Blaming rooftop solar for high electric bills

JRHill

I appreciated reading this article. Its not just a Cali thing, either:

https://www.mercurynews.com/2025/04/06/rooftop-solar-is-not-the-culprit-behind-high-electric-bills-advocates-say/

SumPower

I liked the line from the article copy and pasted here, "Today, for-profit utility rates in California are 67% higher than those of public utilities, Consumer Watchdog has said."

It doesn't take a watchdog group to figure this out, so why did it get mentioned?

Where does the money go?

It pays for the safer infrastructure needs, according to the for profit utilities.

But the public utilities say that thier infrastructure is already safe.

I was a former San Diego Gas and Electric customer, other than Hawaii they have the highest rates in the nation. I joke that thier rates were worth it, as we never had an outage the 4 years we lived there.

 

BB.

Our utility had very poor maintenance on their distribution system and cutting back trees, etc. Caused massive wild fires a few years ago that wiped out entire cities in Northern California.

https://www.newsweek.com/state-investigators-discover-pge-ignored-maintenance-problems-leading-deadliest-fire-california-1475416

Failure by Pacific Gas and Electric Company (PG&E) to properly maintain its towers and electric wires was directly responsible for the Camp Fire, a California wildfire that claimed 85 lives and destroyed over 150,000 acres of land, according to a report released by state investigators.

Ground observations of the tower where the fire began showed that a closer inspection of the tower was necessary. Despite that, no closer inspection—which would require climbing the tower—had been performed at the site since 2001.

In the report completed by the Safety and Enforcement Division (SED) of the California Public Utilities Commission, it was found that "the identified shortcomings in PG&E's inspection of the incident tower were not isolated, but rather indicative of an overall pattern of inadequate inspection and maintenance of PG&E's transmission facilities."

Initially installed between 1919 and 1921, the tower and equipment had been in use since 1921. Investigators found that a C-hook on the tower had worn out and was unable to support the weight of the insulating wires.

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=how+much+did+pg&e+pay+for+fires&ia=web

PGE has a history of starting fires because of faulty equipment and maintenance. Court cases that are in the 10's of millions to multi billion dollar payments.

https://www.kqed.org/news/11910835/pge-reaches-55-million-deal-to-avoid-criminal-prosecution-in-counties-ravaged-by-recent-wildfires

Pacific Gas & Electric, the nation’s largest utility, has agreed to pay more than $55 million to avoid criminal prosecution for two major wildfires sparked by its aging Northern California power lines, and submit to five years of oversight.

The company didn’t acknowledge any wrongdoing in the deals announced Monday with prosecutors in six count"When you combine that with the worsening drought conditions, increase heatwaves, the risk of fires are just so much higher now than even a decade ago," said Professor Jim Bushnell/UC Davis Haas Energy Economist.

A big part of those eye popping rate increases are because more than a half million Californians have become more energy self-sufficient. 

"Households like those with rooftop solar generally do not pay very much for those infrastructure costs and that's just because of the way our rates are designed in California," said Bushnell.

So, some experts say, solar rooftop owners may lose some saving advantages to make things more fair for the many non-solar folks. 

"Whether, for example, households with solar power on the roofs should be paying their fair share of these wildfire mitigation expenses. This is an opportunity for the PUC to reconsider aspects of a monthly fixed charge that would distribute those kind of costs across all households," said Bushnell. 

That could mean adding a monthly charge on solar users' bills; something being considered by the CPUC even now.

And there were large PGE rate increases because of solar customers:

https://www.ktvu.com/news/residential-solar-owners-could-avoid-paying-for-proposed-pge-rate-increase

...ravaged by last year’s Dixie Fire and the 2019 Kincade Fire. The utility still faces criminal charges for the 2020 Zogg Fire in Shasta County that killed four people.

The two civil settlements are designed to accelerate payments to hundreds of people whose homes were destroyed so they can start rebuilding more quickly than those who suffered devastating losses in 2017 and 2018 blazes that also were ignited by PG&E’s equipment. Those fires prompted the utility to negotiate settlements that included $13.5 billion earmarked for victims — money that still hasn’t been completely distributed.

...

All told, PG&E has been blamed for more than 30 wildfires since 2017 that have destroyed more than 23,000 homes and businesses and killed upward of 100 people.

Not that California government's failure to manage forest/rural lands for brush, trees, etc. that created fire hazards, homeless camps in cities (something like 50% of Los Angles FD calls are to homeless encampments), and poor infrastructure maintenance (reservoir drained due to small unrepaired tear in cover, lack of fire truck maintenance, etc....).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palisades_Fire

Lots of blame to spread around for high power costs in California.

-Bill

Dave Angelini

Agree that the Utility was in bed with Newscum and his ilk. Probably still is.

