Cheap source for panels?

EAdamsEAdams Solar Expert Posts: 34
I am looking for 1-2 25-60w panels to add to my small array of (4) 15w panels. I am wanting just 1-2 cheap panels to suppliment what I have. I have very little $$ to spend so I don't expect them to be high-end panels. I'd take some used panels if anyone is upgrading also...

Comments

  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,007 admin
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    You might want to list the city/town where you are located... Shipping could be worth more than the panels.

    Check around the Craig's Lists for your area (if there is one). Once in a while there are deals to be found.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • EAdamsEAdams Solar Expert Posts: 34
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    Mayfield, KY 42066 (Western part of Ky)

    BB. wrote: »
    You might want to list the city/town where you are located... Shipping could be worth more than the panels.

    Check around the Craig's Lists for your area (if there is one). Once in a while there are deals to be found.

    -Bill
  • crewzercrewzer Registered Users, Solar Expert Posts: 1,832 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    If you scrape together the $$, this Kyocera 135 W "12 V" module is an exceptional bargain at just under $3/W:

    http://store.solar-electric.com/kyso130wa12v.html

    HTH,
    Jim / crewzer
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    that is a good price. i guess it's been awhile since i looked, but i guess prices have dropped?
  • DeltaFoxDeltaFox Solar Expert Posts: 27
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    Solar Panel
    Brand Watt Min.
    Quantity* US$/Unit US$/
    Watt Solar Panel
    Vendor
    NEW!! Complete Systems
    EPV Solar
    50
    368
    $92.50
    $1.85
    Aten Solar

    EPV Solar
    42
    92
    $84.00
    $2.00
    Aten Solar

    EPV Solar
    42
    184
    $84.84
    $2.02
    Aten Solar

    EPV Solar
    42
    138
    $86.10
    $2.05
    Aten Solar

    EPV Solar
    42
    64
    $96.59
    $2.30
    Aten Solar

    REC
    210
    30
    $509.97
    $2.43
    The Solar BiZ

    REC
    220
    30
    $533.97
    $2.43
    The Solar BiZ

    BP Solar
    175
    60
    $424.97
    $2.43
    The Solar BiZ

    BP Solar
    190
    60
    $460.97
    $2.43
    The Solar BiZ

    REC
    225
    2
    $549.00
    $2.44
    Sun Electronics

    REC
    215
    2
    $546.00
    $2.54
    Sun Electronics

    REC
    220
    2
    $558.00
    $2.54
    Sun Electronics

    BP Solar
    175
    40
    $447.97
    $2.56
    The Solar BiZ

    REC
    210
    30
    $543.90
    $2.59
    BeyondOilSolar

    REC
    215
    30
    $556.85
    $2.59
    BeyondOilSolar

    REC
    220
    30
    $569.80
    $2.59
    BeyondOilSolar

    REC
    225
    30
    $569.80
    $2.59
    BeyondOilSolar

    REC
    230
    30
    $595.70
    $2.59
    BeyondOilSolar

    BrightWatts
    120
    2
    $312.00
    $2.60
    DmSolar

    Evergreen
    195
    2
    $522.60
    $2.68
    Sun Electronics

    REC
    205
    20
    $564.00
    $2.75
    Wholesale Solar

    REC
    210
    1
    $578.00
    $2.75
    Wholesale Solar

    REC
    215
    1
    $592.00
    $2.75
    Wholesale Solar

    REC
    220
    1
    $605.00
    $2.75
    Wholesale Solar

    REC
    225
    1
    $619.00
    $2.75
    Wholesale Solar

    Evergreen
    195
    28
    $561.57
    $2.88
    Sun Electronics

    REC
    210
    30
    $607.00
    $2.89
    Solar Panel Store

    Schott Solar
    220
    30
    $635.80
    $2.89
    Affordable Solar

    REC
    220
    30
    $635.80
    $2.89
    Backwoods Solar

    REC
    220
    30
    $636.00
    $2.89
    Solar Panel Store

    BrightWatts
    100
    10
    $298.00
    $2.98
    DmSolar

    REC
    220
    1
    $658.00
    $2.99
    Backwoods Solar

    Mitsubishi Solar
    175
    20
    $523.25
    $2.99
    Affordable Solar

    BP Solar
    180
    20
    $568.00
    $2.99
    Affordable Solar

    BP Solar
    195
    20
    $583.00
    $2.99
    Affordable Solar

    Schott Solar
    290
    20
    $867.10
    $2.99
    Affordable Solar

    Kyocera
    210
    1
    $643.00
    $3.06
    AltE
    REC
    220
    10
    $675.00
    $3.07
    Alter Systems

