Opinion on PV System

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Vic99
Vic99 Registered Users Posts: 16
I'd be grateful if you could help me.

I think I am ready to pull the trigger on a system in Massachusetts. I did a lot of research, but will be spending a lot of money and I'd like your opinion as to if this seems a solid system and if the price is in the ball park. I got two local companies evaluate my site. we worked through a system to meet 95% of my needs and both companies priced it with similarly within a few hundred bucks. I wanted to go with a bigger system, however.

Goal: Grid-tied, roof mounted solar PV to meet the majority/all of my electricity needs now and have room for the addition of an electric car in 4-5 years.

My site is south facing, most of the roof where the panels would fit would be at 28 degrees, four panels would be at 55 degrees. They calculated I'll get about 82% sun year round, this is after I had a tree taken down and a few branches trimmed. I'm told the Tigo maximizers will not only help with efficiency, but also prevent shade on one panel from killing the rest of the panels production. I was told that microinverters are not suitable for the 327 Watt panels. I talked to one guy who had a set up like this for a year and he was happy with it.

After several questions and a few revisions below is what seems to be the best. I haggled with this company after the initial proposal and got them to knock 1,000 bucks off. Below is the final price.

"5.56kW Photovoltaic system:
17 SunPower 327 watt High Efficiency photovoltaic modules, 1 SunPower inverter, 17 Tigo Power Maximizers, and all necessary balance of system materials (racking, wiring, disconnects, etc.). This price for complete, turnkey installation including all permits and rebate paperwork.


Gross Price $37,895
Less Commonwealth Solar II base rebate* - $2,000
Less CSII Moderate Home Value Adder rebate* - $2,000
Less anticipated 30% federal tax credit* - $10,169
Less anticipated 15% state tax credit* - $1,000
Total anticipated cost after rebates and tax incentives: $22,726


The above system would produce approximately 5,600kWh/year, which is an estimated 128% of your current electricity consumption. The anticipated payback period is 6-9 years and this includes the electrical upgrade to 200A service."

The last 2 years I've consumed between 4.25 and 4.5 MW annually.

Massachusetts allows solar home owners to sell SRECs. This year they are going for about $500/MW. The ceiling for the program is $540 /MW this year and next. The price will go down over time, but the floor is something like $170/MW and I'd be in for 10 years.

The company also told me to figure that I'd spend some cash to replace the inverter in ~15 years.

Thanks.

Comments

  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Re: Opinion on PV System
    Vic99 wrote: »
    .... I was told that microinverters are not suitable for the 327 Watt panels. I talked to one guy who had a set up like this for a year and he was happy with it....

    Who has had 327w panels on a roof for a year ? I thought they were still pretty new? Or have I lost all track of time ?
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

  • Vic99
    Vic99 Registered Users Posts: 16
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    Re: Opinion on PV System

    I was told they were new as well. Let me amend. The guy I spoke to had Sunpower panels with Tigo power max. His overall system size was the same as mine, but his panels were 235W or 245W, I believe.
  • solar_dave
    solar_dave Solar Expert Posts: 2,397 ✭✭✭✭
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    Re: Opinion on PV System

    Sounds a bit on the high side price wise. While I have not has a system quoted lately, the installed cost here is like $4.25 a watt. Your finish price is that but the installed price per rebate and tax credits is about $7 a watt.
  • rollandelliott
    rollandelliott Solar Expert Posts: 834 ✭✭
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    Re: Opinion on PV System

    The price $6.8/watt seems high?. Maybe it is the Tigo maximizers that push the price up? I've never used them and do not know how much they add per watt. Last time I checked a year ago installs were going for around $5 to $6 a watt on average. Mostly due to the plumming cost of solar panels.

    Are you handy at all? Because if you bought all the components you can get the
    panels at $0.78/watt, Enecsys or Enphase inverters for about $1/watt and racking @ $0.25/watt, add another $0.20 per watt for BOS and permit stuff. Total around $2.25 per watt. Of course these are standard 240watt panels, they might not fit that nicely on your roof compared to the more compact sunpowers. If you are not handy, then walking around on a roof and falling off and breaking your back is not worth any price savings!

    Also the return on investment seems way to short. I got a similar sized system in the Carolinas and my price to install was half yours and I was calculating a similar payback time. Might want to post their figgures here for us to check.
  • Vic99
    Vic99 Registered Users Posts: 16
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    Re: Opinion on PV System

    Here's a chart on MA website: http://www.dsireusa.org/incentives/incentive.cfm?Incentive_Code=MA98F&re=1&ee=1

    "The SACP is set at $550 (2012). The SACP will decrease only if DOER determines this is necessary based on market conditions; it will not be reduced by more than 10% in any year. The Solar ACP was amended and now includes a 10-year schedule (final rules must be promulgated). The schedule is:

    2012: $550

    2013: $550

    2014: $523

    2015: $496

    2016: $472

    2017: $448

    2018: $426

    2019: $404

    2020: $384

    2021: $365

    The Solar Carve-Out program is intended to support approximately 400 MW of solar facilities in Massachusetts. Once the state reaches that goal, and the opt-in term for all solar facilities has expired, SRECs will no longer be generated. Solar facilities will at that time generate renewable energy credits (RECs) and will be able to sell those for compliance under the Class I standard.

    The price of SRECs is determined primarily by market availability, although the DOER has created a certain amount of market stability by establishing a state Solar Credit Clearinghouse Auction (where prices are fixed at $300/MWh), as well as the Solar Alternative Compliance Payment (SACP) for the state RPS (set at $550/MWh for 2011). The Solar Credit Clearinghouse will only be utilized if or when SREC generators cannot sell their SRECs on the open market; the fixed price of $300/MWh effectively acts as price floor. The SACP, on the other hand acts, acts as a ceiling on the value of SRECs because it is the per-MWh payment that electricity suppliers must make if they fail to obtain enough SRECs to cover their RPS obligation."

    I can handle some home projects that involve carpentry, sheetrock, etc , but have no experience with electrical. Also have a toddler and 3 month old and work part time so that I can take care of kids during work week . . . so no time to learn and install. I would be intimidated by such a project even if I did have time.

    The price includes about $2k for upgrading to 200 Amps. Although I am doing fine with 100 Amps, it may be helpful with an electric car in the future. 327 W panels seem to be pretty high wattage for roof install for Joe Homeowner. I imagine that is why they cost more.

    Payback is also based on SRECS. 1 MW = 1 SREC. I spoke with one home owner who sold his for $500. He says this year they've sold for between $450-525. A broker company handles it for 5% I think.

    If I average $375/MW and make 5-6 per year + money I save on electric (currently $650-700/year and only going up I figure) I get 8-9 year payback.
  • rollandelliott
    rollandelliott Solar Expert Posts: 834 ✭✭
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    Re: Opinion on PV System

    Yeah the Srecs will help get that return on investment paid off quickly. I do not know a lot about Srec's, but do know people in MD complained about their value going down, way down.

    You might want to consider installing the panels and then having an electrician do the electrical work, but you know your limits and can make that decision yourself. You'll have to talk to your local buildings and codes dept to see if you can pull a homeowners permit.
  • Vic99
    Vic99 Registered Users Posts: 16
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    Re: Opinion on PV System

    From what I have heard, that is why they set a price floor for SRECs.