12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

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bmet
bmet Solar Expert Posts: 630 ✭✭
in Solar Beginners Corner #1
In an attempt to go green in my RV, I installed a handful of 12V LEDs in overhead fixures to replace the standard 1141, single-contact, 12V bulbs. At almost $12 apiece, I wasn't considering them to be the 'trash' end of the technology.

A nasty surprise, my TV reception stops when these LEDs start. The fixture is about 5 feet from the TV, BUT the receiving antenna is outside the RV and 15 feet away! I posted a video demonstration for anyone who is interested. The LEDs are made by the same company that marketed my very first (Chinese) charge controller, so I was inclined to choose these. While they have a nice illumination (6000K), the RV is a guest room, so needs its TV.

UPDATE: Not all browsers can display the mp4 video of my Android phone. I am on a Mac, Safari will show it, but Firefox will not. I don't know about Windows. I also must apologize for not knowing how to universally handle video to include renaming and converting.

20120901_193557.mp4

For anyone wishing to avoid these, I will gladly PM you the specifics of the product.
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  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    #2
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

    yikes, that terrible. i would imagine that to blanket a tv channel like that with that much rf sends a red flag imho. i would suggest trying a different brand not made in china preferably to see if you get better results. if you want to you could try the noise reduction techniques used in this thread.
    http://forum.solar-electric.com/showthread.php?5887-Radio-Noise-from-PV-System

    there would not be a guarantee that making those efforts would stop that interference.
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,447 admin
    #3
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

    Bmet,

    Do you know if those are electronic ballast or a simple resistor for current limiting to the LEDs?

    I would try a test--if you can. Take a small 12 volt battery and use very short wires to power the lamp. If the problem "goes away", then it is probably radiating down the wiring. Using good shield wiring running (home run) back to the battery bank (and its own fuse for short circuit protection of the small/sheilded cable may take care of the problem.

    If not, then you may have to look at shielding the ballast unit itself.

    With the frequency of digital TV--Either there is a WHOLE BUNCH of RF noise going down the wires--or the lamp itself is broad casting. Adding a metal plate around the rear of the lamp (if plastic) and grounding that to the metal skin of the RV may help too (we used heavy aluminum foil from the store and embossed copper tape for our experiments).

    In general, for less than 180 MHz, emissions came from power/signal cables (talking about computer systems here). Above that, usually directly from the circuit boards and/or gaps in the metal cabinets.

    These first generation LEDs (just like the CFL's) are pretty noisy devices. It will take some major complaints from consumers to get the government off of dead center (i.e., wild west policies about lighting interference).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #4
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.
    bmet wrote: »

    For anyone wishing to avoid these, I will gladly PM you the specifics of the product.

    Please Post much more info on the 12V bulbs , Links etc.
    Great Video .. And yes I have experience this , know the correction for what I have done.
    I'm 70% led converted in 3 years .. Plus many other ways to tame the Watt ?

    VT
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  • bmet
    bmet Solar Expert Posts: 630 ✭✭
    #5
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

    I sent you a private message with the LED specifics. One thing changed, the price came down from $11.95 to $9.95, so I wonder if my complaint had anything to do with it. Probalby not.
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  • Shadowcatcher
    Shadowcatcher Solar Expert Posts: 228 ✭✭✭
    #6
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

    I bought marine G4 light fixtures which I sent to the company building our trailer and I obtained G4 LED arrays which work beautifully and with no interference.
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  • CDN_VT
    CDN_VT Solar Expert Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    #7
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

    I got it figured , Gifted & now PM !! I'm sure we could of posted it here.
    VT
    old & slow
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  • icarus
    icarus Solar Expert Posts: 5,436 ✭✭✭✭
    #8
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

    The fall of the price of LEDs has been astounding. I am now finding 12 vdc bulbs for around $1-3, 120 vac bulbs for under $5.

    Tony
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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #9
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.
    icarus wrote: »
    The fall of the price of LEDs has been astounding. I am now finding 12 vdc bulbs for around $1-3, 120 vac bulbs for under $5.

    Tony

    But not in British Columbia. :(
    Ironically, BC Hydro led (pun intended) the way with LED Christmas (whoops! 'holiday') lights years ago and then implemented vigorous campaigns to get people to switch to CFL's. The money invested in conservation was as good if not better payback as building new generating plants.

    But I was in Home Depot just this past week looking at replacement GU10's for the kitchen. Only 35 Watt equivalent (less than 1/2 the lumens) and $23 each. With electric at ten cents per kW hour that's a pretty long payback time and I'm sure someone would say they're not bright enough.

    I wonder how much of that price is "green profiteering"?
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  • icarus
    icarus Solar Expert Posts: 5,436 ✭✭✭✭
    #10
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

    Marc, the point however is that the bulb that is $23 to you now, was $43 a year go. They are not cheap enough (IMHO) to warrant the cost per lumen compared to good CFLS yet, but they are getting closer. The quality of lit from simple Edison base 4 watt bulbs is very good (in a warm white colour, and for those of us off grid, it is great. I got a dozen at Costco in the stqtes for ~$5 each. Enough to fill my house twice. I have dropped my lighting load by ~75%. I also got some really nice reading and talk lamps from IKEA for ~$10, great for reading with old eyes, and for work on the bench.

    Tony
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  • justsumguy
    justsumguy Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭
    #11
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    Re: 12V LED lamps for RV, and RF interference issues.

    take a look at format factory for all of your file conversion needs it is a free program.
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