Distilled water

nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
"It's a little old Sears gallon in gallon out unit. (20+ years old at least)."

ralph,
do they still make it and if so give some details as the electric running that has to be cheaper than buying distilled water. many need it for batteries, but i need it for humidifying my cpap air.
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Comments

  • Ralph DayRalph Day Solar Expert Posts: 886 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Maximum output of an off grid system!

    Neil
    It's a Kenmore (so you get more) Stock # 75287, Model # 625.75287, date code is 98019 (98/01/9 ?) Not as old as I thought.

    Kill a watt meter says 460 watts with element and fan running. To complete a cycle takes about 6-7 hours. I'd leave the kaw on it, but it's on a diversion load from my MX, on off. on off. etc.

    Approx 4kwhrs per gallon (undocumented mind you), at 14cents per kwhr = 56cents per gallon. Just over half the price of a store bought gallon. My rate, zero cents per gallon...it's all from surplus to requirements solar power (and a bit of wind).

    If I wasn't so incredibly cheap I'd run a cycle off of the utility power just to know for sure if my measurements and calcs are correct:p

    Ralph

    on edit: I checked and Sears doesn't seem to carry them anymore, but there's lots on line if you search for ''1 gallon water distillers''.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Maximum output of an off grid system!

    tnx ralph, it may be worth my looking.

    note: we are talking of gallon water distillers here so one does not need to check the other thread.
  • Ralph DayRalph Day Solar Expert Posts: 886 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Maximum output of an off grid system!

    A friend who uses one regularly says they generally last 3 years or so, then fan motor bearings fail or the breaker fails, or the heating element fails. THey don't last forever under constant use (all your drinking water perhaps).

    I suppose if you paid $150 for one and used 1 gallon per day for 3 years ($185 in power) = $335 approx. If you bought 1 gallon per day at 99cents $365/year, then you're still further ahead to buy/replace/buy/replace than to buy it by the jug (in the order of $750 or so).

    I only use 75 litres of distilled water per year for electrolyte replacement in batteries (and clothes iron use). How much water does a cpap machine use as a rule?

    Rlaph
  • BrockBrock Solar Expert Posts: 632 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    I have one of the kenmore distillers. Ours pulls about 1000w and takes about 90 minutes to do a gallon. since we now have AGM's and have R/O for drinking water we don't use it much if at all.

    Could you get by with R/O water for the cpap? Our city water comes in about 150ppm and after the R/O it is about 10 ppm, pretty darn clean, but no the 0ppm of the distilled water.
    3kw solar PV, 8 L16's, xw 5548, Honda eu2000i, iota DLS-54-13, Leaf EV, 4 ton horizontal geothermal, grid tied - Green Bay, WI
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    ralph,
    i moved this to its own thread as i did not want to hijack the other one. the point of the initial cost and the lifespan of these distillers i must take into consideration here as that is not good on price or lifespan.

    my cpap will use no more than about a cup of water a day and often less as i don't super-heat the water. i use the minimal heat setting just to keep enough evaporation going. during warm months distilled water usually isn't needed until i start using the a/c and it takes moisture out of the air. under those circumstances i just shut off the heating element and let it evaporate naturally. of course winter is when the water is used up the most. a gallon of distilled water here is going $.85. odds are this will go up from the crazy gas pricing throwing everything into inflation.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    r/o? please clarify?

    anyway, any impurities will accumulate in the base plate of the cpap humidifier and would ruin it in time.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 29,368 admin
    Re: Distilled water

    R/O is reverse osmosis filtering.

    You might also want to look at a Deionizer Resin Bed system (just an example, I know nothing about the company)... They claim down to $0.10 per gallon (based on resin exchange/refill costs?). Resin life also depends on the TDS of the water supply.

    For high quality D/I water, I am not sure a consumer R/O system is the best solution.

