Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

ywhic
ywhic Solar Expert Posts: 621 ✭✭
in Off Grid Solar & Battery Systems #1
I just noticed the Midnite Solar LED Battery Meter for $50-55.. it sets for 12/24/48 v battery banks.. no shunts just plug and play with a small 1-2 amp fuse..

I also like the look of the Xantrex LinkPro but the $240 price tag is over my limit..

I've looked a the BlueSky ones and some others..

My Morningstar TS-45 has a remote battery sense lead option.. and I have the remote meter front.. should I just use that as there is a Battery Sense display (though I'm not sure on the refresh time)??

What do you folks utilize?? (any simple suggestions or tips appreciated..)

Do you folks just run with what the charge controller meters say??
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  • vtmaps
    vtmaps Solar Expert Posts: 3,741 ✭✭✭✭
    #2
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    Don't bother with any meter that doesn't have a shunt. The trimetric is a quality product and is relatively inexpensive. --vtMaps

    edit: trimetric does need a shunt, but does not come with one.
    4 X 235watt Samsung, Midnite ePanel, Outback VFX3524 FM60 & mate, 4 Interstate L16, trimetric, Honda eu2000i
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #3
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    MidNite's unit is an "intelligent Voltmeter". Better than an ordinary Voltmeter, but not in league with a true battery monitor.

    Charge controller meters can tell you what the Voltage of the battery is, but that is not the same as SOC on an active circuit. An actual battery monitor keeps track of the current going in and out of the battery, weighs it against the programmed capacity, and determines SOC moment to moment.

    They are very good to have, almost essential with AGM's, but not entirely necessary for flooded cells. A hydrometer costs a lot less. Once you get a system in working state you'll learn to judge SOC based on the controller's read out and an occasional SG check. That is all I use on my system, but then I'm a cheapskate with a lot of experience. :p

    If you have multiple charge controllers it becomes a different story, especially if they are of different types and can not network to share info. That's another instance where a battery monitor becomes highly valuable.
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  • 2manytoyz
    2manytoyz Solar Expert Posts: 373 ✭✭✭
    #4
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    I'm using a LinkPRO. Yes, it's not cheap, but it performs an important function without much effort from the user. Not only can I quickly see the battery bank SOC "EVERYTIME" I walk past the meter, but I can also see if the solar panels are charging the battery bank, and at what rate. Also can see how many hours a particular load will run at the present rate. As the load changes, or the charging changes, the hours remaining changes. It's easy to accidently kill a battery bank, especially when first starting out. This hardware is cheap insurance to me.

    The hydrometer is valuable too, but I only use that every couple of months. PITA by comparison.

    dscn3007.jpg

    The LinkPRO does come with a 500A shunt, but does not include the wire, or the two small fuses recommended per the instructions. You can either supply your own as I did, or buy the connection kit.

    Pics and details of the install at my last house here: http://2manytoyz.com/linkpro.html

    Happiness:

    dscn7238.jpg
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  • CATraveler
    CATraveler Solar Expert Posts: 98 ✭✭✭✭
    #5
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    I paid $166 for the Trimetric 2025 RV with 500A shunt, wire and 2 fuses. The first think I did was to record the draw of all of the electrical items. It's led to a much better understanding of actual SOC and the Magnum charger limitations.

    Shunt
    ShuntDSCN1866-Small.jpg
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  • Dill
    Dill Solar Expert Posts: 170 ✭✭
    #6
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??
    CATraveler wrote: »
    I paid $166 for the Trimetric 2025 RV with 500A shunt, wire and 2 fuses. The first think I did was to record the draw of all of the electrical items. It's led to a much better understanding of actual SOC and the Magnum charger limitations.

    Shunt


    I have the same meter, and it's been a great piece of equipment for me. I plan on getting another one for my off-grid cabin.
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  • CATraveler
    CATraveler Solar Expert Posts: 98 ✭✭✭✭
    #7
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    BTW Don't mount the shunt on top of flooded batteries as it will be subject to corrosion.
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  • TheBackRoads
    TheBackRoads Solar Expert Posts: 274 ✭✭
    #8
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    Victron battery meter, very easy to hook up. I also use the Midnite Solar LED Battery Meter you speak of, great for walking by and getting an approximate "at a glance" system health.
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #9
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    That raw copper will not last long.
    And what is the heavy cable that is on the battery terminal, at the copper strap for the shunt - that power will not get recorded!

    CATraveler wrote: »
    I paid $166 for the Trimetric 2025 RV with 500A shunt, wire and 2 fuses. The first think I did was to record the draw of all of the electrical items. It's led to a much better understanding of actual SOC and the Magnum charger limitations.

    Shunt
    ShuntDSCN1866-Small.jpg
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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  • boB
    boB Solar Expert Posts: 1,032 ✭✭✭✭
    #10
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??
    Cariboocoot wrote: »
    MidNite's unit is an "intelligent Voltmeter". Better than an ordinary Voltmeter, but not in league with a true battery monitor.

    Charge controller meters can tell you what the Voltage of the battery is, but that is not the same as SOC on an active circuit. An actual battery monitor keeps track of the current going in and out of the battery, weighs it against the programmed capacity, and determines SOC moment to moment.

