Something from nothing

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  • john p
    john p Solar Expert Posts: 814 ✭✭✭
    #92
    Re: Something from nothing

    Even a silicon bridge rectifier would cut the voltage to the bulb.not exactly .A bridge rectifier gives 1.4 v DC of AC volts but reduces the current to .6DC of AC current.
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  • SolaRevolution
    SolaRevolution Solar Expert Posts: 410 ✭✭
    #93
    Re: Something from nothing

    Can a T-shirt be made into an energy source and storage medium for electronic devices?
    http://phys.org/news/2012-06-body-electric.html

    How about harvesting energy from garden pests?
    http://io9.com/5892995/researchers-have-created-electricity-generating-cyborg-snails


    No one is going to disconnect their home from the utility because of these newly available sources of energy, but it still has to make you wonder what else is out there.
    :D

    -Alex
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  • SolaRevolution
    SolaRevolution Solar Expert Posts: 410 ✭✭
    #94
    Re: Something from nothing

    The Higgs Boson. The "God Particle" - existence confirmed.

    "We" have now opened a new door to our understanding of all matter and energy. It is just the beginning of whole new perspective.

    What will become possible as we develope an understanding of what gives matter mass?

    http://phys.org/news/2012-07-cern-physicists-strong-evidence-particle.html
    From the Article:
    "The next step will be to determine the precise nature of the particle and its significance for our understanding of the universe. Are its properties as expected for the long-sought Higgs boson, the final missing ingredient in the Standard Model of particle physics? Or is it something more exotic? The Standard Model describes the fundamental particles from which we, and every visible thing in the universe, are made, and the forces acting between them."


    -Alex Aragon
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #95
    Re: Something from nothing

    Don't hold your breath waiting for the answers, okay?
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  • SolaRevolution
    SolaRevolution Solar Expert Posts: 410 ✭✭
    #96
    Re: Something from nothing
    Cariboocoot wrote: »
    Don't hold your breath waiting for the answers, okay?


    No kidding.

    (Re: Higgs Bosons)

    As with other new discoveries, it can take a while to put the knowledge to use. It will be interesting to see what we're already doing that will be influenced by this. Thomas Edison and Nikola Tesla did a major portion of their work before electrons were first discovered in 1897. Imagine what they would have thought if they'd caught a glimpse what the computer in front of you is capable of.

    The future will come. The question is who will be around to see it?

    -Alex Aragon
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  • ggunn
    ggunn Solar Expert Posts: 1,973 ✭✭✭
    #97
    Re: Something from nothing
    Cariboocoot wrote: »
    Don't hold your breath waiting for the answers, okay?
    The good news is that the scientists at Cern are pretty sure that their experiments won't set off a chain reaction that will covert all the mass in the universe into energy. :D
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  • nsaspook
    nsaspook Solar Expert Posts: 396 ✭✭✭
    #98
    Re: Something from nothing
    SolaRevolution wrote: »
    No kidding.

    (Re: Higgs Bosons)

    As with other new discoveries, it can take a while to put the knowledge to use. It will be interesting to see what we're already doing that will be influenced by this. Thomas Edison and Nikola Tesla did a major portion of their work before electrons were first discovered in 1897. Imagine what they would have thought if they'd caught a glimpse what the computer in front of you is capable of.

    The future will come. The question is who will be around to see it?

    -Alex Aragon

    Higgs is less of a discovery and more of a confirmation of the standard models prediction of a "field/particle" at that energy with the observed properties that explains other particles mass and interaction with energy. So far nothing unexpected or exotic (for the Beyond Standard Model theorists) has been seen at the LHC but a upgrade in energy and luminosity in a few years might change that as we peel the onion.
    The issue is this: It is **impossible** to write equations that both give the electron a mass AND allow it to behave as it does when affected by the weak nuclear force… unless there is a Higgs field, or something like it, added to the equations.