    Kyocera
    205
    20
    $635.50
    $3.10
    AltE
    Kyocera
    135
    20
    $421.20
    $3.12
    AltE
    Kyocera
    180
    1
    $565.20
    $3.14
    AltE
    Evergreen
    200
    28
    $628.00
    $3.14
    AltE

    REC
    210
    8
    $670.00
    $3.19
    Solar Panel Store

    REC
    220
    8
    $702.00
    $3.19
    Solar Panel Store

    BrightWatts
    155
    4
    $496.00
    $3.20
    DmSolar

    BrightWatts
    160
    20
    $512.00
    $3.20
    DmSolar

    BrightWatts
    170
    20
    $544.00
    $3.20
    DmSolar

    Sharp
    216
    48
    $708.48
    $3.28
    Solar Panel Store

    Sharp
    175
    1
    $594.41
    $3.40
    Infinigi

    Solar World
    175
    1
    $625.00
    $3.57
    Backwoods Solar

    Evergreen
    180
    28
    $648.00
    $3.60
    Alter Systems

    Evergreen
    195
    28
    $702.00
    $3.60
    Alter Systems

    Evergreen
    200
    28
    $720.00
    $3.60
    Alter Systems

    Evergreen
    205
    28
    $738.00
    $3.60
    Alter Systems

    Sharp
    216
    1
    $809.74
    $3.75
    Infinigi

    Sharp
    80
    1
    $432.79
    $3.97
    Infinigi

    Sharp
    198
    1
    $786.00
    $3.97
    Infinigi

    Sharp
    224
    1
    $888.35
    $3.97
    Infinigi

    XC3i
    85
    1
    $369.00
    $4.34
    Discount Solar

    Kyocera
    135
    2
    $625.00
    $4.63
    Backwoods Solar

    Mitsubishi
    125
    1
    $595.00
    $4.76
    Backwoods Solar

    * Minimum Quantity of solar panels to purchase at this price
  • DeltaFoxDeltaFox Solar Expert Posts: 27
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    BB sorry for the take up space and the mess.
  • WindsunWindsun Solar Expert Posts: 1,164 ✭✭
    Re: Cheap source for panels?
    DeltaFox wrote: »
    BB sorry for the take up space and the mess.

    Not to mention the fact that you listed most of our competitors, but did list any of our prices...
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    i believe windsun meant to say,

    {Not to mention the fact that you listed most of our competitors, but did NOT list any of our prices... }

    i want to know why you just say you're sorry to bb when we all have to endure this redundantly long list?
  • gp_wagp_wa Registered Users Posts: 15
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    First I've heard of these...

    http://www.atensolar.com/m5_view_item.html?m5:item=SOL182W-16

    Very interesting :D
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,007 admin
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    Gee... I was not involved in this at all--and I still get blamed. :roll:

    OK--I don't speak for our host. And what I did below is just NAWS special's pricing from their Home Page. I don't speak for NAWS, don't price for NAWS, and don't have a clue on shipping/insurance costs.

    And, when I do list pricing for NAWS from their website for when people ask for specific products--I try to just round it to the next highest $5-$10-$100 as prices change change weekly for some popular/commodity items.

    As always, please contact NAWS directly for current pricing information... Shipping, Insurance, and Taxes (no sales taxes in Arizona for solar?) may be a significant portion of the total costs. Always look at the delivered on your door step pricing (as well as vendor reputation and support) before placing any order.
    [FONT=Fixedsys]Brand       Watts MinQty $/Panel    $/watt   LotPrice
    =====================================================
    Kyocera     205    20    $550.00    $2.68    $11,000
    Kyocera     210    20    $560.90    $2.67    $11,218
    KyoceraJbox 130    20    $440.00    $3.38     $8,800
    Kyocera     135    20    $392.65    $2.91     $7,853
    SolarWorld  175    20    $530.00    $3.03    $10,600
    SolarWorld  230    20    $678.00    $2.95    $13,560
    Kyocera     185    20    $499.95    $2.70     $9,999
    Kyocera      65     4    $329.75    $5.07     $1,319
    Power UP     40     1    $239.00    $5.98       $239[/FONT]
    
    Again--Nobody is responsible for the above but me. And this is not in anyway a quote or an offer to sell by NAWS (or anyone else). And these prices may be "obsolete" the moment I hit the Submit Reply button.

    -Bill "I didn't to it" B.
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,007 admin
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    Regarding the "Solyndra" solar panels (glass tubes with amorphous interiors?) posted above by GP_WA:

    www.solyndra.com (company website)
    PDF Spec. Down load (from pvpower.com)

    Price wise (from website in gp_wa's post)--$4.46 per Watt...

