge for like 3 minutes and 4000w peak surge can't be a bad place to start.. at least its 24v..
  • TheBackRoadsTheBackRoads Solar Expert Posts: 274 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

    I think you've covered this but I remember the surge rating being very short on the Samlex units. Maybe there better now, but I was always worried about IF it could start a fridge or something due to the <1 second surge rating. Again, it's been a few years since I looked in detail.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??
    I think you've covered this but I remember the surge rating being very short on the Samlex units. Maybe there better now, but I was always worried about IF it could start a fridge or something due to the <1 second surge rating. Again, it's been a few years since I looked in detail.

    The small, stand-alone Samlex inverters essentially have no surge capacity at all. Al is looking at getting one of the new "hard wire" 3kW units which claim to be able to handle a 2X surge (I haven't seen any data on how long) and in the manual it says it will start motor loads.
  • ywhicywhic Solar Expert Posts: 612 ✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

    Most numbers I've seen for the GoPower (much like Samlex).. say like 2200 for 3 minutes (for the 2000w models) and of course the 4KW surge...

    And of course the ProSine 1800 by Xantrex rates VERY highly around here.. though I forget how GOOD the 2900w surge on that really works?? is that a TRUE number?? I forget..

    Granted the 22w standby and 1.5w search mode on the ProSine 1800 slaughters the Samlex numbers..

    I've checked the PST, SA, SSW, ST models and all the 1500w and up models stink at like 2.8 (12v) and 1.5-1.6A (24v) standby mode ratings

    At the point of spending of $1000+ on a SA-3000K-124 Samlex I'm into the next bracket as far as inverters go.. :cry:
  • petertearaipetertearai Solar Expert Posts: 398 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

    You may find that your new fridge needs power on continuously to run properly. My new fridge would not get my xantrix inverter out of power save.
    2225 wattts pv . Outback 2kw  fxr pure sine inverter . fm80 charge controller . victron battery monitor . 24 volts 450 ah surette batterys . off grid  holiday home 
  • waynefromnscanadawaynefromnscanada Solar Expert Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??
    My new fridge would not get my xantrix inverter out of power save.

    Probably because the computer that controls everything draws so very little power, and unless the computer is powered, it cannot command the compressor to start.
    Sometimes we build things that are too hi-tech for our own good, then learn too late that simple is often better.
  • PhotowhitPhotowhit Solar Expert Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

    Even off my AC will keep my prosine out of power saver mode, it has a remote, so I guess it is always in search mode. I have to unplug it if I want it to drop into power saver. Lots of little things may keep your inverter running, led's on power strips, wall warts, microwave or anything with a display...
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Prosine 1800 and Exeltech 1100, 660 ah 24v ForkLift battery. Off grid for @16 of last 17 years. Assorted other systems, and to many panels in the closet to not do more...lol
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 29,482 admin
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??

    Power Save probably just measures AC current--Not really AC watts... Many devices have fairly low power usage when in "standby" (few watts or less). But the VA (volts*amps) is still above the 6-8 watts (really 6-8 VA) because many AC loads have really bad power factors when in standby (again--just guessing).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • PhilSPhilS Solar Expert Posts: 370 ✭✭✭
    Re: Powersave vs. Non-Powersave on inverter??
    You may find that your new fridge needs power on continuously to run properly. My new fridge would not get my xantrix inverter out of power save.

    That's my situation. I installed an efficient fridge and a new Magnum inverter (replacing the old Trace MSW). But I couldn't have the Magnum go into idle (power save) because the fridge required constant power for its "brains".

    Yes, the inverter would go into 'idle' (powersave) and then the fridge wouldn't do anything until the inverter came out of idle (like switching on a light, for instance). (The fridge itself would not turn on nor pull the inverter out of idle.) Then it would initiate a sequence that started with an auto-defrost. That would negate any power I'd saved by the inverter being in an idle state. Actually, it negated much more than any power I'd saved.

    So THAT inverter stays "on". Not a big deal and both the fridge and inverter have been playing nicely together for years since I programmed the inverter to never go to "power save" or "idle".

    Phil
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