Question on Morningstar TS60

Hi all, Please give your opinion, especially if you have any experience with the Morningstar TS60.
Installed about 60 days ago, with 660watts PV and 6, 8L16 batteries wired for 12 volts.

Never once has the TS60 gone into Float mode, just keeps the batteries boiling all sunny day long after all sunny day long, in the Absorb mode, using PWM, holding the voltage rock steady at 14.8.
It will Bulk, Absorb and Equalize just fine, just NEVER switches to Float.
Am I doing something wrong, or does the TS60 have a problem?
I checked the SG and found every cell reading well up into the Overcharged area, beyond the scale.
Not being used to the TS60, I at first thought perhaps the batteries had been in need of a real good charge, that the TS60 knew something that I didn't, now however, I fear for my batteries.

For the past 2 years, this system has operated OK with my own, "homebuilt" regulator and now I'm wondering if I should go back to it.

Thanks in advance for your comments
Wayne

Comments

  • crewzer
    crewzer Registered Users, Solar Expert Posts: 1,832 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60

    Wayne,

    Morningstar’s TriStar controller has a special setting for L-16 batteries. Citing a Sandia Labs study, (TriStar manual, pg. 48), they’ve included a unique charge algorithm for the L-16 (15.0 V; manual pg. 27).

    This 15.0 V Absorb (PWM) value is greater than Trojan’s recommendation of 14.8 V. However, Morningstar’s recommendation is based on a battery temperature of 77 degrees F, and Trojan’s reference is 80 F.

    If your Tristar isn’t switching from Absorb to Float mode, it may be that the TriStar hasn’t sensed a low enough charge current. Unfortunately, I’ve not been able to find a solid spec for this value. Morningstar says that the ProStar switches from Absorb mode to Float mode when the “input current has been limited to 30% or less for one hour”.

    The “high” current condition could be due to a “low” charging voltage (battery SOC not high enough), low battery temperature (a higher charge voltage is required), bad or missing remote battery temp sensor, bad or missing battery voltage sense leads, external loads and/or weak batteries.

    It’s also possible that the TriStar isn’t happy with the combination of your PV array (660 W STC) and battery bank (~1,200 Ah). You might try temporarily disconnecting two of the batteries to see what happens. I wonder if declining afternoon energy production (fewer amps from the array) is somehow corn-fuzing the Tristar's internal logic?

    The TriStar’s charging algorithm can be tailored to specific requirements. You can download the TriStar PC software from Morningstar (manual, pg.43). Finally, you may need to contact Morningstar directly to address your particular situation. I’ve found their tech support department to be very responsive.

    HTH, and good luck!
    Jim / crewzer
  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60

    Thanks a lot Jim / Crewzer for your reply. I did have it set for L-16, until I saw that it was overcharging. Will have to look for 30%, but know I've seen it cut to 7 amps, when 35to 40 are available. I had seen that report on L-16 - - found it very interesting.
    Since this post, have sent the same question to morningstarcorp.com and will post their answer.
    Thanks again
    Wayne
    Just received answer from Morningstar:

    Dear Wayne,
    We have found that L16 batteries continue to absorb large currents, even after several hours at Absorption/Equalize voltage. Different controller manufacturers use different criteria to transition to float. Some use a time limit at absorption before transitioning to float.
    We monitor the PWM duty cycle. When the duty cycle is less than X % for 1 or 2 hours, the tristar will transition to float stage. In firmware version 8 and earlier, the PWM setpoint was 15%. This worked well for most battery types, but we found that older flooded batteries and L-16’s(of any age), had a difficult time transitioning to float. In version 9, we raised the threshold to 30%. This adjustment worked well, but just in case, we added the option to change the threshold in custom settings as well.
    Please find attached the latest version of firmware, v10. Instructions are included. Please let me know if you have any questions.
    Regards,
    Bill Mellema
    MS Engineering Dept.
  • crewzer
    crewzer Registered Users, Solar Expert Posts: 1,832 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60

    Wayne,

    Great response and customer service from Morningstar! I'll be interested in hearing about your system's performance after you install the V.10 upgrade.

    Regards,
    Jim / crewzer
  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60
    crewzer wrote:
    Wayne,

    Great response and customer service from Morningstar! I'll be interested in hearing about your system's performance after you install the V.10 upgrade.

    Regards,
    Jim / crewzer

    Yes, I'm very impressed with their response! Now I just have to get my hands on the computer cable he mentioned and then see what kind of trouble I can get myself into. LOL
    When I finally get it done, will let you know the results.
    By the way, just for today, to see what might happen, I set the absorb voltage to 14.4, and guess what - - when I came home late this afternoon, for the first time ever, it was in Float mode! Looks like the man knows what he's talking about as well as being prompt and nice about it!
    Wayne
  • crewzer
    crewzer Registered Users, Solar Expert Posts: 1,832 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60

    :-) 8-)
  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60

    Well, I finally got my hands on the needed cable, followed the instructions (very good) and just can't believe how well it went.
    Everything upgraded perfectly.
    Now however, it may be next year before I'll know if it solved the problem. You see, when I installed the Hornet, that ended all wind in Nova Scotia for almost 6 months. When I first installed my PV's, that ended all signs of the sun for the rest of that year. So, now that I've upgraded the controller and am waiting for sun to try it out, but I know it ain't gonna happen!
    Heck, we didn't have any snow last Winter, the first time in almost 100 years and it's all because 3 people who live in the village, bought big new snowmobiles. Ha! they aren't gonna do that again!
    Wayne
  • crewzer
    crewzer Registered Users, Solar Expert Posts: 1,832 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60

    I was wondering if you were the cause of all of that rain working its way up the US' East Coast and into the Maritimes... :lol:
  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60

    gee it sounds like somebody else has worse luck than me. wow a glimpse of the sun that i haven't seen much of in the past couple weeks while i'm typing this. hey wayne just don't go to the doctor's for a checkup and we'll see about sending some of this rare sunlight up your way. :roll:
  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: Question on Morningstar TS60

    :-D :lol: