Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

ChrisOlson
ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
in Off Grid Solar & Battery Systems #1
We recently replaced our Generac EcoGen with a Honda EM4000SX standby generator. I'm always interested in fuel consumption of various generators and fuel cost/kWh. So I did a fuel consumption test on the new generator. Environmentally conscious folks might be interested in the numbers I got, as well as folks trying to decide if they should buy an LP fueled generator for off-grid power.

First the EcoGen - It had an energy input of 109,600 BTU/hr, or approximately 1.3 gal/hr @ 5.5 kWh output at our elevation. That yields an overall efficiency of 17.1%. The cost of LPG around these parts is $1.90/gallon, giving a fuel cost/kWh of 44.9 cents.

The Honda requires 50,980 BTU/hr input, which is .44 gal/hr @ an actual continuous output of 3.8 kW. That yields an overall efficiency of 25.8%. The cost of regular unleaded gasoline, once I get the road tax back on it at the end of the year on our income taxes, is 3.64/gallon (present prices), giving a fuel cost/kWh of 42.1 cents.

The EcoGen is touted by Generac as being "eco friendly" with "clean burning" LP gas. Not so. One gallon of LP gas produces 12.669 lbs of CO2 so the EcoGen emits 2.99 lbs of CO2/kWh output.

One gallon of gasoline produces 20.350 lbs of CO2/gallon. So the gasoline fueled Honda emits 2.36 lbs of CO2/kWh - 79% of the CO2 emission of the EcoGen.
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Chris
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #2
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    Nice post.

    My LPG sets can wait years till the fuel is used without fuel degradation.
    I store LPG for that reason. Benzine / diesel have self / shelf lifes .

    Thanks for the info.

    VT
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  • waynefromnscanada
    waynefromnscanada Solar Expert Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭✭
    #3
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    Excellent posts. Very interesting info on the LPG /gasoline comparisons, and a very valid point re fuel degradation issues, definitely something to be considered if the gen set normally sits for long periods of time without use. That and gummed up carbs and blocked jets just when you most need you're gasoline gen set to start.
    Here in Nova Scotia LPG in standard 5 gal BBQ cylinders is roughly $5.0 per gal, and gasoline $5.5 per gal. Sucks :cry:
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #4
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    Our generator runs the most in the winter because of poor weather and/or the fact that I spend more time in my shop and use a lot of power. The most I'll keep on hand is whatever is in the generator and a 5 gallon can.

    I really wanted to get a diesel generator. But since they mandated ULSD the price/BTU of diesel is higher than gasoline, especially in the winter when the price of diesel fuel around these parts is up to 60 cents more/gallon. The Honda generator is not quite as efficient as a good diesel, but it's close enough.

    I've always wondered what other folks do for low tank pressure in the cold with LP. At 30 below F, when we usually need the generator power the most, we could not get enough tank pressure to run the generator.
    --
    Chris
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  • Mangas
    Mangas Solar Expert Posts: 547 ✭✭✭✭
    #5
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    Chris,

    For us common fuel supply (house furnaces, cooking, water heater and the genset), LPG pressurized fuel delivery and fuel stability were our reasons for deciding LPG.

    Sidebar to your question, awhile back we discussed coolant warmers for LPG gensets. I have one on my new CumminsOnan 20 kw unit.

    Consensus was they really aren't needed unless temps are well below zero for an extended period of time. Down here we have peiods in the teens to single digits for a few days at a time but mostly in the lower 20s' during winter. Any additional thoughts?
    Ranch Off Grid System & Custom Home: 2 x pair stacked Schneider XW 5548+ Plus inverters (4), 2 x Schneider MPPT 80-600 Charge Controllers, 2 Xanbus AGS Generator Start and Air Extraction System Controllers, 64 Trojan L16 REB 6v 375 AH Flooded Cel Batteries w/Water Miser Caps, 44 x 185 Sharp Solar Panels, Cummins Onan RS20 KW Propane Water Cooled Genset, ICF Custom House Construction, all appliances, Central A/C, 2 x High Efficiency Variable Speed three ton Central A/C 220v compressors, 2 x Propane furnaces, 2 x Variable Speed Air Handlers, 2 x HD WiFi HVAC Zoned System Controllers
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #6
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    I guess one of the reasons we decided to pull the LP generator out is because it wouldn't start and run in the winter. When it got down to 28 below last winter I had to start our little 3 kW gasoline backup generator and spent an hour pre-heating the big genset to get it to go. Then it would fire up and run and quit due to low tank pressure. We poured hot water over the tank and all that did was turn the tank into a ice block. We put a black blanket over the tank and that didn't work either. It would run for a bit, then quit.

