Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates

solar_dave
solar_dave Solar Expert Posts: 2,397 ✭✭✭✭
I got $3 a watt from APS last March for the 2160 watt add I did, on April 1 they lowered the rebate to around $2.25 and now down to $1.75. The demand has been so high yet the available funds are fixed, so their solution is to reduce the rebate amount!

Glad I jumped in when I did.

Comments

  • solarix
    solarix Solar Expert Posts: 713 ✭✭
    Re: Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates

    No no - I'm the last!, I had been stalling to put in a APS rebate application on my own house when on Apr 1 we got the email announcing the drop from $3.00 to $2.15/w. I put in the application within an hour - worried that it was too late. Sure enough the drop was retroactive to the day before in order to eliminate any landrushes. But then in a corporation commission meeting later that month, APS was required to extend the period for 3 more days so we squeaked by after all. They did kind of have their way though as APS only paid the $2.15/w amount upon completion and promised to pay the rest the next year.
    Anyway as of my December bill, the 5.5kW Xantrex GT system offset all the on-peak power we used with 1kwh to spare.
  • solar_dave
    solar_dave Solar Expert Posts: 2,397 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates
    solarix wrote: »
    No no - I'm the last!, I had been stalling to put in a APS rebate application on my own house when on Apr 1 we got the email announcing the drop from $3.00 to $2.15/w. I put in the application within an hour - worried that it was too late. Sure enough the drop was retroactive to the day before in order to eliminate any landrushes. But then in a corporation commission meeting later that month, APS was required to extend the period for 3 more days so we squeaked by after all. They did kind of have their way though as APS only paid the $2.15/w amount upon completion and promised to pay the rest the next year.
    Anyway as of my December bill, the 5.5kW Xantrex GT system offset all the on-peak power we used with 1kwh to spare.

    Nice one, slip it in under the wire, mine went in the last day of March and it was just luck of the draw. We had a premonition of sorts mid March when the wife and I discussed the final expansion, got our bid and pulled the trigger. We figured that they kept running up against the limit earlier in the year and we had better " git 'er done " .

    Solarix, what billing plan are you using?
  • solarix
    solarix Solar Expert Posts: 713 ✭✭
    Re: Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates

    We are on APS's EPR-6 billing plan which is the net-metering option - much better than the net-billing option.
    Our rate plan is ET-2 (noon to 7pm peak). We used to be on the EC-2 prior to the new solar system as we use a lot of nighttime power cause of our greenhouse (we now have sustainable electricity, water and food) and have on-peak usage of only about 17%. Wish I would have converted to the ET-1 plan (9am to 9pm peak) before they retired it at the end of 2009.
    I have developed my own software for analyzing utility bills and if if anyone in the APS area (Northern Arizona) wants to send me a recent copy of their bill, I'll figure the best plan for them. Our utility - APS makes a ton of extra money from all the people that are still on the standard rate plan. I gain the confidence of new customers by helping them with this. APS will also help them determine the best plan if they would call and ask for it, but APS will not call you and offer you the savings. There are a lot of people in Arizona paying $500/month bills that could be paying $350 just by asking for the right rate plan.
  • solar_dave
    solar_dave Solar Expert Posts: 2,397 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates
    solarix wrote: »
    We are on APS's EPR-6 billing plan which is the net-metering option - much better than the net-billing option.
    Our rate plan is ET-2 (noon to 7pm peak). We used to be on the EC-2 prior to the new solar system as we use a lot of nighttime power cause of our greenhouse (we now have sustainable electricity, water and food) and have on-peak usage of only about 17%. Wish I would have converted to the ET-1 plan (9am to 9pm peak) before they retired it at the end of 2009.
    I have developed my own software for analyzing utility bills and if if anyone in the APS area (Northern Arizona) wants to send me a recent copy of their bill, I'll figure the best plan for them. Our utility - APS makes a ton of extra money from all the people that are still on the standard rate plan. I gain the confidence of new customers by helping them with this. APS will also help them determine the best plan if they would call and ask for it, but APS will not call you and offer you the savings. There are a lot of people in Arizona paying $500/month bills that could be paying $350 just by asking for the right rate plan.

    Yeah we are holding our ET-1 and EPR-6, You being on the ET-2 is of interest to me. Rather than reinvent the wheel, your analysis software may be of interest. We debated being on ET-2 as we have quite a bit of excess peak capacity but are still paying for some off peak. The ET-2 with it's noon to 7PM peak rate seems to make sense for a solar install so that morning production would go towards off peak. I guess the key to that is whether enough noon to 7PM production is available to cover the usage, i.e. can you build enough credits (both peak and off-peak) early in the year to cover the cooling season. Starting Jan 1 with the billing reset, we think that need to analyze at least our hourly production to determine if ET-2 makes sense. The TED will allow us to do that collection.

