particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

notsobright
notsobright Solar Expert Posts: 247 ✭✭
in General Solar Power Topics #1
is anyone paying attention to the space weather conditions?

we seem to be entering an interstellar energy cloud that is starting to excite the sun and planets according to Astrophysicist.

from what I gather it is depleting the magnetosphere while at the same time exciting the suns activity. When flux levels of particle radiaiton are high and the magnetic field is at a low our beloved PV panels may suffer.

does anyone here have or know of any specifics on this subject? like exactly how panels can be affected and what are some precautions that may be taken?


thanks


edit:

here is a very good page that consolodates alot of real time data aquisition on the subject: http://solarimg.org/artis/

and this one covers the magnetosphere. http://www.solarham.com/magnetogram.htm

2nd edit: might as well add the proton flux graph too.

http://www.swpc.noaa.gov/ace/Sis_24h.gif
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Comments

  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #2
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    If you have particle radiation affecting the panels--You might need to be in bunker during that time. I think our Van Allen Belt and the Atmosphere take care of most of the "hard" radiation.

    The only practical effect that I foresee is if you are utility connected (or phone, cable TV, etc.) where you can get surges from miles of copper/aluminum wiring the receives the energy and brings it into your home (and/or knocks out the utility's transformers from various issues with surges).

    So, other than disconnecting your off-grid Inverter from the utility mains/nearby circuits (by feet--not by just opening a circuit breaker)--I am not sure I would/could do more.

    Again, for most people, local lightning strikes are probably going to affect on grid and off grid folks more often. (yes, CME's are regional or larger effects that can knock down a utility for weeks or months while replacement transformers are made--But then you are either able to operate independent of the grid--or not).

    Anyway, that and $5 will buy you a cup of coffee.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • techntrek
    techntrek Solar Expert Posts: 1,372 ✭✭✭
    #3
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    The current solar storms aren't being caused by anything "interstellar". We are nearing the peak of the normal 11-year cycle, which is producing larger sun spots which are then exploding with solar flares. Those flares eject material and charged particles which then affects Earth in a day or two. There have been two big explosions in the last few days which are what have made the news... http://www.spaceweather.com/
    4.5 kw APC UPS powered by a Prius, 12 kw Generac, Honda EU3000is
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  • Windsun
    Windsun Solar Expert Posts: 1,164 ✭✭
    #4
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    This is probably the most reliable and up to date site for solar storm info aside from the NOAA site mentioned previously http://spaceweather.com/
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  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    #5
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    you might also enjoy this,
    http://www.swpc.noaa.gov/wsa-enlil/cme-based/
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  • notsobright
    notsobright Solar Expert Posts: 247 ✭✭
    #6
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?
    BB. wrote: »
    If you have particle radiation affecting the panels--You might need to be in bunker during that time.


    hi BB, what makes you think I'm not? ;-)
    BB. wrote: »
    I think our Van Allen Belt and the Atmosphere take care of most of the "hard" radiation.

    thats a nice comforting thought but how can we be certain or not of this?
    BB. wrote: »
    Anyway, that and $5 will buy you a cup of coffee.

    -Bill

    OK, thanks!



    techntrek wrote: »
    The current solar storms aren't being caused by anything "interstellar".


    hi techntrek, the proton emissions from a solar flare are short duration events but the data (assuming it is correct and accurate) indicates a steady proton flux that doesnt not coincide with the flares.


    Windsun wrote: »
    This is probably the most reliable and up to date site for solar storm info aside from the NOAA site mentioned previously http://spaceweather.com/


    hi Windsun, I agree but the first link I added basically puts everything in one place (fewer mouse clicks)

    hey, off topic but can you please consider changing to a black or dark back ground here? in the name of conservation and all (my screename)


    but anyway.. just for the sake of discussion, lets say things really do get bad and we must rely on our PV panels being exposed to variable extream conditions over long periods of time. does anyone know of a practical material that could be used to shield panels durring peak periods of extream radiation?


    thanks
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  • waynefromnscanada
    waynefromnscanada Solar Expert Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭✭
    #7
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?
    notsobright wrote: »
    does anyone know of a practical material that could be used to shield panels during peak periods of extreme radiation?
    thanks