    :confused: Interesting packaging concept.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • gp_wagp_wa Registered Users Posts: 15
    Re: Cheap source for panels?
    BB. wrote: »
    Price wise (from website in gp_wa's post)--$4.46 per Watt...

    :confused: Interesting packaging concept.

    -Bill
    The pricing is deceiving. Just like an evacuated tube solar collector, these units have a lower peak output, but will produce that peak output for a much longer portion of the day, so for a given peak output rating, those should produce substantially more energy over the course of a day than a flat panel.

    They claim about twice the overall output per square meter of roof coverage. I don't know the real numbers, and therefore how misleading the price is, but the concept seems sound.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,007 admin
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    I am not quite sure I buy their numbers... Typically, amorphous/thin film panels are roughly 1/2 as efficient per sq. as mono/poly crystalline silicon panels.

    Also, if you look at the website pictures, some 1/3 of the panel is "air space".

    And, if you use the photo shopped picture of their mounting--The angled (at latitude) vs flat mounting will cost energy to in cosine error (the company is in Fremont CA--using San Francisco data--the difference between the two for 1kW of panels is 1257/1446 kWH per year or 0.87 reduction)...

    So, if one is just looking at wattage per sq. and both are mounted flat to the roof--1/2*2/3=1/3 the sq. eff of a "flat crystalline collector)... Or it would seem that a grid ~3x the area of crystalline collectors would be needed for the tubular collectors (really rough back of the envelope calculations). Granted, there will be some reflective energy from the roof--but I am not sure that it will be a huge amount (10%?).

    From their data sheets, comparing with a vanilla 4 year old+ BP Solar Mono Crystalline panel and a new Evergreen panel:

    182 watts per 1.82m*1.08m = 93 Watts per sq. meter
    175 watt BP Solar per 1.593m*0.79m = 139 watts per sq. meter
    205 watt Evergreen per 65"*37.5" 0.00064516 sq meter/in = 130 watts per sq. meter

    I wonder how the the Solyndra are rated... That seems to be a very high number for a thin film panel... Looking at the California approved solar panel database, Solyndra is listed and has much less of a PTC derating than other typical panels (182 watts STC, 171 Watts PTC--others are almost 20 watts less). Perhaps it is real.
    Vacuum tube solar collectors are more efficient for high temperature water production because of their insulation qualities.

    Yes, both tubular designed would have some what "flatter" production over the day vs a "solid" panel--until the angle to the sun is such that the "tube" next door shades it neighbor. At that point, the flat and tube collectors would then track proportionally to the sun.

    The interesting item is that they don't require bolting to the roof... If they have sign-off from engineers and building departments -- good for them. I find that a bit hard to believe in "earthquake" country... We pretty much are required to have everything bolted down. Wonder how they would justify "floating" and electrical connections (doesn't code require electrical conduit to be fasten every X number of feet?).

    :confused: Interesting...

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • gp_wagp_wa Registered Users Posts: 15
    Re: Cheap source for panels?
    BB. wrote: »
    182 watts per 1.82m*1.08m = 93 Watts per sq. meter
    175 watt BP Solar per 1.593m*0.79m = 139 watts per sq. meter
    205 watt Evergreen per 65"*37.5" 0.00064516 sq meter/in = 130 watts per sq. meter
    Which then begs the question, what is the flat collector yielding when the tubular one is at the edge of its full potential sweep?
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,007 admin
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    Should be roughly the Sine of the angle off of 90 degrees for the flat panel...

    Looking at the corporate video -- it appears that the air gap between tubes is at least 50%.

    I just don't see how with thin film technology with 50% (or less) stacking factor can generate roughly 93/139=0.67 of the energy of a fairly high efficiency mono-crystalline panel at nearer to 90+% stacking of square cells...

    I very well could be wrong too. :confused: Don't know.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • gp_wagp_wa Registered Users Posts: 15
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    1) From what I've read, the thin film efficiency has made a lot of gains recently. I think the panels in question claim at least 12%.

    2) Also keep in mind that some of the sunlight that passes between the tubes is reflected back by the surface below to the lower half of the tubes, and I suspect they're using a light colored roof to get their numbers.
  • nielniel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    bb,
    for the record, nobody blamed you for what deltafox did, but he dragged you into it by saying sorry only to you. nobody is upset with you in the least.
  • BB.BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 32,007 admin
    Re: Cheap source for panels?

    Just teasing. ;)

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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