The horror, the horror...

mtdoc
mtdoc Solar Expert Posts: 600 ✭✭
in Solar Skeptics, Hype, & Scams Corner #1
Just use unused phone lines for 12V solar power distribution. Sure, what could possibly go wrong...:roll:

I can't believe Hackaday is publishing this.
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #2
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    Egad. Phone wire is pretty small gauge. How much current do they expect you can push through 22 AWG? Oh and no worries about Voltage drop, eh?

    Never mind that 120 VAC outlet with the 12 Volt label (illegal). :roll:
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  • mtdoc
    mtdoc Solar Expert Posts: 600 ✭✭
    #3
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    Yeah, that's the real issue - the ampacity of the wire, not the plugs. He initially had no fusing . Reading the comments, it looks like he's now added a 3 amp fuse. Still not adequate protection - maybe with 1 amp fusing but then what's the point - he'd only be able to use it to charge a phone or two or turn on a couple of very small led lamps.
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  • WillBkool
    WillBkool Solar Expert Posts: 35 ✭✭
    #4
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    If you read the comments, most people are definitely against using regular outlets like that.:D

    I'll bet his insurance won't cover using phone lines for this project.
    1220 Watts, 4 Evergreen 120 watt, 1 Eoplly 190 watt; 1 Sungold 200 watt; 2 175 Watt; M-Star 15A MPPT; C40 PWM; 6 105 AH AGM Configured to 315@24V
    Cotek 1500 watt/24v
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  • jonr
    jonr Solar Expert Posts: 1,386 ✭✭✭✭
    #5
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    It's standard practice to use ethernet cables (similar in ampacity) for low level power distribution. But always use a fuse that matches the wire.

    I am available for custom hardware/firmware development

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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #6
    Re: The horror, the horror...
    jonr wrote: »
    It's standard practice to use ethernet cables (similar in ampacity) for low level power distribution. But always use a fuse that matches the wire.

    Is it? In what country?
    And talk about "low level" power ... 22 AWG is certainly only suited for low power. Couple of Volts and a few mA. Technically that's power.
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,631 admin
    #7
    Re: The horror, the horror...


    Power over Ethernet
    The original IEEE 802.3af-2003[2] PoE standard provides up to 15.4 W of DC power (minimum 44 V DC and 350 mA[3][4]) to each device.[5] Only 12.95 W is assured to be available at the powered device as some power is dissipated in the cable.[6]

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #8
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    Yes; Ethernet powered devices. Like USB powered devices.

    You KNOW what the problem is here: people putting a 12 Volt battery at one end and a 10 Amp load at the other and setting the wiring on fire inside the wall.

    That is not the same as using Ethernet for Ethernet or USB for USB or phone lines for phones.
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  • South Africa
    South Africa Solar Expert Posts: 295 ✭✭✭
    #9
    Re: The horror, the horror...
    Cariboocoot wrote: »
    You KNOW what the problem is here: people putting a 12 Volt battery at one end and a 10 Amp load at the other and setting the wiring on fire inside the wall.

    With the knowledge today out in the real world (thinking of what kids learn at school ... not!) versus about how things really work, I am with you on this one Cariboocoot. Can just see that big battery on the one side with phone wires connected to a 12v car kettle. :-)
    5kVA Victron Multiplus II, 5.2kW array, 14kWh DIYLifepo4 bank, all grid-tied.


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  • jonr
    jonr Solar Expert Posts: 1,386 ✭✭✭✭
    #10
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    It really doesn't matter if you are talking about .5 amp, 5 amps or 500 amps. If you don't use the right fuse/breaker you can melt wires and start fires. 5+ watts is a useful amount of power for some lighting.

    I am available for custom hardware/firmware development

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  • waynefromnscanada
    waynefromnscanada Solar Expert Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭✭
    #11
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    But will my fridge start OK on phone wire? I need that during power outages. Sounds like I wasted tons of money, had no idea I could have used cheap phone wire. Gotta tell my cousin about this, he's getting ready to wire his place, no need of us both wasting money. And he used to work for the phone company, so has lots of scrap phone wire.
    Really, really appreciate this awesome money saving information! :D:D:D
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  • KenZ71
    KenZ71 Solar Expert Posts: 58 ✭✭
    #12
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    This is actually an old concept. Anyone remember a phone hanging on the wall that had buttons that lit up? Remember those buttons still lighting up when the power was out? Not too long ago!

    My mom had a 10 foot coiled cord so she could walk all around the kitchen while talking to friends and cooking. Multi tasking!
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  • inetdog
    inetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    #13
    Re: The horror, the horror...
    KenZ71 wrote: »
    This is actually an old concept. Anyone remember a phone hanging on the wall that had buttons that lit up? Remember those buttons still lighting up when the power was out? Not too long ago!

    My mom had a 10 foot coiled cord so she could walk all around the kitchen while talking to friends and cooking. Multi tasking!
    And a crick in her neck from holding the handset against her shoulder. :)
    The lighted dial on the princess phones took so much power that they put one of the early wall wart transformers on the line and carried AC to the phone over the normally unused wires.

    You can also see articles about using that phone line power of 48V DC at limited amperage to charge batteries and operate little lights. TELCO does not like that idea, of course.
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
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  • KenZ71
    KenZ71 Solar Expert Posts: 58 ✭✭
    #14
    Re: The horror, the horror...

    Using telco lines to charge batteries sounds tempting. Too bad I have not had a land line in the past six years. I went voip never looked back.

    As for power of Ethernet many office buildings now have phones that draw power through the Ethernet line. What goes around comes around? Leta hope rotary phones dont come back!
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