solar_dave wrote: »
Don't forget about the amount of lead that removed from the environment as well.
russ wrote: »
People posting on climate change generally seem to believe that they have some 'special insight' into the whole thing and if everyone else could just understand as well as they do that all would agree with their point of view.
In reality, 99% plus of those posting have only the vaguest idea of the entire thing (as Bill was pointing out) and most misunderstand much if not all of the topic.
When top flight climate scientists can't even to agree among themselves it seems a bit over the top for the lay person to believe they understand it all.
The biggest names in both pro and con camps are loaded with attention seekers that really add nothing to the entire discussion but like to flap their jaws.
nsaspook wrote: »
Let's not forget that science is not infallible and sometimes the unforeseen can cause damage.
icarus wrote: »
Because I my sat connection issues, I couldn't find anything on your link except the first page. Are you trying to argue that removing lead from Gasoline had "unforeseen damage"?
icarus wrote: »
Merci. Not something I am familiar with,
PS On the subject of gas tanks leaking,, I have heard stories that local retailers often lose a ton of gas before they begin to get a clue. One would think that at the cost of the product people would be more concerned with losing so much!
icarus wrote: »
Record heat in LA this fall?
dwh wrote: »
Really? I hadn't heard that.
icarus wrote: »
My point is, any given weather event is just that,,, weather. Question is, when do weather events become climate?
We generally consider climate changes as taking place on the scale of hundreds or even thousands of years. However, since the early 1990s, a radical shift in the scientific understanding of Earth's climate history has occurred. We now know that that major regional and global climate shifts have occurred in just a few decades or even a single year. The most recent of these shifts occurred just 8200 years ago. If an abrupt climate change of similar magnitude happened today, it would have severe consequences for humans and natural ecosystems. Although scientists consider an abrupt climate change unlikely in the next 100 years, their understanding of the phenomena is still a work-in-progress, and Earth's history shows that such a change could be triggered in just a year or two by natural processes or by human-caused global warming with little warning.
The National Academy of Sciences--the board of scientists established by Congress in 1863 to advise the federal government on scientific matters--compiled a comprehensive report in 2002 entitled, Abrupt Climate Change: Inevitable Surprises. The 244-page report, which contains over 500 references, was written by a team of 59 of the top researchers in climate, and represents the most authoritative source of information about abrupt climate change available. Most of the material that follows was taken from this report.
Ocean and lake sediment data from places such as California, Venezuela, and Antarctica have confirmed that these sudden climate changes affected not just Greenland, but the entire world. During the past 110,000 years, there have been at least 20 such abrupt climate changes. Only one period of stable climate has existed during the past 110,000 years--the 11,000 years of modern climate (the "Holocene" era). "Normal" climate for Earth is the climate of sudden extreme jumps--like a light switch flicking on and off.
As seen in Figure 1, the ice core record showed frequent sudden warmings and coolings of 15° F (8°C) or more. Many of these changes happened in less than 10 years. In one case 11,600 years ago, when Earth emerged from the final phase of the most recent ice age (an event called the Younger Dryas), the Greenland ice core data showed that a 15°F (8°C) warming occurred in less than a decade, accompanied by a doubling of snow accumulation in 3 years. Most of this doubling occurred in a single year.
The historical records shows us that abrupt climate change is not only possible--it is the normal state of affairs. The present warm, stable climate is a rare anomaly. It behooves us to learn as much as we can about the climate system so that we may be able to predict when the next abrupt shift in climate will come. Until we know better when this might happen, it would be wise to stop pouring so much carbon dioxide into the air. While it currently appears that an abrupt shut down of the MOC and subsequent abrupt climate change event are not likely this century, we need to know more. In the words of Dr. Wally Broecker, "the climate system is an angry beast, and we are poking it."
timsjs wrote: »
@Russ - In reguards to your personal belief in"AGW", what does the "A" stand for? My question is: Is Global Warming significantly impacted by man's activity or is it cyclic? If anyone can answer this, where is the scientific data to back the answer up?
BB. wrote: »
Mars ice pack has been reducing recently too: