generator ground

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  • oil pan 4
    oil pan 4 Solar Expert Posts: 767 ✭✭✭✭
    #62
    Re: generator ground

    The official way to read Hz is the same as doing a voltage check. Just put one lead to the hot and the other to ground or neutral.

    Depending on how sensitive the meter is some times if you just put the meter leads near the source it will pick up the frequency. Others you only need to touch a lead to a hot or neutral.

    Solar hybrid gasoline generator, 7kw gas, 180 watts of solar, Morningstar 15 amp MPPT, group 31 AGM, 900 watt kisae inverter.

    Solar roof top GMC suburban, a normal 3/4 ton suburban with 180 watts of panels on the roof and 10 amp genasun MPPT, 2000w samlex pure sine wave inverter, 12v gast and ARB air compressors.

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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #63
    Re: generator ground

    Both unloaded and loaded... You need to know the frequency at several operating points/conditions. The meter does not care if loaded or unloaded (assuming good quality AC wave form).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #64
    Re: generator ground

    Oil pan
    Thank you

    From bill
    "Note that non-sine wave type wave forms can cause frequency meters to read "way off"... MSW can read 2x the frequency and some generators (especially with battery charger as a load) may not have a good sine wave voltage either--So don't panic if the frequency is way off--It may not be"

    Does this mean I need a load to check hertze, or can I check it unloaded or can I check both loaded and unloaded?

    Also what happened to the bar that lets you highlight a quote on this site?
    Thanks
    gww
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #65
    Re: generator ground

    Bill
    I was typing while you were. Thank you for the answer.
    gww
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #66
    Re: generator ground

    I will post what I get when I am done. I doubt it will be that good as it is a cheap brigg and straton generator, but I am learning some.

    It actually pulls pretty good. I used it for welding once and it blew the 20 amp push button a couple of times and I had to turn the welder to 175 amps but it got the job done, I also ran a compresser and it burnt the motor out once, I think because I forgot it on and it leaked enough to keep kicking on. It ran it but seemed to be starving it. the compresser was a hundred year old craftsmen type. This is the only time I have really used it.
    gww
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #67
    Re: generator ground

    I don't know that the frequency meter will read wrong--It is just a possibility (not very common, but possible). If you get way wrong frequency reading--Don't panic.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #68
    Re: generator ground

    Bill
    I already know it doesn't work with the outback charger and this is the last adjustment to see if I might get it to work. I really don't have anything to lose and if nothing else, I learn something else that I can use while playing. It would have been neat to know while I was building the wind turbines. I believe there is a math that if you know the number of poles and the frequency you can figure out your rpm. That is something else I may get around to learning before all this is over. I am not worried. I was doing it to try and find a way to charge a 48 volt battery bank without buying a charger and also thought about building a wood gassifier and maby using it to charge. I wan't to play with this stuff but really only want to spend money on maby more solar or to replace my mx60 cc if it ever goes out. Mostly I got a little time and am trying to stay interestd with out breaking the bank. So far I am good at spending. Got chickens and they eat more then the eggs I get. going to get bees and built all my equipment but I bet they still cost more then I get from them. got solar and wind but the grid is cheaper.

    As long as I keep a handle on my resources it doesn't hurt to bad if things don't work out and it is nice to learn a bit more while doing it. If I wasn't so old already and had any ambition left I might even learn enough to become profitable, but I am too old and layed back to care.

    I do appretiat your teaching and hopefully pass it on in a not hurtfull way to others in need every once in a while. I thank every body that tries to help me.
    Thanks
    gww
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #69
    Re: generator ground

    I checked the hertze unloaded on the generator at the idiol speed that I got it to connect to the inverter and it was 59.2 hertze per leg. I uped the idiol and got it set where it bounces between 60.1 and 60.4 hertz. I had it idioled this high before and it wouldn't connect but I guess I will try it again. I don't hold much hope and the inverter accepts grid from something like 58 hertz to 60.5 but only sells at like 59.5 to 60.5. I know I am not selling but figure the charger must need tight tolerances along the same lines. I couldn't check it while hooked to the inverter cause my batt were at the end of absorb and when running off batt power you can not tell if the inverter accepted the gen or not. I like to do those experments in the morning when the batt needs charging. I don't know when I will try again yet.
    gww

    Ps everytime I adjust the generator idiol I feel like crap cause it is done down by the muffler and I keep forgetting not to breath. I am outside but apparently breathing 2 inches for the muffler is still a bad thing.
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #70
    Re: generator ground

    Some folks have put a 100 Watt filament lamp on the Generator. Just enough load to stabilize the output.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #71
    Re: generator ground

    Bill
    I have actually read that but it is funny how you never remember stuff when doing it unless some one reminds you. Thanks for reminding me.

