24......2 volt trojan L16 Xantrex xw I/C and 2 80 600's

mosierpat
mosierpat Registered Users Posts: 13 ✭✭
I want to upgrade the battery bank from 24 - 2 volt trojans to something way better for free...!  Can I get it in Lithium please?
Ok, so that wont happen but I'm looking for best choice upgrade.  schneider xw Chg/inv and dual 80-600's   backup generator , need new batteries. 

Comments

  • Estragon
    Estragon Registered Users Posts: 4,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What "better" are you looking for.  There are pros and cons to all the various options.  None are "best" for every application (and budget).
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
  • mosierpat
    mosierpat Registered Users Posts: 13 ✭✭
    agreed.    lithium vs agm vs wet cell at various voltages that work with the listed equipment.   Im still in a semi-fledgling state of my research
  • mosierpat
    mosierpat Registered Users Posts: 13 ✭✭
    The owner is hands on for sure, knows how to work a hydrometer and add water.  He is tired of it so less maintenance is on his list i am guessing, but he is conditioned to work hard at it.  Looks like the money is there for lithium but it has to live a long time for the added expense. some sort of proof, or knowledge of the best way to go.  This is where my experience tapers a bit.  
  • Estragon
    Estragon Registered Users Posts: 4,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Lithium really hasn't been used long enough by enough people off-grid for there to be enough real-world experience to say with confidence that cycle-life claims etc are or aren't close to reality imho.  

    One thing to consider that isn't often mentioned for off-grid is while lithium can be cycled deeper (and is actually happier at partial SOC), when it gets low, it's lights out.  With L.A., you can get away with the odd deeper discharge in a pinch.  Having 50% in reserve by design can keep the lights on when the genny won't start.  With a lithium tool, you can just swap a new battery in if it dies in the middle of drilling a hole.  They don't seem to give much warning. 

    Lithiums also like temps humans like.  Too hot, research I've read from E.V. applications suggests significant cycle life reduction.  Too cold and charge rates need to be throttled and/or battery heated.

    When the time comes for me, I'm sort of considering whether some sort of hybrid lithium/LA bank could work.  A smallish lithium segment would handle most day-to-day requirements, with a mostly floating LA bank in reserve.
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
  • icarus
    icarus Solar Expert Posts: 5,436 ✭✭✭✭
    Always try to consider in your economic analysis the value of the scrap batteries in the recycling market.  FLA have. Considerable scrap value, somewhere ~10-20% of initial cost.  Not an insignificant number when   Trying to figure out net lifetime costs.  Tony
  • Photowhit
    Photowhit Solar Expert Posts: 6,002 ✭✭✭✭✭
    mosierpat said:
    I want to upgrade the battery bank from 24 - 2 volt trojans to something way better for free...!  Can I get it in Lithium please?

    ...need new batteries. 
    Not sure if I can follow you, you speak in the 3rd person later on...

    You  say you need new batteries, I guess you have seen a reduction of usable capacity?

    Have you done maintenance and/or corrective equalizing? How old are the batteries? Are you running a balanced system?

    While there are always 'something new' on the horizon. If they are functioning, I might consider taking the time to analyze your system and perhaps limp the batteries through for a couple years.  I'm reading a lot about new tech coming on line soon. Dyson introducing a new electric car with solid state batteries. As well as several other solid state batteries in the works. If nothing else this should put pressure on the current lithium manufacturers to reduce the expense.
    Home system 4000 watt (Evergreen) array standing, with 2 Midnite Classic Lites,  Midnite E-panel, Magnum MS4024, Prosine 1800(now backup) and Exeltech 1100(former backup...lol), 660 ah 24v Forklift battery(now 10 years old). Off grid for 20 years (if I include 8 months on a bicycle).
    - Assorted other systems, pieces and to many panels in the closet to not do more projects.
  • aksala
    aksala Registered Users Posts: 57 ✭✭
    Regardless of length of time in service, it's not so much the battery as the warranty and whether the company is around to service the warranty if something goes wrong. Right? 

    Anyway, I am off-grid in Alaska and using 3 AES Discover batteries running a rather standard household and consuming approx. 12kwh daily on average. I can tell you I was immediately impressed with the AES batteries doing what was promised with regards to their internal BMS and the Conext XW 6848. Self configuring. No maintenance. No off-gassing. Less space required and mounted on my garage wall. No worries about PSOC. Fast charging. If one battery goes bad, easily bypass and move on. RMA? I haven't had to but knowing I can simply remove a battery, ship it off and then replace it without worry is some peace of mind. Oh, need more storage? Add another battery. 

    In my real world use thus far, on severely cloudy days now I am generally down to about 55% DOD at around 5pm and I run my generator, 8KW pulling about 6.5KW to charge the batteries back up in about 2 hours and I'm good again for 24 hours. If I wasn't home I could likely run the house for a bit more than 48 hours with the batteries dropping to about 90% DOD. The beauty is, they can do that.

    At some point in the near future I'll have a generator with the AGS plumbed in, so I can leave the house without worry, as long as the genny starts appropriately. This is winter time I'm talking about. Summer here is not a problem as I have 7kw on the roof into a MPPT 80 600 which generally charges up the bank within 3 hours.