    In short, what cannot be reconciled is two facts about nature obtained from data: (a) an electron having mass, and (b) electrons and neutrinos interacting as they do with the weak nuclear force — unless a third fact is true — that (c) something like a Higgs field (and possibly a Higgs particle, too) exists.

    http://profmattstrassler.com/articles-and-posts/the-higgs-particle/why-the-higgs-particle-matters/
    http://profmattstrassler.com/articles-and-posts/the-higgs-particle/the-discovery-of-the-higgs/higgs-discovery-the-data/
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  • SolaRevolution
    SolaRevolution Solar Expert Posts: 410 ✭✭
    #99
    Re: Something from nothing

    More energy now available from "thin air":

    New chip captures power from multiple sources: light, heat and vibrations
    http://phys.org/news/2012-07-chip-captures-power-multiple-sources.html
    From the article:
    "...from the lab of MIT professor Anantha Chandrakasan...
    The latest development, carried out with doctoral student Saurav Bandyopadhyay, is a chip that could harness all three of these ambient power sources at once, optimizing power delivery." (natural light, heat and vibrations in the environment)



    These are "chips" which can be manufactured en masse. Perhapse someday they can be used en masse as part of a structurally integrated design. The power collection and transmission capabilities comming available with conductive nano materials could make this feasable for other scales besides just sensors and telemetry... someday?

    -Alex Aragon
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  • bill von novak
    bill von novak Solar Expert Posts: 891 ✭✭✭✭
    #100
    Re: Something from nothing
    SolaRevolution wrote: »
    These are "chips" which can be manufactured en masse. Perhapse someday they can be used en masse as part of a structurally integrated design. The power collection and transmission capabilities comming available with conductive nano materials could make this feasable for other scales besides just sensors and telemetry... someday?

    Sure. Question is - are the levels of power you could produce (milliwatts) all that useful?
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  • SolaRevolution
    SolaRevolution Solar Expert Posts: 410 ✭✭
    #101
    Re: Something from nothing
    bill von novak wrote: »
    Sure. Question is - are the levels of power you could produce (milliwatts) all that useful?

    "— such as sensors to monitor heartbeat, blood sugar, or the stresses on a bridge or a pipeline."

    If you've ever been in the hospital hooked up to monitor wiring (even battery powered portable) you might have an appreciation for the ability to go wireless.
    If the stress sensors on a bridge or pipeline no longer require wires or external power sources it could be an enormous cost savings for installation materials and labor.

    How many small devices may no longer require a "wall wart" transformer? How much phantom loss can be reduced?

    Sure the power produced is infinitesimal. Many loads require infinitesimal amounts of power.

    "Typically, power sources would be used to charge up a storage device, such as a battery or a supercapacitor, which would then power an actual sensor or other circuit."
    If you have spent any time on this site, you know that power from small sources can be stored and put to use for loads requiring short durations of larger amounts of power. These technologies will develop. The power output will increase. The ability to harvest greater quantities will improve. The cost effectiveness will improve.

    No, it is not "free energy" in the mythical sense but it is "free energy" in the thermal dynamic sense.

    -Alex
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #102
    Re: Something from nothing

    Ah, I could finally get that "self-winding" pacemaker! :p

    I tend not to believe in scientific breakthroughs until they hit the retail level. Even after that I tend to be pretty skeptical. ;)
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  • ggunn
    ggunn Solar Expert Posts: 1,973 ✭✭✭
    #103
    Re: Something from nothing
    SolaRevolution wrote: »

    No, it is not "free energy" in the mythical sense but it is "free energy" in the thermal dynamic sense.

