First step to mainstream wind

TelcoTelco Solar Expert Posts: 201 ✭✭✭✭✭
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080512/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/wind_energy;_ylt=AgOawtvEsLg2NiAGtcgxCSms0NUE]This story sez that we have the technology now to make up to 20 percent of the USA's electricity from windmills, the same percentage as is now made by nukes. Sez we'd also have to upgrade the electrical grid to transport the power from high wind areas to low wind areas.

Usually, the first step to making a major change like this is for the government to make the announcement that it's technologically possible. This implies government backing, which gets the money moving. ;)

Comments

  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 30,638 admin
    Re: First step to mainstream wind

    Oh yea! Just waiting for my lights to brighten and dim with the wind and brownouts to destroy all of my motor driven appliances...

    Storage anyone?

    Here is a clip of a rant on wind/state RE power earlier this year:
    A Texas utility did a study and found that they could only reduce their total power generation (like a nuclear or coal plant) by ~2.6% of the name plate rating of a wind farm. Denmark, yes they have lots of wind power, but had to ship something like 50% of their expensively generated power outside of their borders (at a loss) because they could not efficiently consume/load-shift/store the power in-country.
    ...
    At this point, we are only talking about a few percent of the total California electrical power market (small grid tied solar/RE producers)--which will continue to have very little effect on our over power. The big business side of power production gives us about 12% Renewables from RE (California/NW/Canada large hydro electric accounts for another 23% of the total).

    It is interesting to me, that according to PG&E (if the 2006 data is presented correctly--PS: Link appears to be dead now), that Solar PV (home/small business Grid Tied Inverter) systems add up to less than 1% of 12% (renewable energy mix) of the current electrical supply mix. And wind now accounts for 11% of the 12%...

    Huge amounts of effort and money (~33%-50% state cash rebates and federal income tax deductions) with a very small rate of useful return at this time (0.5-1.0% of the total northern California power grid).
    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • System2System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: First step to mainstream wind

    Even better, with our North American attitudes: NOT IN MY BACKYARD!!!!!!!!!
    Not even on that hill way over there on the horizon, I might see it and that would cause me mental distress and I'd just have to call my Lawyer.
    NO, not even out to sea, who wants to head out to sea in their private yaght, only to see those hellish works of the Devil? So what if the ice caps are melting, who cares as long as I never have to see one of those things, they might devalue my property. I'd rather it sink below the waves, then I can get insurance. And the noise! It drives me crazy knowing the income is going into my neighbors pocket instead of mine. Every time I hear the thing it reminds me that he's getting rich, instead of me and It's driving me nuts. I'm gonna call my Lawyer, this has to be stopped!
    End of rant. Sorry, I just had to get it off my chest.
    Wayne
  • System2System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: First step to mainstream wind

    I wish we,as a nation, could come together and do the right thing.
    Last year I attended a town meeting that was investigating the prospect of big wind in their community.
    One person proclaimed that big wind is a good idea but this wasn't the place for it.
    I almost fell out of my seat in hysteria after hearing that. Of course I wondered, "just where is the place for it."
    Think about it. We don't conserve energy as we should. We drive gas guzzlers. We pollute as if there's no tomorrow. Were screwed.
    Oh yeah, did you look inside the controller?
  • System2System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: First step to mainstream wind
    Oh yeah, did you look inside the controller?
    Hahahaha. Good ending :)
  • TelcoTelco Solar Expert Posts: 201 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: First step to mainstream wind

    I agree only on the noise thing. I'd like to see windmills in my area (Oklahoma winds are always blowing) BUT I'd like to see them in areas away from the population centers. Best way to do it would be to put up a large windmill plant, then put an industrial park in around it. The industrial park will be the largest customer for the windmills in the area anyway. Combine this with new blade designs that minimize noise generation, and there shouldn't be any real issue with them.

    We already have hydro generators on the Arkansas River about every 10 miles or so.
  • mike95490mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 8,817 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: First step to mainstream wind
    Telco wrote: »
    We already have hydro generators on the Arkansas River about every 10 miles or so.

    That's what happened to all the fish !
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  • System2System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: First step to mainstream wind
    mike90045 wrote: »
    That's what happened to all the fish !

    Who cares, they don't have nice soft fir and big dark eyes like "baby" seals do.
    Hummm, remind me - - what do seals eat again? Oh yeah, FISH!

    I've got to stop being so sarcastic don't I? LOL
    Guess all the non-reasoning and irrational, emotion driven NIMBY idiots are finally getting to me. Most of us on this form, I believe, see the overall big picture, while many of the outside masses seem so focused on their own little world that they neither see, nor care, nor have any interest in learning about anything beyond their own minute lives. The result is very detrimental to both the renewable energy sector and our world in general.
    OK Wayne, no more rants. That's enough.
    Peace
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 30,638 admin
    Re: First step to mainstream wind
    Who cares, they don't have nice soft fir and big dark eyes like "baby" seals do.
    Hummm, remind me - - what do seals eat again? Oh yeah, FISH!

    I know how to fix the problem, shoot the seals and feed them to the fishes. Then everybody is happy. :p
    The Humane Society of the United States announced its strong opposition to a plan approved by the National Marine Fisheries Service today to allow state agents to shoot as many as 85 California sea lions at Bonneville Dam on the Columbia River straddling Oregon and Washington.

    The agency claims that sea lions must be killed to prevent them from eating their normal average of 0.4 to 4.2 percent of salmon returns this year, even though both Oregon and Washington State recently proposed to increase fishing quotas by 33 percent (from 9 to 12 percent of the run) in light of record salmon returns for 2008...
    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • TelcoTelco Solar Expert Posts: 201 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: First step to mainstream wind

    And the proof is in the posting!

    Oilman to invest 2 Billion with a B dollars in wind energy! Windmills expected to be online by 2011.

    texan1.gif
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 30,638 admin
    Re: First step to mainstream wind

    From Telco's article:
    But the industry has relied on federal tax credits to survive, a point Pickens underscored Thursday.

    "I believe that Congress will recognize that it is critical not only to this project, but to renewable energy in this country, that they enact a long-term extension of the Production Tax Credits," Pickens said.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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