What inverter to use with these panels

t12zh · January 2009

Seams i am back to the OutBack GTFX 3048
Want a nice inverter to start with.

Peak Power (Pmax) 175 W
Warranted Minium Pmax 159.2 W
Voltage @ pmax (Vmpp) 35.4 V
Current @ Pmax (Impp) 4.94 A
Open Circut Voltage (Voc) 43.6 V
Short Circut Current (Isc) 5.30 A
Maximun series Fuse 15 A
Limiting ressssverse current (Ir) 5.30 A

Going to put 12 of these up now.
Plans to put up anouther 12 or 24 or more soon.

Would like for them to work with a Wind generator, ( any chance of using the same inverter for this would be nice addition.

BB. · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

What kind of inverter? Grid Tied / Utility Interactive or Off-Grid?

For GT use, I have 20 of those type of panels (specdifically, BP 4175--175 watt) with my Xantrex GT 3.0 (has been upgraded since to meet new requirements).

You can use the Xantrex Sizing tool to show the supported configurations (mine is 2 strings x 10 panels each string). Has been working nicely for over three years (just south of San Francisco). I like mine--nice and quiet, no internal fans.

Generally, you would need a separate GT inverter--designed/configured for use with wind.

For off-grid use--you have a few more options--but, again, you cannot simply hook solar panels + wind turbine to one controller.

Also, depends on which type of wind turbine you wish to use--some have their own internal regulators, others need external regulators.

-Bill

PS: If used for Grid Tied--your panels will have to be "UL Listed" (actually, NRTL Listed).

t12zh · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

It will be for gt.
I have to take advantage of rebate program.

halfcrazy · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

I second the recommendation for the Xantrex GT series for the solar it is a very efficient and easy to install inverter. We have used many of them on our installs.

For the wind it really depends on what you settle on for a turbine most any of the Grid Tied readily available turbines will come with a grid tied inverter. most likely this is required for UL listing?. But if it doesn't post back and we can give you plenty advice at that point.

crewzer · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

Want a nice inverter to start with.

It will be for gt.
I have to take advantage of rebate program.

Another question: Do you want a battery-less grid-interactive inverter, or do you want an inverter with battery backup? The battery-less architecture is a generally lower-cost install, but the system will stop working during a grid failure ("anti-islanding").

Grid-interactive inverters with battery backup are generally higher cost installs, but this architecture can automatically power designated loads during a grid outage. The battery bank just needs to be sized for the loads and expected back-up interval.

HTH,
Jim / crewzer

t12zh · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

I know this sounds crazy to some people to eliminate an average monthly bill of only 50.00 dollar, that is why i ask questions in this forum.

But yes i am going to add batteries just haven't figured out how many yet.
My elect. bill shows i use from 250 Kilowatt Hours up to 1150 a month, and my average daily is 4.97 to 36.33.

I have built my own wind generator but with all the work and time i put into it i decide on putting a nice 48 volt one in place of it on the sweet looking tilt up base and pole i have in place already.

t12zh · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

Photo of my house property and the work i done.
Was easy to build generator and just wanted to get something up.
Pole was given to me along with anchor bolts sona tube exc.
Seams like lot of people i knew had something i needed.
I did have to buy the concrete that i could have got for free.
I even drilled the hole with my drill rig.

This is why i want to get the panels up.
I have a lot of material it gathered up already, unirac unistrut some elect. brackets clamps ground rod exc. exc. exc.

niel · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

there are 2 ways of looking at sizing up one's battery needs and it's best if both are in agreement. the first is by your load requirements per day with x number of days autonomy and multiply that by 2 so as not to allow the batteries to exceed 50% dod. this can be quite involved with measurements and even guesses at actual possible uses in all circumstances and in the future. some math will also be involved as you work between watts, watt hours, amps, amp hours, and volts.
the other way is to work from the charging sources as the current from the charge sources should roughly fall within a range of 5% min and 13% max for standard generic type lead acid batteries that the max is actually unknown for. many batteries can charge at higher rates, but this varies as to manufacturer and battery type.

crewzer · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

niel,

I generally agree that your battery sizing models work well for off-grid applications. However, for grid-interactive systems with battery backup, there's at least one other approach to consider.

Specifically, a battery bank may only need to be large enough to sustain a desired load for a chosen time target. The desired load might be specific items via a sub-panel, and not an entire house.

For example, if the goal is to supply 700 W average for 6 hours, and inverter efficiency is 89%, and limiting battery bank discharge to 50% at 25 C (77 F), then a battery bank rated at 48 V x ~200 Ah will do. That's just four size 4D batteries in series.

HTH,
Jim / crewzer

niel · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

i thought i covered that on the first one when i said it's to be based on what loads it's to have over time or maybe i didn't make that clear enough?

n3qik · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

t12zh
The pic with the tower, there is a LP tank also. From the pic, looks like if the tower or blade should fail, it could hit the tank.

I had a windmill failed this summer, an 4" piece of blade was thrown 150'. Landed next to my neighbors shed.

t12zh · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

I am going to look into if the rebate covers battery's also.
I did not think of that.
to get a check back from the utility co would be cool
I know it would be penny's but cool

crewzer · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

niel,

Probably a semantics issue. You suggested load x days of autonomy, I suggested back-up loads times "x" hours of no-grid.

I've found this to be an an important distinction when talking with prospective customers. There's an "Aha!" moment when it becomes clear that a a utility-interactive RE system with battery backup can operate quite nicely with a battery bank that's substantially smaller than what would be required to reliably operate a corresponding off-grid system.

For example, Puget Sound Energy's total 2007 power outage for non-major storm events was 2 hours and 47 minutes.

Regards,
Jim / crewzer

niel · January 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

no problem in your bringing it up as it is clarified as to what i meant even if my wording could've been better. you are right that there's a big difference between 3 days and 3 hours, but i suppose i should've worded it more like i did in my responce to you to speak in a general sense rather than a specific example.

t12zh · February 2009

Re: What inverter to use with these panels

I think i found the inverter.
Outback model. GTVFX3048 for grid tie with battery backup.

If money was no problem would this be the best inverter for me.

Going to put 12 of these up now.
Peak Power (Pmax) 175 W
Warranted Minium Pmax 159.2 W
Voltage @ pmax (Vmpp) 35.4 V
Current @ Pmax (Impp) 4.94 A
Open Circut Voltage (Voc) 43.6 V
Short Circut Current (Isc) 5.30 A
Maximun series Fuse 15 A
Limiting ressssverse current (Ir) 5.30 A

May add anouther 12 tp 24 later.

What inverter to use with these panels

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