    In any case, you can get an inexpensive TDS (Total Dissolved Solids) meter which measures the resistance of the water to check your current water supplies and monitor the output of a D/I system of some sort.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • BrockBrock Solar Expert Posts: 632 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    In our last house, on well water we had an R/O feeding an R/O. Our well water was 1800 tds and the first R/O took it to about 100 tds. The second R/O took it from 100 to 8. I would think at a tds of 8 you would get very little residue.

    For the record city water is abut 110, bottled water here is about 25 tds, distilled is 0 or sometimes 1

    I agree with Bill, get a tds meter and see what your water is to start. If it is under 200 I would think an R/O would get you darn close, I don't think you could beat that for cost over time and you can also use the R/O for drinking water and it stops all kinds of bad stuff in the water. When we lived in Milwaukee and had that big contaminated water problem, 30,000 people got sick, we were fine, but only drank R/O water, our neighbors on both sides got sick. I have never been without R/O after that.
    3kw solar PV, 8 L16's, xw 5548, Honda eu2000i, iota DLS-54-13, Leaf EV, 4 ton horizontal geothermal, grid tied - Green Bay, WI
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    i made the mistake of putting in tap water the first time i used it as i didn't get to the store to buy the distilled yet and i figured how bad can it be? pretty bad as there was quite the residue stain there laying on the bottom of the heating plate. this would be cumulative so r/o is out. memory ain't what it used to be, but i think my tap water was around 125 or 150tds if i'm even using the right measurement standards.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    i'm reviving this thread a bit to ask where i can get a tds meter? i was looking around to buy one locally, but it seems to be nonexistent that way. i went to sears as they showed allot of them, but the guy said they don't carry them in the store (no surprise there), but when he looked up the shipping it was more than the meter as it was about $30 to ship a $26 meter. that's crazy. now i won't get into credit cards or pay pal stuff as i'd do it the old fashioned way by sending a check. i definitely am leery of sites like ebay, but i just want a reliable place i might order one with some reasonable costs. i can google btw, but i'm hoping for a place people have dealt with.

    note here that i still didn't purchase anything for making distilled water as of yet. no hurry i suppose as it is cheap at the store until something happens and there's a run on it.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 29,368 admin
    Re: Distilled water

    It appears that Sears is offering free shipping for 4th of July (coupon shows on my screen). I don't know if it is really "free" shipping or they ship free to your store or whatnot...

    Amazon has various TDS meters with free ground shipping (if your order is >$25).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    I bought mine at the local (Hah! Now 500 kms away!) Home Depot. Less than $20.
  • SevenSeven Solar Expert Posts: 292 ✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    Neil,
    If you find one on Amazon that you like, post a link. I am wanting one also so I will get two of them and send you one of them.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    bb,
    you seem to be correct on the shipping circumstances right now and i see free shipping with in-store pickup too. i think i had talked to an inept employee and i may have to go back to sears if that opportunity presents itself for the other half is making plans for the next couple of days for us.:roll:

    leper,
    the one i was looking at on sears' site was
    http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_SPM3171491102P?prdNo=5&blockNo=5&blockType=G5
  • SevenSeven Solar Expert Posts: 292 ✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    This one looks to be the original that the other was copied from.
    http://www.amazon.com/Digital-TDS-3-Handheld-Meter-Carrying/dp/B0027KNARQ/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1309755190&sr=8-8
  • bmetbmet Solar Expert Posts: 630 ✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    Are you suggesting that SEARS is carrying an illegal product?
    Leper wrote: »
  • SevenSeven Solar Expert Posts: 292 ✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    I give them a little more credit than that. When I went looking, the first thing I noticed was the price. The one made by hm digital is twice as much as the one that doesn't have their name on it. The two look pretty much the same to me other than that. The one that sears is selling is only 9.99 on amazon. That is a bit more out of line than normal IMO. I didn't see where the company had changed names, so I did assume that the product was a copy of the original. You have to admit that a meter called the EZ meter is awful close to a company named Easy digital and could be made that way for a reason.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    thanks for that info on that meter. it seems i got a hold of somebody at sears in the carolinas as my local store was being swamped with calls at the time that i called and it was forwarded. it seems sears is allowing another outfit to ride their coattails and none of sears' shipping offers apply. i told them that the offer of free shipping to store was right there with those items and it should not be there if it doesn't apply to these items. it would appear that i stumbled onto some kind of racket riding on sears' name with their approval.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    interesting. check this out.
    http://www.octiva.net/projects/ppm/
    now i don't see them as being so expensive to warrant building a tds meter, but it's nice to know you can.

