EU2000 Honda generator troubleshooting

13»

Comments

  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,486 ✭✭✭
    Re: EU2000 Honda generator troubleshooting

    Honda dealer called this morning, 5 weeks for Repair @ No Charge. They said it was a rist pin that would freeze when the engine was hot and caused the piston to slap and allow the blow-by that would be sucked into the carb and smoke.

    They replaced the piston and rings, rod and rist pin. I have some concern on why not the whole block, but I have some time to see if that becomes a issue.

    To be continued.
  • SevenSeven Solar Expert Posts: 292 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: EU2000 Honda generator troubleshooting

    Wrist pin is what the piston floats on inside the sleeve. The piston is much softer metal than the block is so if any wear occured it would have been on the piston, not the cylinder wall. The oil rings are what keep a small disctance between the two. If anything, a quick rehone can be done on the cylinder. It has been my experience that a wrist pin issue either turns up right away(improper install) or happens after a long time due to inadequate oiling.
  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,486 ✭✭✭
    Re: EU2000 Honda generator troubleshooting
    Seven wrote: »
    Wrist pin is what the piston floats on inside the sleeve. The piston is much softer metal than the block is so if any wear occured it would have been on the piston, not the cylinder wall. The oil rings are what keep a small disctance between the two. If anything, a quick rehone can be done on the cylinder. It has been my experience that a wrist pin issue either turns up right away(improper install) or happens after a long time due to inadequate oiling.
    Thanks for the reply. Now I know the difference between a " Wrist "Pin and a Rist Pin. This generator had a audible slapping noise and was blowing the oil out of the crankcase with 5 hours on it, so your right on.

    I did learn something with Honda's warranty operation. The mechanic calls Honda and is directed on what to check and what to test and repair. The guy told me it took 8 phone calls to reach the level of the issue and they will only pay or repair to that level.
  • SevenSeven Solar Expert Posts: 292 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    Re: EU2000 Honda generator troubleshooting

    That is interesting about the phone calls. The TechLine for automobiles is not a requirement for warranty repairs, it is more of a last ditch effort to fix something that has stumped the techs. It is used as a last resort because the effectiveness vs the time involved is too great a spread in most cases.

    Had you just bought the genny, or had it been sitting for a while? It seems strange that an issue on the first day wasn't a replacement, so I'm guessing you have had it for a while.

    Piston slap is a pretty easy to identify noise.
  • Blackcherry04Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,486 ✭✭✭
    Re: EU2000 Honda generator troubleshooting
    Seven wrote: »
    That is interesting about the phone calls. The TechLine for automobiles is not a requirement for warranty repairs, it is more of a last ditch effort to fix something that has stumped the techs. It is used as a last resort because the effectiveness vs the time involved is too great a spread in most cases.

    Had you just bought the genny, or had it been sitting for a while? It seems strange that an issue on the first day wasn't a replacement, so I'm guessing you have had it for a while.

    Piston slap is a pretty easy to identify noise.
    I bought it back in February, but didn't use it till late June. I put dino break-in oil it, I could hear the rattle sounds after 3-4 hours, then they kind of stopped. I changed the oil at 10 hours and then it started smoking after 30 or so minutes. I pulled the crankcase breather hose off the air box and the blow-by was pumping the oil out into the intake.

    At first I didn't want to believe there was a issue with it. I thought maybe the gas was old, changed it and put fresh in it. It's Honda EU 2000 and they run 10,000 hours.
  • thorsnessthorsness Solar Expert Posts: 51 ✭✭✭
    Re: EU2000 Honda generator troubleshooting

    Just a followup on a couple of topics: while I remain a fan of Seafoam, I may have overdone it with my EU2000i because they found what they thought was fuel hose debris in the carb and the fuel pump needed replacing. I have heard that Seafoam can degrade rubber if overused. All things in moderation.
    Next, one item added to the 'closing up the cabin' list is to drain the carb bowl on the Honda. Easy to do (Thanks for this advise guys). I do it outside and tip the generator up so the drain fitting is lowest to get all out I can. Next, try to bring two gallons of fresh gas in each trip and use that with the Honda. The snowmachines, chainsaws and weed trimmers (all two cycle engines) don't seem nearly as sensitive to ancient gasoline. Finally, it doesn't hurt to have a backup when you want to leave the batteries fully charged so they don't freeze. As I have found out, even the venerable Honda can fail and Murphy is always hanging around.
    Thanks again for all the good advice. We love our modest but very useful PV system.