 Watched them spend millions repairing 700KV lines with helicopters. Then they did it all over again when it burned.

JRHill

So some Cali folk invest in solar power generation to offset their power bills and maybe even to help with disbursed contributions to help with increased power consumption overall. Then they get blamed and penalized for doing exactly what the 'system' motivated them to do in the first place. Ya can't make this stuff up.

Then there are local things that @SumPower and our household is aware of right now. Our local PUD which I thought I admired had its General Manager separate with a finishing salary of $331k!?! Nobody makes that kind of money around here off the local economy. We are the largest and one of the least populated counties in WA State. Then there are the contractual follow on benefits for the exiting GM. This is a non-profit PUD with oversight of Commissioners, etc. How did this happen?

Things can get really dirty. And I can't express my frustration because we are not a customer. But if that salary, JUST HIS, was spread to subscribers for direct costs and debt reduction.... This is the world we live in these days. It's good to live off grid in the forest.

Next up: Tariffs. Or the tree that blocked the trail for the wifes weekly shopping trip.

JRHill

I could spit bullets.

SumPower

I see I was mentioned so I thought I could maybe add some clarity?

General Manager severance! If the board of directors and the general manager had to answer to stock holders, it is the opinion of the majority of people I talk to that they all would have been fired by now.

If it was an investor owned utility they more than likely would have been terminated.

With about $140 million in debt with aproximately 13,000 customers. But hey, we have smart meters installed now district wide. So "Time of use rates", and "peak demand charges" can be levied to get them out of the debt.

Bondoggle was a twin 10Mw turbine power plant combined with a 6Mw steam plant that was 10's of millions of dollars expense, but never went online due to unforseen technical problems. Problems that they were told about, but good marketing and saleman from companies selling them products assured them would work. Please someone correct me if I am wrong! LOL

SumPower

JRHill

There is Cali and their problems. Then shenanigan's in a very rural place per the last few posts.

In this day and time you can get honked anywhere you live. So I've said enough and that I CAN'T participate in the system as it is so I am fortunate for better or worse without a power bill and the politics AND with our system limitations. But we live within those limitations and it is really no big deal for two old retired people. I don't miss blow driers and we don't have a toaster oven.

So there are a bunch more people around the U.S. and the world in this forum. What say you if you are involved further than just paying the monthly bill?

Dave Angelini

Paying a bill for electricity does not always mean you can't be independent and prepared to defend your property. The bill, a fire hydrant 100 feet away and insurance for $600 is worth it for many.

For us, it meant being able to have a property that was worth it's value (we love it) and not lose the value as one does offgrid. Two decades of offgrid and we barely got what we put into the home. We were lucky to sell it in a year. Many take 5 + years to sell. There were 9 other reasons on the list that caused us to leave Cali and offgrid.

Please do not think that I don't miss the lifestyle. It all can be done including hair dryers, toasters, and heat pumps. Just can't do it all at once😉

Dave Angelini

"I was a former San Diego Gas and Electric customer, other than Hawaii they have the highest rates in the nation. I joke that thier rates were worth it, as we never had an outage the 4 years we lived there."

 

Sumpower, you were lucky me thinks. The right 4 years to be there. The Santa Annas are a major threat to living in San Diego. Some of the best weather in the world ! Except for the winds blowing that fast.

JRHill

Dave Angelini said:

Paying a bill for electricity does not always mean you can't be independent and prepared to defend your property. The bill, a fire hydrant 100 feet away and insurance for $600 is worth it for many.

For us, it meant being able to have a property that was worth it's value (we love it) and not lose the value as one does offgrid. Two decades of offgrid and we barely got what we put into the home. We were lucky to sell it in a year. Many take 5 + years to sell. There were 9 other reasons on the list that caused us to leave Cali and offgrid.

Please do not think that I don't miss the lifestyle. It all can be done including hair dryers, toasters, and heat pumps. Just can't do it all at once😉

Dave, I loved seeing your post. Well written and thoughtful.

But for some the very things that may be a negative are a positive to others but they are few. We KNOW that living where we are is a negative on Zillow. Excellent! Screw Zillow. This is not a flip property - all 160 acres of PNW woods on VERY rough trail, 4WD all year.

When the time comes it will be a hard sell. But the right person will jump in a heartbeat. It won't be earth shattering gain (more so the woods) but it will be something.

Actually, I wanted a place for the children. They have their bug out place. But they are all city people. Back to Zillow.... It's curious that they know where to come if times get hard. There is no hydrant except for 10gpm.

Dave Angelini

Yours too !  😎     Watching a neighbors flag with Jesus on it with the thorn hat and his arms around an American flag.

JRHill

Power is one thing. Then there's everything else:

https://www.businessinsider.com/homesteading-didnt-save-money-groceries-2025-4