    there's also talk in there of not using dc because it rips molecules apart, but that using ac at a higher than 1khz frequency will not break up molecules. i'm thinking about desulfators in reference to that statement and i'm not going to pursue it here as that would detract too much from the subject matter. at least the tds is related as it is a means of determining said goal of having distilled water.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    well folks, i have to update you on the tds meter situation. i figured that since everybody was charging allot to ship these little meters that i might as well take advantage of an ad i saw on tv from target. it's that zerowater water purifier picture and it has a tds meter with it. they list 2 of them with one at 8 cups and the other at 23 cups. even though it is vague about the meter on the 8 cup version, it does have the meter and is, i believe, $34.97 at the store.

    long story short;

    tap water-197ppm
    old brita filter picture-57ppm
    local grocery store distilled-2ppm (may be due to impurities still on the bowl as it was not 100% clean as i saw a stain outline on it)
    recommended filter change-out by zerowater is when it exceeds 6ppm.8):D i haven't tried the filtered water by zerowater as of yet, but i'll let you know what i get shortly.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    odd as i got an 18ppm reading for the zerowater in the same bowl. by their standards it's time to change the filter even though it's brand new.:confused::roll:

    btw, for those wanting to know, the meter is by hmd and is model zt-2.

    aha. i didn't tighten the filter all of the way it seems. i will recheck it.

    it read 0ppm. wow!!!!!!
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    You're doing great from what I can tell.

    Water at our old house: 135
    Water at our new house: 430

    Gee I wish that last one was a mistake. :cry:
  • The Only SargeThe Only Sarge Solar Expert Posts: 164 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water
    niel wrote: »
    odd as i got an 18ppm reading for the zerowater in the same bowl. by their standards it's time to change the filter even though it's brand new.:confused::roll:

    btw, for those wanting to know, the meter is by hmd and is model zt-2.

    aha. i didn't tighten the filter all of the way it seems. i will recheck it.

    it read 0ppm. wow!!!!!!
    It takes a few gallons through it to get it to filter to top efficiency. Hard to improve on zero though aint it :)
  • bmetbmet Solar Expert Posts: 630 ✭✭
    Re: Distilled water
    It takes a few gallons through it to get it to filter to top efficiency. Hard to improve on zero though aint it :)

    So glad I have a deep Edward's well.
  • The Only SargeThe Only Sarge Solar Expert Posts: 164 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water
    bmet wrote: »
    So glad I have a deep Edward's well.
    Me too;)..............
  • mike95490mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 8,341 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water
    bmet wrote: »
    So glad I have a deep Edward's well.

    I'll take the bait. What's an Edward's well ?
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
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  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 29,368 admin
    Re: Distilled water

    I looked it up yesterday--My guess:

    Edwards Aquifer

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    like bb. i looked it up too. it is an aquifer that is filtering the water to some degree, but then many underground water systems are filtering the water to one degree or another too. for the water to just reach a certain depth means it passed through enough earth and rock to have less of the above ground contaminants while picking up more minerals. from the listing of the ppm and the makeup of what is in it i would not classify that as good filtered water, even though it may be drinkable, because of how much is being put into the water.
  • bmetbmet Solar Expert Posts: 630 ✭✭
    Re: Distilled water

    It's one of the best fresh water supplies in the world. Our well has perfect pH, no sulfur smell, no discoloration, no cloudiness, and perhaps a slight amount of limestone. It's fluoride free and chloride free. It's in the 'artesian' zone, from a pocket that opens up 1/4 mile deep. I don't draw from that depth, but it's a nice reassurance during times of drought.
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