mounting panels on air x tower pole?

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Mariner777
Mariner777 Solar Expert Posts: 29 ✭
in Wind Power Generation #1
Have a pair of Airxs on white powder coated SW aluminum poles with their stainless hardware and stays on my boat. I want to mount some solar panels on the towers as there is little wind here and I need more power generation capacity. I sent a note to SW about how much weight they think their pole can take but no response yet.


Anyone on here try this? How much panel do you think I can get away with? The brackets are throughbolted into 1/2" thick fiberglass which is quite strong. Would buy a commercial side of pole mount that uses hose clamps and am leaning toward a Kyocera 135, FC85 or a sopray solar 90 watt mono panel for each tower. The weights are either 27 for the KC135 or 18 for the smaller panels. The mounts might weigh 10 pounds depending what panel. I hate to answer this question by trial and error alone as overestimating the pole will result in expensive destruction of turbine, panel, tower and possibly boat...

Greatly appreciate any input on experience in mounting things to air x towers etc.
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  • waynefromnscanada
    waynefromnscanada Solar Expert Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭✭
    #2
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    Personally, I wouldn't touch that question with a ten foot pole, even if the pole was an Air-X. :p
    There are just so many variables, so many unknowns, so many things that could go wrong from so many causes. From my point of view, you're on your own with this one. It's your boat, your life, your decision to make.
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  • Frxddy
    Frxddy Solar Expert Posts: 113 ✭✭✭✭
    #3
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?
    Mariner777 wrote: »
    How much panel do you think I can get away with?


    Exactly one square inch.

    As someone mentioned (oh, it was you!) "overestimating the pole will result in expensive destruction of turbine, panel, tower and possibly boat"

    So, make a different plan.
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #4
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    Wind load, in the middle of unsupported panel is my concern.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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  • snuffy
    snuffy Solar Expert Posts: 72 ✭✭✭✭
    #5
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    I have my solar panels mounted on a pair of poles and thought I'd mount my wind generator above them with another tower hinged and hoisted from one of the poles. But.....what happens if my wind generator spits a blade and it hits my solar panels on the way down?
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #6
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?
    snuffy wrote: »
    I have my solar panels mounted on a pair of poles and thought I'd mount my wind generator above them with another tower hinged and hoisted from one of the poles. But.....what happens if my wind generator spits a blade and it hits my solar panels on the way down?


    what happens if my wind generator spits a blade and it hits my solar panels

    Think of Rock/Paper/Sissors Blade = Rock PV = Sissors Sissors looses.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #7
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?
    mike90045 wrote: »
    what happens if my wind generator spits a blade and it hits my solar panels

    Think of Rock/Paper/Sissors Blade = Rock PV = Sissors Sissors looses.

    I'd say; Blade = scissors. Panel = paper. Paper loses. Of course the scissor have also already "lost". :roll:
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  • snuffy
    snuffy Solar Expert Posts: 72 ✭✭✭✭
    #8
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    I was thinking more along the lines of flying machete.
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  • mike95490
    mike95490 Solar Expert Posts: 9,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #9
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    even if the blades stay on, the vibration will take a toll on the glass and cells, I doubt the laminate process is supposed to withstand that stress.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

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  • raspberryfisher
    raspberryfisher Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭
    #10
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    I am closer to Mike on this .....

    You list weights, but solar panel weight are small, but it can have a substantive impact as it pertains to wind load and operational vibration (remember, you have change resonance frequencies with the mount). It is unlikely SouthWest Power can provide a true structural engineer response without details and controls and not sure if they would.

    Will you be require to submit PE approvals?

    You (or someone) cites the concern with a blade coming lose and damaging a panel. If a blade come lose, should you not be concern with personal injury.

    A solar panel can withstand some serious impact, more so than an eye, skin, et cetera. The amount of damage would be dependent upon failure mechanism, but my first worry would be to the potential members of society that may be aroubd it (excluding family of course :D)

    I kept solar and wind seperate for reasons of maintenance to, but I am looking at larger installations.
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  • snuffy
    snuffy Solar Expert Posts: 72 ✭✭✭✭
    #11
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?
    raspberryfisher wrote: »
    You (or someone) cites the concern with a blade coming lose and damaging a panel. If a blade come lose, should you not be concern with personal injury.

    I was that someone. Didn't see anywhere where I stated I wasn't concerned. I would be far more concerned though if the blade was over my head spinning 24/7, like it would or could be if mounted on the same pole as the solar panel is. In my case there are few persons that frequent the area it would be mounted in so I wouldn't be losing sleep worrying about a blade flying off and striking a person. Perhaps a deer but that would be ok as they are a pita around here anyway.
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #12
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    You all do realize we're talking about a sail boat here? Not like there's much of anyplace to go to get away from the turbine mount.

    But we do all agree that putting the solar on the same pole is probably not a good idea, yes?
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  • raspberryfisher
    raspberryfisher Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭
    #13
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    IMHO

    I had to go back to the original post to fine the boat reference, I guess, by the time I read the replies, I had lost this detail. As I have to provide and guarentee survival and safety certifications, such as 150 mph in Florida or 110 in San Berandino Forest in CA, FEM modules for eathquake simulations holding battery frames, I would be hesitant from general experience from mixing the needs.

    If it is on a boat and always attended, removed when the cabin is locked, I would not expressed the same conservatism, and maybe cavalier in running it and monitoring.

    Oh yes, my wife and I call dear "Lanark County Rats". I had a mother and two fawns this morning clearing off the bottom crad-apples and the tops of the roses. My toyota has taken out 2 so far, replace windshield, side door, hood, ...... but never the front bumper. First time, we just miss then it turn back into me (into the tirewell and door) and the second landed on the hood, as I was doing 50+ (mph).
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  • Mariner777
    Mariner777 Solar Expert Posts: 29 ✭
    #14
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    I think some sort of panel would be okay on these towers it just a question of how much panel. I agree that the windage is more a factor then just the weight. Perhaps I should scale back my 90 watt panels to say 50 or so watts.

    As to vibration at some point all the panels get vibrated by the engine etc - if I get cheap small panels I wont be too devestated if they fail from vibration.

    The towers are like the last place left to put up more solar capacity and I think I need more power.

    I dont enjoy experimenting with my boat in this fashion so I suppose I will have to err on the side of caution and go small perhaps around `10 pounds or so.
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  • raspberryfisher
    raspberryfisher Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭
    #15
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    Re: mounting panels on air x tower pole?

    Wind load is a function of the cross-aera exposed, not just the solar panel. What I am saying, you may was to have a lower tilt, and thus a lower cross-section.

    Of course wind on a boat will be turbulent versus laminar, but assuming laminar horizontal flow, a 10 sq ft panel at 30 degrees will present 5 sq ft of impact, versus <2 sq ft when mounted at 10.
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