    If things get that bad, shielding solar panels will be the least of our worries. And since it is appointed unto all, once to die, that will be our time to bend way down, and kiss our butts goodbye. :D
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,613 admin
    #8
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    I don't know if this helps you or not (I am not much into reading these types of documents):

    Origin of Radiation-Induced Degradation in Polymer Solar Cells (PDF download--not very big)

    Even the atmosphere provides significant protection against cosmic rays and such. Just flying on a jet plan increases exposure to radiation:

    http://hps.org/publicinformation/ate/faqs/commercialflights.html

    And high altitude aircraft like the Concorde had even (slightly?) higher exposure to radiation:
    The Concorde was the only commercial aircraft equipped with radiation dosimeters. It was an abundance of caution—the typical exposure can be calculated before the supersonic transport takes off. France's Civil Aviation Department takes the guesswork from the levels by operating an online calculator that can assess the level of exposure to those on board.
    A solar flare can raise radiation levels. U.S. Department of Energy scientists extrapolated the exposure of a high-flying supersonic aircraft during the strongest known solar event—a 1956 solar flare—and concluded that the flare likely would have boosted exposure to 10 mSv per hour. If you're worried, consult with the solar weathermen at the Space Environment Center before flying.

    -Bill :confused:
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    #9
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    if we get something that bad then totally encasing the pvs in metal and grounding it as in a solid faraday cage with no connections into it may be the only thing to save it. it hasen't been that bad in centuries, but can happen. i for one want my pvs to be used now as i haven't extra to store away for such an event and good luck in trying to encase your pvs in metal. you might note that you might get away with metal screening though.
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  • RandomJoe
    RandomJoe Solar Expert Posts: 472 ✭✭✭
    #10
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?
    notsobright wrote: »
    hey, off topic but can you please consider changing to a black or dark back ground here? in the name of conservation and all (my screename)

    Actually, unless you are still using CRT monitors, changing to a black/dark background will use MORE power. LCD screens use more energy to "show black", whereas CRTs used more to "show white".

    Not that it really matters - the power difference between black & white on an LCD is negligible. The test in the following article showed about 0.6W difference between all-black and all-white on a 17" LCD monitor.

    http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=fact-or-fiction-black-is
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  • notsobright
    notsobright Solar Expert Posts: 247 ✭✭
    #11
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?
    RandomJoe wrote: »
    Not that it really matters - the power difference between black & white on an LCD is negligible. The test in the following article showed about 0.6W difference between all-black and all-white on a 17" LCD monitor.

    hi RandomJoe, somewhat but now consider every screen viewing this forum and its not so "negligible".

    thanks for the info.
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  • ggunn
    ggunn Solar Expert Posts: 1,973 ✭✭✭
    #12
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?
    notsobright wrote: »
    hi RandomJoe, somewhat but now consider every screen viewing this forum and its not so "negligible".
    Also consider his point that the difference is that all black uses the greater amount of power. I assume that is because when LCD cells are "on", they block the light from the back plane.

    But how many screens do you think are viewing this forum at any one time, anyway?
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  • techntrek
    techntrek Solar Expert Posts: 1,372 ✭✭✭
    #13
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    And don't forget LED, where the overall brightness is the determining factor in power consumption (like CRT). Black = low, white = high.
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  • RandomJoe
    RandomJoe Solar Expert Posts: 472 ✭✭✭
    #14
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    There may now be monitors using LEDs for the actual pixels, I've not followed monitor tech recently, but most "LED" screens are just standard LCDs that use white LEDs for the backlight instead of the far more power-hungry CCFLs. For these, black still is higher power than white.
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  • techntrek
    techntrek Solar Expert Posts: 1,372 ✭✭✭
    #15
    Re: particle radiaiton and magnetic field spikes, can these affects PV panels?

    I'm defininitely talking about LED pixels and not backlighting. There's one in my pocket right now. Go to bestbuy.com and you can select between LCD and LED monitors and TVs. Most new-model LCD monitors/TVs are going to LED backlighting as you describe. Cold-cathode is going away quickly.
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