    JB
  • thorsnessthorsness Solar Expert Posts: 51 ✭✭✭
    Followup: As you guys advised, drain the carb after each cabin visit. Try to use fresh gasoline. Every five years or so, pull and clean the carb. Good YouTube pieces on this. If I can do it, it's easy. Now and then, pull the air filter off and give it two snorts of SeaFoam until it lugs then stop and allow it to resume normal rpm's and the gray smoke disappates. Then a third until the engine kills. Let it soak for 15 minutes or so. Start and run on high setting until no gray smoke. This works well for me. Honda makes great motors. This one just seems to require a little more TLC than most.  JB
  • HumMichaelHumMichael Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭✭
    edited February 22 #69
    I didn't read all comments and also sorry if someone already mentioned about this tip. When you remove the front cover, there is a white plastic connector on bottom right with two wires.  I unplug it when I know that the EU will be sitting for a while. What it does is when you turn the unit off, it runs until the carb runs dry. This with ethanol free fuel has kept mine running good.  Obviously keep it connected if you will be using it again tomorrow.
  • westbranchwestbranch Solar Expert Posts: 4,812 ✭✭✭✭
    I'll have to check that connection out next week when I am back at the lake, an EU2000i came under the tree in DEC. only have ~ 4 hrs on it so far...
    it squeezes in between the 1000i and 3000i and fills a  power / fuel economy niche... when the 1000 just won't power some things...
     
    KID #51B  4s 140W to 24V 900Ah C&D AGM
    CL#29032 FW 2126/ 2073/ 2133 175A E-Panel WBjr, 3 x 4s 140W to 24V 900Ah C&D AGM 
    Cotek ST1500W 24V Inverter,OmniCharge 3024,
    2 x Cisco WRT54GL i/c DD-WRT Rtr & Bridge, Hughes1100 Sat Modem
    Eu3/2/1000i Gens, 1680W & E-Panel/WBjr to come, CL #647 asleep
    West Chilcotin, BC, Canada
  • thorsnessthorsness Solar Expert Posts: 51 ✭✭✭
    You're going to love it. I run the vacum and non-battery power tools with it.  JB
  • DanS26DanS26 Solar Expert Posts: 216 ✭✭
    70 posts and no one mentioned to check or replace the in line fuel filter.   Clogged or semi-clogged fuel filter will cause the exact symptoms experienced by the OP and should be the first thing checked before going off on less likely culprits.
    18.2kW Kyocera panels; 2 Fronius 7.5kW inverters; Nyle hot water; Steffes ETS; Great Lakes RO; Generac 10kW w/ATS, TED System monitoring with PVOutput.org
  • thorsnessthorsness Solar Expert Posts: 51 ✭✭✭
    Dan,

    Please remind us where it is and how to access it.
    Thanks.

    JB
  • DanS26DanS26 Solar Expert Posts: 216 ✭✭
    thorsness said:
    Dan,

    Please remind us where it is and how to access it.
    Thanks.

    JB


    Maybe this will help.......




    18.2kW Kyocera panels; 2 Fronius 7.5kW inverters; Nyle hot water; Steffes ETS; Great Lakes RO; Generac 10kW w/ATS, TED System monitoring with PVOutput.org
  • DanS26DanS26 Solar Expert Posts: 216 ✭✭
    Don't feel like the lone ranger.......I had a Subaru engine that had one of those hidden in line fuel filters.   It took me nine months to find out why that engine was surging.

    I eliminated that PITA filter and replaced it with a normal visible filter.
    18.2kW Kyocera panels; 2 Fronius 7.5kW inverters; Nyle hot water; Steffes ETS; Great Lakes RO; Generac 10kW w/ATS, TED System monitoring with PVOutput.org
  • thorsnessthorsness Solar Expert Posts: 51 ✭✭✭
    Sure did not know that. Thanks Dan.

