Check my plan?

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sprintman
sprintman Registered Users Posts: 16
My panels are supposed to arrive tomorrow. 4-175 watt panels the specs are: 44.20Voc 35.20Vmp 5.20Isc 4.95Imp Mono crystaline. Charge controller will be outback flexmax 60. I am going to use a combiner box and 2 circuit breakers.

So here's what I'm thinking: two sets of two panels in series then parralleled.
run my wires from my roof to the combiner box which will be in my basement(under the stairway) this is a 25' or less run one way so #10 wire. A delta DC lightning arrestor connected at the combiner box. Just before the charge controller will put a disconnect--I've been told I can use a simple AC disconnect like one for an air conditioner.......is that ok? should it be 30 or 60 amps? then the charge controller followed by another one of these disconnects then the batteries then a dc breaker of appropriate size (like a bussman) just before the inverter. Thanks in advance for your consideration!

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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
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    Re: Check my plan?

    What voltage/Amp*Hour battery bank?

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • sprintman
    sprintman Registered Users Posts: 16
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    Re: Check my plan?

    initially the battery bank would be 4 225amp hour 6v golf cart batteries. This set up is going in a vacation cabin. When I retire in 10 years would like to upgrade to the largest possible battery bank.....What would that be?
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
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    Re: Check my plan?

    Are you going to set this up as a 24 or 12 volt battery bank?

    Some basic rules of thumb... Batteries should be charged around 5% to 13% rate of charge:
    • 4x 6 volt * 225 AH * 1/0.77 panel+charger derating * 0.05 rate of charge = 351 watts of solar panels minimum
    • 4x 6 volt * 225 AH * 1/0.77 panel+charger derating * 0.10 rate of charge = 701 watts of solar panels good sized array to flooded cell battery
    • 4x 6 volt * 225 AH * 1/0.77 panel+charger derating * 0.13 rate of charge = 912 watts of solar panels rough cost effective maximum solar array
    You panels:
    • 4x 175 watts = 700 watts
    So--you are right smack dab at the "sweet spot" for charging for your flooded cell battery bank with your array.

    In theory, you could go 2x larger with the battery bank--but I would recommend you try it out as is for the moment.

    Larger battery banks can take you through more cloudy days--but they also take longer to recharge. The longer your battery bank sets below ~75% state of charge--the faster it will sulfate (as the batteries lose AH capacity)... Basically, you would like to get your bank recharged above 75% state of charge within 1 day... Setting for days/weeks/months below ~75% state of charge is bad--and a small array + large battery bank means it will take longer to recharge your bank.

    Do you have an idea of how much solar/battery power you would like to use (per day, Amp*Hours at what voltage or Watt*Hours, AC/DC or what)?

    Your 35.20Vmp panels are just about right for charging a 24 volt battery bank with a less expensive PCM charge controller...

    However, if you have long distances from the Array to Charge Controller/Battery shed (~20 feet or more) or want to eventually install a larger array--you may want to look at a MPPT controller.

    If you don't plan on adding more panels soon--I would not push the MPPT controller purchase (2-3x more expensive). 10 years is "forever" in solar PV equipment--and I would plan on replacing controllers, inverters, battery chargers (electronics) after about 10+ years of use (it can get very difficult to find spares and people to repair old electronics in general).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • sprintman
    sprintman Registered Users Posts: 16
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    Re: Check my plan?

    Thanks Bill, I'm planning a 12v battery bank because I already have a very good 12v inverter though a little small at 600watts. That size looks to be able to handle the loads I have planned for it. Max. 12-1500watt hours per day. Also what about using the Ac airconditioning disconnects on the Dc side of this installation as outlined in original post?
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
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    Re: Check my plan?

    If you have less than three parallel panel strings, you do not need any combiner box/fuse/breakers on the solar array.

    When using AC switches on DC circuits--you should check the DC rating (if any) of the switches... DC current is much more difficult to interrupt (DC sustains arcs much better than AC). Since you will not be using the solar panel disconnect very much--you probably good get way with an AC disconnect...

    And, I made a mistake typing up my previous reply--I intended to say you could have a 2x larger battery bank with your current array--Not a 2x larger array with your current battery bank.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • bobdog
    bobdog Solar Expert Posts: 192 ✭✭
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    Re: Check my plan?

    did i miss something here or isn't the battery bank 450 amps at 12 volts? 2 batteries in series to make 12 volts and then each string paralleled to make 450 amps.

    tim
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
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    Re: Check my plan?
    bobdog wrote: »
    did i miss something here or isn't the battery bank 450 amps at 12 volts? 2 batteries in series to make 12 volts and then each string paralleled to make 450 amps.

    tim
    sprintman wrote: »
    initially the battery bank would be 4 225amp hour 6v golf cart batteries. This set up is going in a vacation cabin. When I retire in 10 years would like to upgrade to the largest possible battery bank.....What would that be?

    Tim, you got everything right--Just need to call it 450 Amp*Hours to get the right units.

    Is your question my math?
    • 4x 6 volt * 225 AH = 5,400 Watts*Hours of stored energy
    That can be re-written as (2x 6 volt batteries in series, then two 12 volt strings in parallel):
    • 2x 12 volt * 225 AH = 5,400 WH
    Still the same "amount" of stored energy.

    People usually use AH when talking about battery banks--but Watt*Hours is sometimes easier because we don't have to keep asking what voltage as we do the math...

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • bobdog
    bobdog Solar Expert Posts: 192 ✭✭
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    Re: Check my plan?
    BB. wrote: »
    Tim, you got everything right--Just need to call it 450 Amp*Hours to get the right units.

    Is your question my math?
    • 4x 6 volt * 225 AH = 5,400 Watts*Hours of stored energy
    That can be re-written as (2x 6 volt batteries in series, then two 12 volt strings in parallel):
    • 2x 12 volt * 225 AH = 5,400 WH
    Still the same "amount" of stored energy.

    People usually use AH when talking about battery banks--but Watt*Hours is sometimes easier because we don't have to keep asking what voltage as we do the math...

    -Bill

    Thanks Bill. I was confused and didn't check the math. I just saw 225 and was curious. Sorry for the confusion. And your right I need to use "hours" in my thoughts and posts.

    Tim