    -Alex

    Actually, thermodynamically is precisely how it's NOT free energy. It may be capturing energy that is otherwise wasted, but the laws of thermodynamics (the best you can do is break even, and you can't break even) are still in effect.
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  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    #104
    Re: Something from nothing
    Cariboocoot wrote: »
    Ah, I could finally get that "self-winding" pacemaker! :p

    I tend not to believe in scientific breakthroughs until they hit the retail level. Even after that I tend to be pretty skeptical. ;)

    i heard on the initial trials that all of the subjects died in their sleep.:p
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  • SolaRevolution
    SolaRevolution Solar Expert Posts: 410 ✭✭
    #105
    Re: Something from nothing
    ggunn wrote: »
    Actually, thermodynamically is precisely how it's NOT free energy. It may be capturing energy that is otherwise wasted, but the laws of thermodynamics (the best you can do is break even, and you can't break even) are still in effect.

    I meant it by the only definition of "free energy" that makes sense. (to me) From Wiki:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermodynamic_free_energy
    "The thermodynamic free energy is the amount of work that a thermodynamic system can perform... The free energy is the internal energy of a system minus the amount of energy that cannot be used to perform work."



    I guess I'm looking at it from a very "blue collar" point of view. I design, install and service systems which can produce and store energy which is then "free" to use for whatever loads you may desire. The system (ideally) should be able to continue delivering power for loads and then replenishing it's self without needing additional attention or expense to refuel.

    What other definition makes sense? It has been firmly established that there is no free lunch. It has been firmly established that energy cannot be harvested from where it does not exist. If a device puts out more energy than you can see going into it keep looking, it must be comming from somewhere. We just keep expanding the possibilities. Even if the energy output is infinitesimal, if the device can reduce material and labor costs, there is a good chance there may be a market for it.

    This new chip can operate (on a tiny scale) as a hybrid DC power system with PV, thermal, and ...(I don't know how it harvests energy from vibrations):blush:
    It can store energy when it is available and deliver it on demand when needed either at a constant low level or intermittently at a power level which exceeds that of the sources. It does it without needing additional attention or expense to refuel. Once installed, it is providing energy which is "free" to use.

    What could be developed with this in the next 20 years? There is a lot of room for improving efficiency. The materials and meathods for conducting energy on the micro scale are taking leaps and bounds right now. This technology will become part of our lives. I was thinking about pacemakers too. (thanks Coot) How many folks who are diabetic will make use of this for testing?


    The sci-fi geek in me starts thinking about the "HAL 9000". What would be possible with micro sensors, monitors and machines with "free energy" power chips? If they had a wirless network and could not be shut down...:p:-):blush:


    -Alex
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  • SolaRevolution
    SolaRevolution Solar Expert Posts: 410 ✭✭
    #106
    Re: Something from nothing

    Here's a new practical energy producing product from what was previously "nothing":

    A salt water powered lantern. -with USB port!

    http://phys.org/news/2012-09-no-battery-lantern-salt.html

    What is the potential for increasing the scale?
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  • inetdog
    inetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    #107
    Re: Something from nothing
    SolaRevolution wrote: »
    Here's a new practical energy producing product from what was previously "nothing":

    A salt water powered lantern. -with USB port!

    http://phys.org/news/2012-09-no-battery-lantern-salt.html

    What is the potential for increasing the scale?

    A magnesium rod (which is consumed in the process, along presumably with some ions from the salt water) is far from nothing. Will the replacement rod cost more or less than a CR123 battery which can give a considerable amount of light for 120 hours without the need to carry around salt water?
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
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  • ggunn
    ggunn Solar Expert Posts: 1,973 ✭✭✭
    #108
    Re: Something from nothing
    inetdog wrote: »
    A magnesium rod (which is consumed in the process, along presumably with some ions from the salt water) is far from nothing. Will the replacement rod cost more or less than a CR123 battery which can give a considerable amount of light for 120 hours without the need to carry around salt water?
    The ad says "no battery" but it has a magnesium rod, a carbon rod, and an electrolyte. What is that? A battery.
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  • john p
    john p Solar Expert Posts: 814 ✭✭✭
    #109
    Re: Something from nothing

    Could be a legal problem using that device you may be charged with asalt and battery. ?
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