car battery chargers

ws9876ws9876 Solar Expert Posts: 372 ✭✭✭
most all car batteries these days are agm. What is a good quality ac wall plug in car battery charger that has useful features for different kinds
of batts and
can be used to wall charge solar batteries too if needed...??? I think I use my cheap shumacher maybe 10 times before it breaks...garbage company..

Comments

  • solar_davesolar_dave Solar Expert Posts: 2,343 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers

    I have a NOCO charger off eBay that I use and it supports AGM, look for a feature list as some of the lower priced models do not.
    12V/24V Compatibility
    Charges 12V and 24V batteries
    Auto-memory
    Returns to last selected mode when restarted
    Fully Interactive
    Automatically adjusts itself to changing current needs
    Designed for Safety
    Reverse polarity, short circuit, open circuit, spark proof, overheat, overcurrent, and overcharge
    Multiple Battery Chemistry
    Safely chargers Wet, Gel, MF, and AGM batteries
  • VicVic Solar Expert Posts: 2,970 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers

    ws,

    IMHO, think that most auto starting batteries are Low Maintenance. Lead/Calcium with non removable or difficult to remove covers.

    Believe that AGM batts ARE Lead/Calcium, however. Have not researched the above, however. Vic
    Off Grid - Two systems -- 4 SW+ 5548 Inverters, Surrette 4KS25 1280 AH [email protected], 11.1 KW STC PV, 4X MidNite Classic 150 w/ WBjrs, Beta KID on S-530s, MX-60s, MN Bkrs/Boxes.  25 KVA Polyphase Kubota diesel,  Honda Eu6500isa,  Eu3000is-es, Eu2000,  Eu1000 gensets.  Thanks Wind-Sun for this great Forum.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 29,518 admin
    Re: car battery chargers

    I too believe that AGM and GEL are Lead/Calcium (calcium reduces gassing/water usage).

    I got one of these Battery Tenders from NAWS (when they sold them for awhile). Seems to work fine on my In-Law's spare car (keeps battery charged and does not lose water).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers

    Car batteries are not Absorbed Glass Matt. They are sealed Flooded Lead Acid. The main difference between these two types is that AGM's have a fibreglass matt between the plates that acts as a separator and just enough electrolyte to work whereas the FLA's have spacers and a high of volume of acid. In either case the plates are lead mixed with other elements as the manufacturer sees fit to provide stability and improve performance.

    Any standard automotive charger will work on them. They want higher Voltage charging than an AGM would. They also do not need the three stage charging that deep cycle batteries need. The typical charging pattern is to Bulk to 13.8 Volts and hold there, as that is pretty much how they function in a car.

    In a pinch, any standard automotive charger will Bulk charge deep cycles to just under the typical Absorb set point.

    There are many companies making "smart chargers" supposedly capable of charging multiple battery types. I have found them to be disappointing, but that doesn't mean there aren't some good ones out there; I just haven't found one yet.

    Never had any trouble with Schumacher chargers either. But like all companies they make a range of chargers and avoiding the low-end products is always good advice.
  • mike95490mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 8,380 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers

    I have a Vector / Black & Decker VEC1093 12V Charger, that appears to work well with deep cycle batteries, and has selections for different chemistrys.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

  • CDN_VTCDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers
    Car batteries are not Absorbed Glass Matt. They are sealed Flooded Lead Acid. They also do not need the three stage charging that deep cycle batteries need. The typical charging pattern is to Bulk to 13.8 Volts and hold there, as that is pretty much how they function in a car.
    That would of been info from 2005 tech and before, later in Fine Euro Vehicles things have changed.

    One of the type of Chargers We use .
    Euro Designed . i have 3 different types of that make , 2 iota's 75dsl / 90 dsl and a 45 midtronics charger/maintainer

    Many new Euro Vehicles have Absorbed Glass Matt Batteries , yes some have more than one , some three. As with charging , that also has changed , Big Time

    Edited add:
    Basic charging from the alternator/generator unit is the same, but there now is different stepping of amounts and voltages. 13.9 and up to 18.6 Vdc.
    Well I live in Canada, and we only recently switched from 6 Volt to 12 Volt systems in our Monarchs and Fargos. :p

    Seeing that from a "Super Moderator" really makes me feel like the 2 hours i spent , getting 2012 "REAL" info to post was worthless.
    Ill just read here.
  • CariboocootCariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers
    CDN_VT wrote: »
    That would of been info from 2005 tech , later in Fine Euro Vehicles things have changed.