    They are very good to have, almost essential with AGM's, but not entirely necessary for flooded cells. A hydrometer costs a lot less. Once you get a system in working state you'll learn to judge SOC based on the controller's read out and an occasional SG check. That is all I use on my system, but then I'm a cheapskate with a lot of experience. :p

    If you have multiple charge controllers it becomes a different story, especially if they are of different types and can not network to share info. That's another instance where a battery monitor becomes highly valuable.


    Amp-Hour In/Out meters are something that should be used for sure.

    But, the MNBCM will actually tell you something that none of the other meters (with shunts) will tell you. That is if your batteries have gotten a full charge lately.

    i.e., if your charger has brought the battery voltage to absorb long enough. This is important so you don't sulfate your batteries.

    You can tell a lot about a battery's state (over time) by just voltage and that is one of the biggies.

    Just didn't want to leave this out as it is important. A shunt meter could also do this if it was programmed in but I don't know
    of any (besides a shunt feedback ending amps type of absorb charge cycle which a battery meter by itself will not do.)

    boB
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  • CATraveler
    CATraveler Solar Expert Posts: 98 ✭✭✭✭
    #11
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??
    mike90045 wrote: »
    That raw copper will not last long.
    And what is the heavy cable that is on the battery terminal, at the copper strap for the shunt - that power will not get recorded!

    If they were flooded batteries I'd agree but with Lifeline AGMs I'm not expecting any problems.

    The battery cable on the negative posts connects to the second set of 6V batteries with the 4 configured for 12V in a series/parallel combination. So all of the power in/out of the batteries is recorded by the shunt.
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  • Wanderman
    Wanderman Solar Expert Posts: 180 ✭✭✭
    #12
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    I did a whole lot of research for a new battery monitoring system for my RV system. Depending on you MAX AMP Draw this may be what you are looking for. Originally I had a EMON ][ that did the job well had a nice shunt and was relatively accurate. however it had a single line calculator style display and you had to switch a toggle to see the various displays. I replaced it with the NASA BM-2 (NOT the BM-1) this comes with a 200AMP shunt and all the wiring as well as a bracket mount.

    take a look at:

    http://www.thewanderman.com/2012/05/updating-installing-new-energy.html

    that has the whole install documented.

    So far, in real world testing it has been spot on. Only time will tell.

    Rich
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  • H2SO4_guy
    H2SO4_guy Solar Expert Posts: 213 ✭✭✭
    #13
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    I use a Trimetric 2020 (Older version with 48 VDC adapter) purchased several years ago from NAWS. They had a good price, but I liked the fact that they did this forum and I told them that was the reason that I purchased it from them. It is now broken because I hooked it up to a 48 VDC system and I had it configured for 12 VDC, but I was using the adapter and Bogart Engineering said they would repair it for the cost of shipping only if it was only the 48 VDC adapter that got damaged, slightly more if something else was wrong. Great customer support for the Trimetric!!!
    12K asst panels charging through Midnite Classic 150's, powering Exeltechs and Outback VFX-3648 inverter at 12 and 48 volts.  2080 AH @ 48 VDC of Panasonic Stationary batteries (2 strings of 1040 AH each) purchased for slightly over scrap, installed August 2013.  Outback PSX-240X for 220 volt duties.  No genny usage since 2014. 
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  • vtmaps
    vtmaps Solar Expert Posts: 3,741 ✭✭✭✭
    #14
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    I have no experience with this: http://www.rc-electronics-usa.com/ammeters/rv-battery-monitor.html

    I have seen it recommended in another thread by BB, and it is inexpensive. --vtMaps
    4 X 235watt Samsung, Midnite ePanel, Outback VFX3524 FM60 & mate, 4 Interstate L16, trimetric, Honda eu2000i
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #15
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    The RC Electronics/Doc Watson/etc... are not true battery monitors. They only "count" the current flow in one direction--They do not differentiate between charging and discharging current flows (and they do not "reset" back to "full"/100% state of charge, etc. like a battery monitors does...).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • Crotalus
    Crotalus Solar Expert Posts: 26 ✭
    #16
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    I installed a Victron BMV-600 on my small travel trailer. So far I like it. I keep the "State of Charge" display up and at a glance I can see what is the most import piece of data that I need. The reason I bought this one is that it comes with a single 3 meter cable that you plug in at both ends and one wire with a fuse to the positive battery post. If need be you can get, as an extra cost option shorter and longer cables from the manufacture. The installation was very simple and straight forward.

    It has a relay that can be used to start and stop a generator. Also it has low voltage and high voltage alarms that you can program. There is an optional computer interface if there is any need.

    Here is the specs for anybody that might be interested from the manufacture's website. http://www.victronenergy.com/battery-monitors/bmv-600s%20and%20bmv-602s/

    Keith
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  • Shadowcatcher
    Shadowcatcher Solar Expert Posts: 228 ✭✭✭
    #17
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    I will second Crotaius. We just got back from a month long trip out west in our teardrop trailer. Being able to look at the SOC on the Victron and know with out much doubt where we were was very helpful. There were two ocasions one is Big Basin Redwoods and the other at Diamond O where we were in DEEP shade and getting very little direct sun. The high voltage panel and Morningstar MPPT Sun Saver brought us up to 100% SOC each day despite shade.
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  • willardj
    willardj Registered Users Posts: 15 ✭
    #18
    Re: Battery Meters.. Suggestions??

    I have a Trimetric 2025rv. It gives everything I could ask for at a glance. I think it was less than $200 for meter, shunt, and wires. The 2025 is also able to handle 12/24/48v w/o having to get an adapter.
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