    It's possible we had too small of a line from the tank to the generator - IIRC it was 1/2" copper. At zero degrees F it was OK. But much below that it didn't work. Some other folks around here that have LP furnaces were having the same problem though.
    --
    Chris
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  • waynefromnscanada
    waynefromnscanada Solar Expert Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭✭
    #7
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    Unfortunately for purposes like this, LPG pressure drops to ZERO as the temperature of the liquid approaches minus 40. Many snowmobilers used to carry with them (and some still do) a small propane blow torch for heat in case they needed to warm something up. Thing is, in the cold, they wouldn't light, and even if they did, the flame was too small to be of any use beyond perhaps lighting a cigarette. Up here in Nova Scotia, many heavy propane users, such as burger outlets MacDonalds etc, have a propane fired heat exchanger outside by their big tank, and it keeps the LPG warm enough to maintain the required pressure to burn the burgers and fries.
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #8
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    waynefromnscanada wrote: »
    Unfortunately for purposes like this, LPG pressure drops to ZERO as the temperature of the liquid approaches minus 40.

    That's what happened to us. We put the generator in in April 2011 and last winter was the first winter with it. It ended up being somewhat of a challenge for us. Thankfully, most of the winter was fairly warm last season so we had to fight with it for only a couple weeks. We own the tank, so the gas company would not come and get the fuel out of it for us when I decided to get a different generator. So we continued to run it until recently when the tank finally went dry.

    In December we purchased a little 3 kW gasoline fueled generator for backup. That gas generator sat outside by the Generac one night at 28 below. It started right up, with no pre-heat sitting outside covered with frost, when the Generac wouldn't even sneeze. I ran a heat lamp in the housing on the Generac for two hours before I could get a cough out of it, and then it wouldn't run anyway because of low LP pressure.

    By the end of February I had decided that LP fuel was probably not the best choice for us.
    --
    Chris
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #9
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    LPG can be a pain in sub zero temp. In those temps you must have the system configured differently .
    I have used LPG in the arctic , what the different features are that the liquid is now regulated to an expansion heater to handle the LPG in a liquid that will still flow till -40c , and in that expansion heater the liquid is now changed into a gas. the heaters come in electric / hot water exchanger's (from a boiler plant ) or the exhaustible heater that the running engine will replenish the boiling off temp drop.

    Most LPG use the tank as the Boil off from LPG to gas/vapour, then reg it to 11"wc .

    "Nose rubbing area's" use the liquid into a expansion (heated / heater) Valving system and then to the second regulation of 11WC (some at -30 are tank liquid till the expansion valve, those have different heavy copper lines[know the regs] ) Special LPG Tanks to the controllers .. These systems also worked up there in the daylight / summer month as they were (tee-shirt with a bug tent on) ..

    Diesel is just as much as a PITA at those temps, so don't jump onto thinner ice.