    JB
  • DanS26DanS26 Solar Expert Posts: 216 ✭✭
    I wonder how many thousands of these Japanese designed engines are in the landfills right now because of these hidden fuel filters.  
    18.2kW Kyocera panels; 2 Fronius 7.5kW inverters; Nyle hot water; Steffes ETS; Great Lakes RO; Generac 10kW w/ATS, TED System monitoring with PVOutput.org
  • Mat_SuMat_Su Registered Users Posts: 1
    Regarding stale fuel problems, If you can find some 100LL Avgas (local airport) use it for long term storage of any 4 stroke internal combustion engine.  It does not go stale as auto fuel does. I use it for ice augers and snow machines in the summer, lawn mowers and weed whackers in the winter etc.
  • SusidoSusido Registered Users Posts: 31 ✭✭
    19 years of use combined for my two EU2000 generators and I never knew there was a fuel filter in them... Cleaned them recently (only one was particularly dirty) and they start better now though I didn't have too much of a problem before. I have also never cleaned or needed to clean the carbs on either one, praise be our non-ethanol gasoline.
    Seasonally off-grid ... 468 Ahrs @ 48V (8 Rolls S-605 6v FLA batteries),  24 x 130watt panels, Midnite Classic 150, Whizbang Jr., Magnum MS4448PAE inverter/charger, 2 x Honda eu2000i generators paralleled.


  • jkingrphjkingrph Registered Users Posts: 2
    edited September 16 #80
    I just purchased two of the EU2000i generators and am in the process of getting them set up. As with all my equipment I started with a hi grade full synthetic 10w-30 in this case Pennzoil Platinum plus.   Put some in along with a magnetic tipped dipstick and ran for an hour using fresh ethanol free gas with marine Stabil and a shot of outboard motor oil, final dilution about 1:400.  I ran it for an hour under a light load, emptied the gas tank, drained the carb and yes after one hour changed the oil.  I was surprised to find a black deposit on the magnetic dipstick, but hope this procedure ensures that I start with a very clean engine  I have been using gas treated like this for about the 15 years I have had my big EB11000 generator and have never had any problems starting other than a dead battery.  Last time I found a slightly oversized gel cell motorcycle battery and installed it.  I kept a battery maintainer on it since it was new, but those lawn mower type batteries just are not reliable for much more than a year or two.  I did have a John Deere mower, again started with a battery maintainer when it was new, that kept the original battery for 16 years before dying.

    We were faced with the possibility of inland effect of Hurricaine Harvey a few weeks back, so I went and filled all my 5 gal gas cans after topping off the mower and generator, so I had about 70 gal of gas out in the shed just in case,  Fortunately all we got was some light drizzle and nice breeze from the extreme outer bands .  Most of this gas will end up going through my big lawn mower.    Treated like I have been doing and stored in some of the tightly sealed Eagle steel safety cans, it should be good well over a year based on past experience.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators Posts: 26,658 admin
    JKing,

    Welcome to the forum and my two cents of suggestions.

    In the olden days--The idea was to run the first oil in the engine with relatively cheap normal engine oil. This was to allow rings and such to lap in (and remove a little bit of metal). Using synthetic or other high quality oil tended to prevent rings from seating and your engine could end up burning oil because of this.

    Adding 2 cycle oil to the gasoline--I am not a big fan of that (there is Marvel Mystery Oil which may be "better" than two cycle oil). Tends to foul the spark plug and can cause the valves to stick (sort of a common problem in small engines it seems). Plus the oil can leave a film behind in the carburetor (again, small engines, small fuel passages, easy to clog). In any case, I keep a spare spark plug with the engine "just in case" I have hard starting when the genset is really needed.

    Running the tank dry (some folks have argued that this can cause a lean mixture and a "hot burn" in the engine and that is damaging in itself--I run the engine without AC loads to keep the engine cool when running dry), and draining the carb is good.

    And, when the engine is stopped and cool--I give a gentle pull on the start cord to pull the engine to the beginning of the compression stroke (valves are closed, less chance for moisture to settle in the cylinder and valves).

    One nice thing about the eu2000i (and other members of the euxxxx family?) is that this have an internal fuel pump. You can make/buy a fuel cap with hose and filter to drop into a 5 gallon gas can for extended run operations (of course, you have to watch your oil consumption before running 24 hours straight). You fill the genset tank, and connect the siphon kit to refile the tank as it draws down:

    https://www.amazon.com/EXTENDED-FUEL-HONDA-Eu2000i-GENERATOR/dp/B00O7BLVYC
    http://www.genxdirect.com/honda-eu2000/

    Regarding keeping batteries happy when in storage... I have had bad experiences with "cheap" float chargers--They all tended to boil the batteries dry (I use on cars that sit for months between usage). Battery Tender and Battery Minder seem to make good (if sometimes too expensive) chargers that really do dial the float voltage way down and do not boil the batteries dry. Here is one (for a more reasonable price) that I just bought (after my "cheap" old float charger went bad and took out a relatively new battery). The one below is for flooded cell batteries, not GEL, AGM, or sealed batteries:

    https://www.amazon.com/BatteryMINDer-2012-Battery-Charger/dp/B005EKY1EM

    -Bill


    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • jonrjonr Solar Expert Posts: 818 ✭✭✭
    IMO, it's important to apply brief periods of high load to an engine during break-in.   Brief to prevent heat buildup and high load to put sufficient pressure on the rings to help them wear in.   Extended low load during break-in can glaze the cylinder walls.