    One of the type of Chargers We use .
    Euro Designed . i have 3 different types of that make , 2 iota's 75dsl / 90 dsl and a 45 midtronics charger/maintainer

    Many new Euro Vehicles have Absorbed Glass Matt Batteries , yes some have more than one , some three. As with charging , that also has changed , Big Time

    I need to see if posting info of this type gets me in do-do , I'll edit in a bit


    VT

    Well I live in Canada, and we only recently switched from 6 Volt to 12 Volt systems in our Monarchs and Fargos. :p
  • ws9876ws9876 Solar Expert Posts: 372 ✭✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers

    is a Monarch a car????????????? never heard of it except in 1973 maybe..

    I ordered the Noco 3500,,, the others were too much

    a 24/48 v solar set up is worth buying a special charger for..
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers

    actually most car batteries are not agm at least in north america. can agms be used in a car? yes, i suppose if sized right. most agms are not set up for starting applications and are a more expensive deep cycle battery so i would not expect to see one in a car.

    btw, we as moderators do try to help as best as we can, but even we aren't perfect and we never claimed to be so if we disappoint you then you can direct all of us to somebody better.
  • CDN_VTCDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    Re: car battery chargers

    All i was getting at was that a post at 13:00H and a scoff reply within 15 mins , when all I was trying to post real info that most have NO idea what is a small portion of the "New Protocol's " that most "north america" vehicles have adopted since 2007-8 and later. This was for all I hoped for learning , as I do here.

    Many new Vehicles north america (Fords) or Imported (Audi-Volvo) all have now with Bi-Xenon ,LED lamps use this charging systems and many have AGMs.
    Whats to come is Li-ion to Lithium Iron Phosphate Rechargeable Battery , so testing I've read.2014 or later , but as a internal Starting battery.

    So here is a cut & paste of some pages from euro manual ,The MOST,CAN,UNIA systems have been omitted, all acronyms have been typed out in full for better understanding.
    __________________________________________________
    Charge voltage
    At room temperature a fully charged battery cell produces 2.12V. A 12V battery has 6 cells and therefore produces 12.72V when the battery is fully charged. The battery has an internal resistance which must be exceeded before charging can take place. At room temperature 0.2 V is required per cell, or 1.2 V for the entire battery. Therefore to charge a battery at room temperature, 13.92 V (12.72 V+1.2 V) is required. In cold conditions, the chemical reactions take place at a slower rate and the internal resistance increases. This requires a higher voltage during charging to exceed the internal resistance. The charge regulator, depending on how it is controlled by the engine control module and central electronic module , regulates the output voltage so that the battery receives optimal charge.

    The charge regulator (also called the alternator control module) is connected to the engine control module and communicate via LIN communication.
    LIN (Local Interconnect Network) is a standardised protocol for serial communication on a single wire between a master and several slave nodes.
    The LIN protocol supports Multiplex communication, which means several nodes can communicate on the same wire without disturbing each other.
    The engine control module then communicates with the central electronic module via the controller area network to regulate the generator .
    The central electronic module has internal functions to regulate the voltage level and the power consumption in the vehicle. The central electronic module controls the charge regulator via the engine control module and therefore the current/voltage generated by the generator.
    The generator does not initially charge when the engine is started. The charge increases successively when the engine has been started. When there is an increase in load at the generator, the increase from 0 – 100% takes place over the course of a few seconds (this time varies slightly depending on the operating mode the engine management system is in). This is to gradually increase the load on the engine during the start-up phase and to ensure the engine starts.
    If the engine speed (RPM) exceeds idle speed (the exact engine speed varies slightly depending on the mode the engine management system is in) during this delay, or if the progressive increase is interrupted, full charge is obtained immediately.
    If there is no communication with the charge regulator, the charge regulator will not start charging on start-up. The charge regulator can however self magnetize the rotor and start charging. This occurs at engine speeds greater than approximately 2100 rpm. There is no charge engagement by stages with self magnetization, the generator operates at full charge immediately.
    When self magnetizing has begun, the generator also charges at engine speeds below 2100 rpm.
    Charge voltage
    In order to charge the battery optimally, the central electronic module calculates output voltage from the alternator based on battery temperature. The alternator control module (charge regulator) will then regulate output voltage based on control from the central electronic module . As the engine control module can also control the alternator, there may be output voltages deviations, such as in different driving situations.Depending on the position of the knob in the light switch module, the module transmits a request to the central electronic module to switch on low beam. Central electronic module supplies power to the low beam directly via an output.
    The level of the supply voltage to the low beam is controlled using pulse width modulation of the central electronic module . This means that the average value of the voltage level to the low beam does not exceed 13.2 V, despite the fact that the supply voltage may be higher.
    To change to high beam, the left-hand control stalk is pulled towards the steering wheel. A signal is sent via LIN communication from the steering wheel module to the central electronic module , which activates the internal high beam relay and supplies power to the high beam. For Bi-Xenon lamps, the position of the reflector is also changed so that the Xenon lamp is on at high beam. Attachment not found.

    VT
Sign In or Register to comment.