    VT
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  • peakbagger
    peakbagger Solar Expert Posts: 341 ✭✭✭
    #10
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    Gasoline takes up less space to store and equivalent amount of Btus. Diesel takes up even less space. That said most gasoline is refined from much hevier oil but a "cracking" process. The heavier oil is made lighter by the process but inevitably it tries to go back to where it came from leading to sludge and varnish. This can be managed and isnt an issue for a frequently run gen set (used for equalizing every month or so) but for long term emergency backup, propane is a lot more stable and wont crap up a carb.
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #11
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    For Gas and Diesel in the arctic / antarctic use in those -20c temps with internal combustion engines (turbine & recipe ) fuel is now preheated also but for start up and shut down. the fuelling systems have multiple fuel storage / usage tanks. Sub Zero Naphtha (white gas & light oil [forgot the type]) is used on shut down so the next start-up, the engine gets to start , idle and start to warm the crankcase oil's till it starts to knock / ping, at that point the benzine/gas, jet fuel or diesel valve is now switched over to the winter grade straight fuel that has also been slightly warmed, after all is running and semi stabilized, load is now applied and then the heat may be produced & power extracted. This start process thinking back was forever till it was all up and running. Shut down was release the loads & let idle cool down 10 min on its straight winter grade fuel , then switch over to Sub Zero Naphtha, when that fuel is being burnt , the noise changes , give 30 sec's and then Off. Shut all fuel supplies ....the remaining naphtha will boil off (carburetor ) and leave the fuel lines open and clear for the next start.

    Just FYI,, In the 60's the Northern Arctic froze , first one up in the morning , warmed for the rest ;)Attachment not found.

    I must Edit Add.

    This info is what / is used in "Professional" setups , As with Huge Ships "Deep-Sea" type , they DO-NOT use this system, They run a lighter fuel (Kerosene to diesel 1 ) for the Winter Shut Down & storage.
    This is only for info , use a Professional who knows about this for longevity of the engine life .

    YMMV

    VT.
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  • firerescue712
    firerescue712 Solar Expert Posts: 95 ✭✭
    #12
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    What about burying the tank? Even if is it above the frost/freeze line, it will still keep the propane warm enough to convert the liquid to gas. Just my 2 cents.
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #13
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    I'm using one ounce of Sta-bil per five gallons of gas for our new generator, which is supposed to keep the oxidation process of the fuel in check for up to a year. In the summer we'll probably only run a couple tanks of gas thru the generator but in winter I suspect it will be refueled once a week or so. It holds 6.2 gallons of gas. I'm not really that concerned about fuel breakdown because I think we'll use it enough to keep the fuel fresh in it. And we're not "preppers" or anything like that so long term storage is not one of my concerns as I see no sense to keeping two years worth of fuel on hand. At the most I'll have a full tank in the genset and a 5 gallon can full to refuel it with, on hand.

    The bigger issue is starting. The primary use of our generator is not battery charging - we have plenty of solar and wind capacity for that. It's load start amps that runs it most of the time. We have electric clothes dryer and electric range (my wife will not have LP appliances in the house). The inverters can carry the load from the clothes dryer, for instance, for up to a couple minutes with other normal loads on. When the load start threshold is reached the generator has to start in 6 seconds, it gets a 15 second warmup, then goes to full rated load to reduce the load on the inverters before they kick out due to overload.

    I still have to come up with a suitable pre-heat method for it. I was going to use a silicon pad heater on the engine block below the cylinder. But examination of the engine block reveals that there's no suitable place to put one. So my plan B is to use a 125 watt heat lamp in the enclosure that shines on the block below the cylinder. I'll probably put a thermostat on it so the heat lamp comes on in cold weather to keep the engine at a comfortable starting temp for cold weather.

    Our ambient temps have been getting down into the 40's here the last few nights and 65 degrees F during the day. The generator has run a couple times for load amps in the past two days and it has no problem accepting full rated load 20 seconds after startup. But in colder weather I suspect it could stumble so some form of preheat will still be needed for it.

    A heat lamp will use maybe 2.5 kWh/day in really cold weather, but I don't consider that too bad compared to what it takes to keep a liquid-cooled diesel warm enough for load start duty. I don't like liquid-fueled pre-heat options because of fire danger.
    --
    Chris
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  • waynefromnscanada
    waynefromnscanada Solar Expert Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭✭
    #14
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    And for those using gasoline (and diesel) take note of what was previously hinted at: Winter grade / Summer grade. Many people don't realize, but there is a difference. With diesel, the paraffin, which causes the fuel to jell when cold, is stripped out. The result is less energy per gallon, but it will keep flowing in Winter. With Gasoline, the chemical makeup is changed to provide higher volatility, the better to evaporate, burn, for better starts. Summer grade has it's volatility reduced to prevent vapor lock and such during hot weather. So not only is it important to keep fuel "fresh", but it's important to have the proper grade for the season.
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #15
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    firerescue712 wrote: »
    What about burying the tank? Even if is it above the frost/freeze line, it will still keep the propane warm enough to convert the liquid to gas.