    If you aren't going to carefully do the "brief" part, then a little (like 200:1)  two stroke oil during break-in might be a good idea.  At that amount, I wouldn't expect any noticeable plug fouling.
  • jkingrphjkingrph Registered Users Posts: 2
    Thanks for the comments Bill.   The battery maintainer I have been using is a https://www.batterystuff.com/battery-chargers/12-volt/0-4amps/ctek-56-158.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI553n2uWq1gIVCBBpCh1GkgB8EAQYAyABEgLhJvD_BwE

    long link, but a high end CETK.   I have one on not only my big generator, but both lawn mowers, my wife's car and my diesel truck.   I started on the car because there is something in the electronics so if we would go off for a week or so, and come back the battery, even a new one would be dead.  There is a constant red flashing light on the dash the dealer said was normal for that model, so something is always powered.  

    I have used Marvel Mystery oil, as well as one of the better brands of 2 cycle oil, which I chose based on the claims that it is ashless or low ash.   I have been doing this for 12-15 years now and no problems, although not with a small engine like this Honda.  I have been using the Stihl ultra synthetic in all my hand held two cycle equipment,  one leaf blower is right at 30 years old and still going strong, basically following the practice of emptying the tank and running dry when it's put away for the season.   My idea for the 2 cycle oil is that it will provide a thin lubricating film for seals, ect and possibly help prevent corrosion
      
    Today I ran in the second EU2000i, following the same procdure, using a 20" high velocity fan for a load. Ran it again for a hour, drained the carburetor bowl, fuel tank and changed the oil.  I had also installed one of the aftermarket magnetic dipsticks and it again did pick up a very fine black coating, which is ferrous material ( iron or steel?) Definetly not much, but enough to know there is either a little break in wear or all the parts are not absolutely clean when assembled.  It's probably not a bad idea to remove such particles no matter how fine as they can be abrasive, and probably the best long term protection in an engine with no oil filter.

    I did pick up an external tank and the appropriate hoses to use if I should need an extended run.  I'm thinking the two little generators paralled would easily handle my refrigerator, freezer and possibly microwave leaving my big generator to handle the rest of the house.  Our house is a late 70's build, not the best for any cross ventilation and is all electric, using a heat pump for heat and a/c.   I have not tried to heat with the generator, but have some gas logs in the fireplace and a couple of 40 gal tanks for them, I don't know if the gen will carry the "emergency" heat strips in the central heat portion, and I always shut down the electric hot water when running the gen.  I know very well it will carry  the a/c and everything else but does run hard at times so I was thinking the smaller units would take a bit of load off.  I do have a 50 amp input to a double throw on/off isolation switch  for the big unit, and would run some smaller power cords for the small units, .  I had an electrician friend who had been a Navy electrician then worked at one of the big nuclear power plants on the east coast help install the isolation switch and the gent from the local power utility approved of the set up when we called to have the overhead power lines disconnected while wiring in the switch.  The lady we talked to at their dispatch said it would probably be the next day before they could reconnect, but the guy on the truck gave us his cell number and said to call him when we were finished and he would be right back out to reconnect which he did, appreciation that were fixing it so if anything happened and were on the gen it would not back feed to the utility.  I spent most of my adult life working in hospitals, both military and civilian and have seen enough that I did not want to be responsible for injuring or killing someone.

    Oh well, I got both of those new units tested, serviced and set up for long term storage so they should be ready to go.  I set up a big tool bag with a 10/3 cord with a 30 amp male plug, screwdrivers so I can access carb drain, funnel to change oil, and spare quart of oil.  We still have my parents house over in N LOuisiana and got caught in an ice storm one winter when power went out.  Now I can carry a small gen, and at least have lights and maybe an electric heater, and coffee pot.  Stove and hot water are gas there so no problem, and years ago my father put in a couple of small radiant gas heaters.





































  • BB.BB. Super Moderators Posts: 26,658 admin
    edited September 17 #84
    Sounds good. I suggest that you check the bay voyage on float.  You want something around 12.8 to 13.6 volts. Go higher than that, the bay will gas and you will have exposed plates eventually (months or years).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
13»
Sign In or Register to comment.