Is Diversity of viewpoints dead on this forum?

rakkarrakkar Registered Users Posts: 2
Well this time I (karrak) have been banned for "insolence" by daring to start a new thread titled "Gagging discussion on using Off Grid electric power for cooking". Creating that thread was the only way i could openly reply to having a post i wrote removed without being told by whom it was removed or the reasons for the removal.

The post was disagreeing with this opinion from one of the moderators "Well here are the facts again, and they are the facts. Electricity is not a practical way to heat things off-grid ..."in this thread http://forum.solar-electric.com/showthread.php?21267-GE-Induction-electric-cooktop&highlight=induction. If anyone makes a blanket statement like this, they should be prepared to justify and defend it.

I think it shows great disrespect and arrogance to not only me, but all the other people out there who "heat things off-grid" with electricity to make a statement like that and then gag any discussion of it.

As far a I can see my only offence to date is to disagree with a moderator and try to start a discussion about it, it appears that starting an unwelcome discussion is termed an argument and although i can't find any written rules from the forum owners about this, is punishable by excommunication.

I assume that part of this post http://forum.solar-electric.com/showthread.php?21860-Attention-all-forum-members was aimed at me. There are sections of this post that if they are aimed at me, i feel i have every right to take offence at.

I thought it was the job of a moderator to moderate the discussion, not to delete posts and treads that did not agree with their point of view. I would like to think that if I were a moderator that disagreed with a point of view that I would either refute it, or if it raised my blood pressure just ignore it.

I am sorry i felt compelled to write this, this is a great forum and i have gained allot of information and valuable knowledge from the moderators and other contributors and was hoping to be able to contribute some of my knowledge and experience back. I would think it is a huge and thankless task to moderate such a large forum and not get emotionally involved.

From the replies to my last tread "Gagging discussion on using Off Grid electric power for cooking" before it was taken down, i can see there are others would would like to have a discussion on this topic. It is a shame that you saw fit to remove that thread and will not countenance discussion on this topic and maybe other topics you disagree with. If this attitude continues i would think you will loose contributors who may bring a diversity of views and ideas that can only enhance discussion on the forum. I hope that in the interests of free discussion you don't take this tread down and will reinstate my last one, what have you got to loose?.

Comments

  • bmetbmet Solar Expert Posts: 630 ✭✭
    Re: Is Diversity of viewpoints dead on this forum?

    While I did not read into the hyper links you posted, there are a couple of points I wish to remind you of.

    1. All moderators are volunteers.
    2. Forum is provided for free by the host.

    The moderators offer their experience, their knowledge, and their temperament to channel discussions for benefit of the whole forum. They must balance useful discussions against 'whipping a dead horse'. At times they just have to say No. It doesn't mean the forum is unfair, or biased against an opinion. There are rules, and moderators will apply them according to experience, knowledge, and temperament.

    In my opinion, if you want to start a discussion, explore a possibility, or test your knowledge, that's fine. If you are throwing ideas up in the air to see what flies, then you may be disappointed. This is a forum for Renewable Energy, not 'Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader'.
  • bill von novakbill von novak Solar Expert Posts: 891 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Is Diversity of viewpoints dead on this forum?
    rakkar wrote: »
    I thought it was the job of a moderator to moderate the discussion, not to delete posts and treads that did not agree with their point of view.

    Their job is both. Often they just guide discussions. Sometimes they delete material that is incorrect or inappropriate. When the people who post such material then get argumentative and combative, they will sometimes ban the person.
    I would like to think that if I were a moderator that disagreed with a point of view that I would either refute it, or if it raised my blood pressure just ignore it.

    Moderators have a responsibility to clarify/edit/delete misleading or incorrect material.
    I hope that in the interests of free discussion you don't take this tread down and will reinstate my last one, what have you got to loose?.

    Once you start posting public arguments via sock puppets, that sort of compromise becomes much less likely. Generally a message to a moderator is the way to handle such a request. A public post in an unrelated forum by a sock puppet will generally just get deleted.

    There is often a misconception that "we have free speech here in the US! You can't just gag me." But this isn't a public space; it's a privately administered board, and the moderators/administrators use their power to create a forum that is close to the way they want it to be. (In this case a renewable energy discussion board.) Getting your posts deleted doesn't mean you are wrong or obstructive, it just means that what you posted doesn't fit in well with how they want the board to operate.
  • rakkarrakkar Registered Users Posts: 2
    Re: Is Diversity of viewpoints dead on this forum?
    bmet wrote: »
    While I did not read into the hyper links you posted, there are a couple of points I wish to remind you of.

    1. All moderators are volunteers.
    2. Forum is provided for free by the host.

    The moderators offer their experience, their knowledge, and their temperament to channel discussions for benefit of the whole forum. They must balance useful discussions against 'whipping a dead horse'. At times they just have to say No. It doesn't mean the forum is unfair, or biased against an opinion. There are rules, and moderators will apply them according to experience, knowledge, and temperament.

    I am well aware that the moderators are volunteers and that the Forum is provided free by the host, and am thankful for that. On the whole i think the moderators do a very good job and it shows in the quality of some of the discussions, especially some of the technical ones.

    As far as i can see i have not broken any of the rules of the forum.
    bmet wrote: »
    In my opinion, if you want to start a discussion, explore a possibility, or test your knowledge, that's fine. If you are throwing ideas up in the air to see what flies, then you may be disappointed. This is a forum for Renewable Energy, not 'Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader'.

    My original post which has been deleted was not trying to start a new discussion but was replying to the statement by the moderator implying that it was impractical to use off-grid energy to heat things. In my reply i think i was polite and stated that we have been doing all our cooking for the past 18 months using our off-grid power with no problems, and listing some of the benefits of doing so. I don't think i voiced any opinions on the subject, it was purely a statement of fact.

    I ask you how you would feel if the next day you found that your post had been deleted along with a prior post which was totally non controversial, with no explanation as to who deleted it, or why it had been deleted, and then after searching around on the forum finding this http://forum.solar-electric.com/showthread.php?21860-Attention-all-forum-members.

    I don't think it can help the forum as a whole if the temperament of the moderators means they will treat people with such disrespect. I am still unsure why i have offended the moderator so much, if i have done so, it is unintentional and i apologise for it.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Is Diversity of viewpoints dead on this forum?
    Their job is both. Often they just guide discussions. Sometimes they delete material that is incorrect or inappropriate. When the people who post such material then get argumentative and combative, they will sometimes ban the person.



    Moderators have a responsibility to clarify/edit/delete misleading or incorrect material.



    Once you start posting public arguments via sock puppets, that sort of compromise becomes much less likely. Generally a message to a moderator is the way to handle such a request. A public post in an unrelated forum by a sock puppet will generally just get deleted.

    There is often a misconception that "we have free speech here in the US! You can't just gag me." But this isn't a public space; it's a privately administered board, and the moderators/administrators use their power to create a forum that is close to the way they want it to be. (In this case a renewable energy discussion board.) Getting your posts deleted doesn't mean you are wrong or obstructive, it just means that what you posted doesn't fit in well with how they want the board to operate.

    billvonnovak,
    although much of what you said was done by moderators in the past, thanks to chris olson and a few others this is no longer true. rules were imposed against moderators limiting their power to basically spammer jammers and porn protectors and that was my primary reason for quitting moderation, not olson.

    rakkar/karrak,
    the original thread you referred to was a locked thread and that means discussion on it has been halted whether you agree with that decision or not. you want it open again and that can disrupt the forum. give the moderators some respect for what they do and what i said to you before holds true that a pm discussion between the moderators by you is the way to go and not your pushy my way or the highway attitude.
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