    Underground fuel tanks require a monitoring system on them (federal law now), and I think LPG is no different than underground diesel or gasoline tanks. The cost of those monitoring systems, I think, are prohibitive.

    I don't know if LPG tanks are rated for underground service either. I've never seen one around these parts.
    --
    Chris
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  • inetdog
    inetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    #16
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    waynefromnscanada wrote: »
    And for those using gasoline (and diesel) take note of what was previously hinted at: Winter grade / Summer grade. Many people don't realize, but there is a difference. With diesel, the paraffin, which causes the fuel to jell when cold, is stripped out. The result is less energy per gallon, but it will keep flowing in Winter. With Gasoline, the chemical makeup is changed to provide higher volatility, the better to evaporate, burn, for better starts. Summer grade has it's volatility reduced to prevent vapor lock and such during hot weather. So not only is it important to keep fuel "fresh", but it's important to have the proper grade for the season.

    These days there will also be additional differences between winter and summer grade, at least in the US, for the purpose of emission controls. Whether those changes are for the better or for the worse for cold starting of a stationary engine, I don't know.
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
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  • inetdog
    inetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    #17
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    ChrisOlson wrote: »
    Underground fuel tanks require a monitoring system on them (federal law now), and I think LPG is no different than underground diesel or gasoline tanks. The cost of those monitoring systems, I think, are prohibitive.

    I don't know if LPG tanks are rated for underground service either. I've never seen one around these parts.
    --
    Chris

    Direct burial is probably not an option, but a "root cellar" approach might work.
    Even then if the fuel transfer line and the engine intake manifold, etc. are cool enough you might have a problem with immediate condensation.
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #18
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    waynefromnscanada wrote: »
    So not only is it important to keep fuel "fresh", but it's important to have the proper grade for the season.

    I'm buying off-road recreational gasoline for our new generator and it has no ethanol in it. I'm not sure what they use for an oxygenate in it but it has more power per gallon than 10% ethanol blends. I tried 10% ethanol gas in my outboard vs the gas with no ethanol and the boat goes 70 mph with the "good gas" and struggles to get to 65 mph with the ethanol blended gas. I've never tested the two types in a generator though. But I suspect there would be a difference there too.

    I don't think they change the blend on that off-road gasoline for winter, just like they don't for off-road, dyed red diesel fuel. It's up to the end user to put whatever additives in it are required for cold weather.
    --
    Chris
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #19
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    inetdog wrote: »
    These days there will also be additional differences between winter and summer grade, at least in the US, for the purpose of emission controls. Whether those changes are for the better or for the worse for cold starting of a stationary engine, I don't know.

    It's really hard to get that information from your fuel supplier too. It's almost like whatever they put in it is Top Secret Information. In reality it all comes from the same tank farm, more than likely. When I told my fuel supplier that one day he gave me a blank look like I'm not supposed to know that.
    --
    Chris
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #20
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    firerescue712 wrote: »
    What about burying the tank? Even if is it above the frost/freeze line, it will still keep the propane warm enough to convert the liquid to gas. Just my 2 cents.

    Correct , But all lines also must below the frost depth plus, then there also needs to be a lower drain to flush if it ever needs.
    So that is not always ez.
    Northern Arctic digging is a No-No due to Perma-Frost deterioration without special methods. Underground LPG tanks are available but $$$ ..I have one.
    Use Real "Gas" Benzine from an airport that fuels small fix wing aircraft (piper cessna type) that fuel is 110 Oc with all the real chemicals for engines , no additives required, I would never trust the "Gas" that comes for your car. It might be a bit more expensive , till you see the difference after hours of problem free running. Plus in the Avatar pix , you would want the correct proper fuel pulling ice barges ;)
    VT.