    Maybe it is a moot point as any excess peak production on EPR-6 gets paid back at $0.0659 per kWh which should cover the the cost of the off peak we purchase $0.05774 rate per kWh on ET-1 summer. The kicker is the service delivery charge, which we hit once during the year in the August bill but I think we have few things going for us now.
    1) we add 2160 watts of Panels around May 1.
    2) Our second old 10 seer Lenox AC unit is being replace with a Trane 17 seer on Jan 11 to match the change out we did last year. (prices are down BTW actually enough to not need any Government rebate). The 2.5 ton Lenox 10 seer uses almost 2X the power that the 3 ton Trane 17 seer. More conservation at work.
    3) We are considering a minor kitchen remodel and the replacement of the electric stove with Nat Gas. Current stove and range hood are broken and I don't want to replace it with Electric but the added cost of running the gas lines is holding me back. Shocking how much the stove uses every day.
    4) we are considering a clothes dryer replacement from electric to Nat Gas as the very last step. Our current dryer is not that old and as a capitalist the wife has an uphill battle on that one.

    PS The Greenie wife insisted added solar thermal as well, last months gas bill was about $16 with 3 therms consumed, probably the minimum bill with all the service fees. The payback is lousy but the happy wife, happy life syndrome kicked in.
  • jcgee88
    jcgee88 Solar Expert Posts: 154 ✭✭
    Re: Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates
    solar_dave wrote: »
    The Greenie wife insisted added solar thermal as well...The payback is lousy but the happy wife, happy life syndrome kicked in.

    I just went through the whole process of selecting a
    high efficiency water heater. We don't use that much
    hot water, there's just three of us, and soon will be
    just two of us when my daughter leaves for college.
    Thus, my goals were to get something green that would
    qualify for the Federal tax credit while not going overboard
    on cost given our modest hot water demand.

    My current solar panels pretty much consume all the
    prime real estate on the roof, plus solar water heating
    was by far the most expensive solution. So, that was
    basically a non-starter for us.

    After looking at tankless, electric air hybrid (GE model),
    natural gas hybrid (fairly new technology from Polaris and
    A.O. Smith), and high efficiency traditional tanked, we
    ended up going with the latter. It is 90% thermal
    efficient, had the lowest cost, and gave us the user
    experience closest to what we are already used to with
    our standard tank water heater. The particular model
    we got was an A.O. Smith Vertex. It has only been
    installed a week, and we like it so far.

    One side note on this...because the prior, 18-year old
    water heater was not failing, we weren't being forced
    to replace it. We were being incented to replace it
    because of the expiring Federal Tax credit. As we were
    moving the old unit out to the street, it leaked rust
    flakes, a quart's worth at least, all along the path. The
    installer looked at me and said, "You're lucky, the tank
    was probably going to start leaking soon." Of course,
    once your water heater starts to fail, you have little
    time to do much research and price shopping for the
    replacement.

    John
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,431 admin
    Re: Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates

    What did the Vertex cost? It looked about a close to perfect for a home gas water heater--but the cost was 2x a regular water heater and only had a 6 year warranty...

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • solar_dave
    solar_dave Solar Expert Posts: 2,397 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates

    I did much the same thing, looked around for a high efficiency gas heater, went to Sears and got a screaming deal on a Energy Star high efficiency model ($650 down from $925), got the solar thermal guy to add it to the receipt which let me take the 30% tax credit on it as a part solar thermal hot water system which has unlimited $$ amount just like PV. I used my appliance tax credit up on the 17 seer AC unit I had replaced earlier.

    Mine was not leaking either but was 13 year old builder model and was acting a bit flaky, literally was shedding flakes into the water.
  • solarix
    solarix Solar Expert Posts: 713 ✭✭
    Re: Looks like I got the last of the big solar rebates

    If your solar array is oriented due south, the ET-1 9am to 9pm rate will give you 17.9 cents/kwhr for 65% of your power production and 5.8 cents for off peak (summer numbers). On the ET-2 plan you get 24.4 cents/6.1 cents but only 35% of your production is on-peak. It is actually beneficial to orient an array toward the SW if you are on the ET-2 plan (except for the summer monsoon clouds being almost always an afternoon phenomenon) - less overall kwhr production but more $ credit.