    I bet you have to debate answering my threads cause I always have another question. I have read of people doing that but not how they did it. Would it accomplish what I want plugging into the 110 circuit with the 100 watt light bulb and then pluging the 240 volt plug to the transfer switch, or does the light bulb need to be in line with the load? Also would I need two lightbulbs one for each leg? I remember on another forum where this was used to get a 240 volt transformer to work with a small 120 volt generator.
    My intuition says using two bulbs plugged into the 120 volt socket would stablize the output. I might have to use 250 watt brooder lights as I am not sure they still sell 100 watt incadesents.
    Thanks
    gww
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #72
    Re: generator ground

    Getting difficult to find 100 Watt bulbs these days.

    Connected the the genset as a load. For 240 vac, try one on each leg.

    No right or wrong, just see what works to "stabilize" the generator output. No right or wrong answer, just try several options and see what works.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #73
    Re: generator ground

    Ok bill,

    I am going to try the 120 volt plugs first cause putting it in line with the 240 volts means cutting cords. If it doesn't work I will then decide how much expermenting I feel like doing.
    Thank you
    gww
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #74
    Re: generator ground

    Well, I got half way home.

    One inverter accepted the power from the generator good enough to charge 5 ac amps into the battery. The other inverter would not do any charging and just ran the loads in pass through.

    So one inverter was takeing about 10 amps from the generator and the other was only taking about 2 amps. I had both set to recieve 15 amps from the generator.

    I do this in the morning cause I don't have to worry about big loads in the house. I did see the charger back off a bit at times and then increase. what I don't know is if the battery is going to help out if my well pump kicks in.

    I first did it with two 250 watt lights pluged in the generator but unpluged them after the inverter accepted the generator.

    I did cycle it for the battery to the generator a couple of times and the inverters accepted the power each time even without the lights pluged in, so I think adjusting the hertz was the biggest key.

    It isn't going to be two efficiant running a 5000 watt generator and only getting 1000 to 1500 watts on one legg and the little bit the other leg puts out to run loads but it is better then it was and if I were to play with it more I might get the one side to almost max output which would give me 2000-2500watts, a 50% loading.

    I doubt I do any more adjusting as getting one inverter to do some charging is better then nothing and I don't want to mess it up. I should be able to up the charging amps from the 5 ac amps I am getting now. If I get 9-10 amps going to the battery it will still only ad up to about 18 to 20 amp charging to an 800 amp hour battery but might get a guy through a week of emergency it he has enough gas.
    Well, that is my update and thanks for the help to get me here.
    gww
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  • gww1
    gww1 Solar Expert Posts: 963 ✭✭
    #75
    Re: generator ground

    I am not needing a responce tho this but was just sitting here and thinking about this forum. Sometimes it is not just the knowlage shared that makes coming to a forum like this important. I had thought and screwed around with the ideal of messing with this generator for more then a year. Every once in a while I would throw out a hairbrained skeem of using it in some way or someone elses post would spark an interest and I would interupt it with a side question on my situation. I make lots of post on thing that spark my interest and make me want to know more, sometimes just to know more. Lots of times just to know more with no known intention to ever use the knowlage.

    If you get a steady diet of forum matirial it gets you to do things you didn't even know you cared about. If a roadblock comes up and you don't care too much, you get a little more forum and then you care again. If you are done and someone makes a suggestion and a lightbulb of more understanding goes off and boom you are ready to give it another go. You may hear the same thing 50 times before you find a need for it.

    Like all things, you could go bankrupt wanting to do it all, but overall I have did numerous things that could not have been done without the knowlage shared here and wouldn't have been done without the continual insperation that raines king here.

    Ok, enough babble.
    Thanks all
    gww
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