    I edited Added my previous post to CYA..
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #21
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    CDN_VT wrote: »
    Use Real "Gas" Benzine from an airport that fuels small fix wing aircraft (piper cessna type) that fuel is 110 Oc with all the real chemicals for engines , no additives required

    100LL avgas is also bad for modern engines because it has .56 gram/liter lead in it. That just causes fouling of the plug, top piston ring and exhaust valve. There's a reason recip aircraft engines only typically run 2,000 hours between overhauls. And a lot of them end up with a top overhaul before the mandated major overhaul because rings get stuck and score cylinder barrels so they fail a leakdown test during annual inspection.
    --
    Chris
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #22
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    No dispute on the Hr's on Inspections , but that is major lead content that could cause what you have posted. To the point of leaving contrails in lead ;) .
    Myself I use that Avgas in all my chainsaw's to snow-blowers ETC. I just filled up my 208L (45 usg) barrels .. Pricey but it's going to get worse.
    Since were on fuels , 10% ethanol blends plus any other filler there pushing that is ethanol / alcohol based, is so damaging to any premixed fuel due to the ethanol / alcohol will not let the premixed oil molecule join with the fuel for proper lubrication .
    I also run that lead based fuel in my vintage Honda Motorcycles Street (38,000 mile 1978) & Scrambles 3000 mile 1976 XL350 never with a engine problem yet !! you could be correct , but soft shoulders .
    All of many stihl chainsaws , I drive them very hard , that fuel has never failed , Many around (Tree Monkey People ) also get me to pickup there fuel just because of keeping there saws working.

    VT.
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  • techntrek
    techntrek Solar Expert Posts: 1,372 ✭✭✭
    #23
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    ChrisOlson wrote: »
    Underground fuel tanks require a monitoring system on them (federal law now), and I think LPG is no different than underground diesel or gasoline tanks. The cost of those monitoring systems, I think, are prohibitive.

    I don't know if LPG tanks are rated for underground service either. I've never seen one around these parts.
    --
    Chris

    No, buried LPG does not require monitoring.
    4.5 kw APC UPS powered by a Prius, 12 kw Generac, Honda EU3000is
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  • techntrek
    techntrek Solar Expert Posts: 1,372 ✭✭✭
    #24
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    ChrisOlson wrote: »
    It's really hard to get that information from your fuel supplier too. It's almost like whatever they put in it is Top Secret Information. In reality it all comes from the same tank farm, more than likely. When I told my fuel supplier that one day he gave me a blank look like I'm not supposed to know that.
    --
    Chris

    All true. My father used to be a supplier to several fuel companies (business supplies not fuel-related), and he told me of sitting up on a hill and watching the fuel trucks roll into a big fuel depot. All different brands. Same gas was put in every truck, the only difference was a jug of additive in each truck specific to the brand.
    4.5 kw APC UPS powered by a Prius, 12 kw Generac, Honda EU3000is
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  • techntrek
    techntrek Solar Expert Posts: 1,372 ✭✭✭
    #25
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    ChrisOlson wrote: »
    100LL avgas is also bad for modern engines because it has .56 gram/liter lead in it. That just causes fouling of the plug, top piston ring and exhaust valve. There's a reason recip aircraft engines only typically run 2,000 hours between overhauls. And a lot of them end up with a top overhaul before the mandated major overhaul because rings get stuck and score cylinder barrels so they fail a leakdown test during annual inspection.
    --
    Chris

    If you run avgas in a car it will destroy the catalytic converter and oxygen sensors, on top of the valve problems you mentioned.
    4.5 kw APC UPS powered by a Prius, 12 kw Generac, Honda EU3000is
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #26
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    techntrek wrote: »
    If you run avgas in a car it will destroy the catalytic converter and oxygen sensors.

    True , But not valve problems !! Myth. Even with Vanos / VVT/CVVT whatever you want to call it , all the same (potato- potato ) ..

