Lead Carbon Batteries?

ligwyd
ligwyd Registered Users Posts: 210 ✭✭
in New Battery Technologies #1
Attached is a spec sheet on Lead Carbon Batteries.
Anyone care to review the info and comment?

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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,891 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #2
    A quick look and a few easy comments. 
    Surrette and Trojan have been making these for about 5 years or so. You do have to know the exact model for the smart carbon.
    How would you get warranty from Sacred Sun? Who sells them.......
    The models from Surrette in the comparison are not the same equivalents. Apples and oranges.
    I did not see any 2V or 6V models, hard to build a big 48v battery bank.

    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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  • ligwyd
    ligwyd Registered Users Posts: 210 ✭✭
    #3
    I think the FCP series on the bottom of the chart are all comprised of 2V cells. These are sold by a local supplier. They seem to hold these up as the best bang for your buck.
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  • Marc Kurth
    Marc Kurth Solar Expert Posts: 1,166 ✭✭✭✭
    #4
    They are projecting a 14 year lifespan. How long have they been deployed in the field? 
    I always have more questions than answers. That's the nature of life.
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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,891 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #5
    Steve Higgins from Surrette and I talked alot about their offering. They too do not have long term data but the warranty is real and much better than the non carbon models. They have done some accelerated life testing and are all over north america and the world for that matter.
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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  • petertearai
    petertearai Solar Expert Posts: 471 ✭✭✭✭
    #6
    Put some 2 volt shoto EXC 400 ah lead carbon in  , a year and a bit ago .So far so good, let you know in 10 years if any good !
    2225 wattts pv . Outback 2kw  fxr pure sine inverter . fm80 charge controller . Mate 3. victron battery monitor . 24 volts  in 2 volt Shoto lead carbon extreme batterys. off grid  holiday home 
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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,891 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #7
    The smart Trojans I have seen did not do better than their unsmart batts over 5 to 7 years. They did not have a significantly better warranty and so I wonder how smart they were in the design phase?
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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  • petertearai
    petertearai Solar Expert Posts: 471 ✭✭✭✭
    #8
    Maybe smart in the marketing phase 
    2225 wattts pv . Outback 2kw  fxr pure sine inverter . fm80 charge controller . Mate 3. victron battery monitor . 24 volts  in 2 volt Shoto lead carbon extreme batterys. off grid  holiday home 
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  • Estragon
    Estragon Registered Users Posts: 4,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #9
    East Penn / Deka "Ultrabattery" seems to have the same Australian & Japanese roots as the battery linked above.  Although they may have changed the exact construction, it appears to be aimed at applications where cycling is high rate at partial state of charge (EV regenerative braking, for example).  In that application, it does appear to have better cycle life and less sulfation than AGM, and has had some real-world testing done to confirm this. 

    They also appear to be marketing it for RE, but more as a sort of big capacitor smoothing out variable loads and RE inputs like wind.  Interestingly, they don't appear to be marketing it as a "regular" RE battery, in which cycling is low rate and PSOC could last for days rather than the seconds/minutes/hours in the EV or smoothing application.  Purely speculation, but I wonder if the high (and frequent) charge rate in an EV type application is preventing the sulfation as much as the carbon itself. 
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
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  • Dave Angelini
    Dave Angelini Solar Expert Posts: 6,891 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #10
    Surrette is who I would trust on this. Especially if the user is in NA and the application is cycling a battery system offgrid.
    The usual disclaimer about if it is not for sale in the store here,  buyer beware!
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Nevada mountain area
       htps://offgridsolar1.com/
    E-mail offgridsolar@sti.net

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  • Estragon
    Estragon Registered Users Posts: 4,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #11
    Agreed, Rolls/Surrette have been doing this stuff for quite a while.  They're apparently backing the carbon added batteries with a longer warranty which has to mean something.  Not so sure about the battery in the link though.
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
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