    This is MY trade. Non-lead caused valve burns due to poor valves that were not made for that new Non-lead fuel in the 80's. Replaced with a M element from the Perry/tables(PTOE). Still just as bad .
    Been having to clean under my nails since magnetos to COPS+ .



    techntrek ,, That amount of lead posted is almost sludge in a float bowl. In that amount , yes I could see valves having a poor seat & then do a burn.

    I've worked with AIR-Care BC (1993-2012),, A derivative from Hamilton-Beach Calif..
    It's where they do emission testing , BBY head gas station & 8 tire dyno's.

    VT
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #27
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    techntrek wrote: »
    Same gas was put in every truck, the only difference was a jug of additive in each truck specific to the brand.

    The drivers for the various brands here all carry a credit-card type thing. When they fill up their tankers at the tank farm in Chippewa Falls they swipe their credit card deal in a card reader. That card has the information on it that tells the blending equipment what to blend in their load of fuel. I know one of the drivers really well - hauls for Federated Transport. And he said only some engineers with Top Level Clearance knows what goes into that gas, or what the secret "blend" is in the information contained on that card.

    I really think it's some sort of racket. Gas stations aren't supposed to do any price fixing. But in this small town we got 5 of them and the owners all get together at Carol's Cafe and decide that they're all going to charge the same price for fuel. Kwik Trip sets the price and they got an electronic sign. The owner of the one gas station three blocks up has a pair of binoculars laying right on the counter and he looks down the street and sees Kwik Trip went up a few cents - so he rushes right outside with his long pole and changes his prices to match. And the gas stations on the other side of Kwik Trip all do the same thing.

    Well -- isn't that price fixing? It's supposed to be illegal. What ever happened to the old days when there was gas wars? I'll bet most people today think a gas war is when the US goes to Iraq to capture Saddam Hussein so we can get US oil companies pumping crude in the Middle East.
    --
    Chris
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  • mtdoc
    mtdoc Solar Expert Posts: 600 ✭✭
    #28
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    ChrisOlson wrote: »
    Underground fuel tanks require a monitoring system on them (federal law now), and I think LPG is no different than underground diesel or gasoline tanks. The cost of those monitoring systems, I think, are prohibitive.

    I don't know if LPG tanks are rated for underground service either. I've never seen one around these parts.
    --
    Chris

    Funny thing about underground LPG tanks - you can't see them - they're underground.:D I installed a 1000 gal underground tank last year (I also previously had one when I lived in northern Vermont - temps similar to Northern Wisconsin). No monitoring system needed. My neighbor whose lived in the area for 40 yrs said " I didn't know you could put an LPG tank underground" . The Ferrel Gas guy who installed it said he installs them all the time. Of course if you don't have one and you've only ever seen the above ground ones - I guess it's understandable you might not realize they are quite common.
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #29
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    mtdoc wrote: »
    Funny thing about underground LPG tanks - you can't see them - they're underground.:D I installed a 1000 gal underground tank last year (I also previously had one when I lived in northern Vermont - temps similar to Northern Wisconsin). No monitoring system needed. My neighbour whose lived in the area for 40 yrs said " I didn't know you could put an LPG tank underground" . The Ferrel Gas guy who installed it said he installs them all the time. Of course if you don't have one and you've only ever seen the above ground ones - I guess it's understandable you might not realize they are quite common.

    Like !!! ^^^^^^^^^^^^

    No agree or Like button , so it's a barrage of comments to put the point across.

    & http://gasbuddy.com/ for the bottom barrel carp..

    YMMV
    VT.
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  • ChrisOlson
    ChrisOlson Banned Posts: 1,807 ✭✭
    #30
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators
    mtdoc wrote: »
    Funny thing about underground LPG tanks - you can't see them - they're underground.:D I installed a 1000 gal underground tank last year

    This is all news to me. I have never heard of, nor do I know of, anybody that has an underground LP tank (until now). ;)
    --
    Chris
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  • mtdoc
    mtdoc Solar Expert Posts: 600 ✭✭
    #31
    Re: Gasoline vs LP Fueled Generators

    The main issue with underground LPG tanks is if not properly installed in ground prone to being wet - they can float up out of the ground - surfacing like a submarine!

    Attachment not found.
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