Choosing the right plan with APS

Misha_1971

We are in the middle of getting our solar system installed and looking into which billing options might be best.

We've been to the APS website and see that there are two plans: EPR-2 and EPR-6. It's not too clear which one is most appropriate for us.

Our system is going to handle about 65% of our usage, based on estimates. We're currently on the noon-7 peak time plan with APS. We'd greatly appreciate any information about the difference between EPR-2 and EPR-6 and suggestions about selecting our rate plans.

Thanks in advance.

solar_dave

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

I think most everyone uses EPR-6

EPR6 provides retail credit and EPR-2 provides wholesale credit.

Misha_1971

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

Thanks @Solar_Dave. That explains part of the difference. It looked like EPR-6 only gives you your credit at the end of the year, but EPR-2 (on the APS website) doesn't specify. Do you know if EPR-2 pays on a different schedule.

HX_Guy

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

Funny I was just looking at this on the APS site as well.

As mentioned, the EPR-2 is a net billing plan, so they give you credit on your bill (sounds like on a monthly basis) for any excess kWh your system produces.
They have a few different TOU plans it seems but they all more or less give you 2.9¢ per kWh of excess.

The EPR-6 plan is net metering, so you accumulate kWh credits that would then be applied to next month's usage if say you don't generate enough kWh that next month. At the end of the year, if you have any kWh credits remaining, they pay you at about the same 2.9¢ per kWh.

Personally I think the EPR-6 is better as the kWh credits are worth a lot more than the cash credit. On-peak kWh price in the winter is 19.8¢ and summer 24.4¢ for example, and if your system can take care of your on-peak usage and you just have to pay for the 6¢/kWh off-peak time, then you'd really see a good reduction in your bill.

HX_Guy

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

I've got a quick question as well...

Anyone know what EPR-6 plans are available? On the link I posted above, it says TOU on-peak, TOU off-peak and then "other plans". What are these other plans available with EPR-6? For our system, I don't want to do TOU, just straight regular plan, is that available with net metering?

solarix

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

The difference is that the EPR-2, EPR-6 are billing plans (determines how you pay), while the others (E-12, ET-2, EC-2) are rate plans (determines what you pay).
While the regular E-12 plan sounds good as the fixed monthly fee is only about $9, the TOU plans ($18/month) are often still better as the nighttime rates are so low and you are generating solar during the day so the high daytime rate doesn't matter. If you generate above about 90% of your usage, then the regular plan is usually best, below that, the TOU plan is best.

HX_Guy

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

Thanks Solarix, so you can have a regular E-12 plan with solar? That's what I wasn't sure of, I thought you had to have an EPR plan. Do you still get net metering with the E-12 so that generated power not used is "banked"?

Misha_1971

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

Thank you @Solarix. That helps.

solar_dave

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

I think ,9 AM to 9PM TOU is about done and they re gonna drop that plan. I am just bridging my time and the next step is the flat rate PLAN

solarix

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

Yes, definitely do the EPR-6 plan to get net metering, and also choose the E-12 rate plan to get the lowest monthly service fee. You do both at the same time.
The ET-1 rate plan has TOU rates from 9am to 9pm (weekdays only) and is absolutely great with solar cause virtually all your solar generation is then on-peak. Of course, it is so good the utility quit offering it and only those that already have it can stay on it.
Now APS is offering a new plan (not available yet in all areas) called Super-Peak. During the 3 afternoon summer hours in June through August, the on-peak rate is - get this - 45cents/kWh! Super cheap rates the rest of the day and year though. Turn your A/C on during the afternoon and they are going to put a bullet through your head!

HX_Guy

Re: Choosing the right plan with APS

Make that 46.517¢! Crazy thing is that it's not even that much cheaper at all the rest of the time! So during non "super peak", which would be 12-3 and then 6-7 (3-6 is the super peak period), it's 24.477¢/kWh which is the same as the normal TOU plan. The only advantage is off-peak, but you're talking about 5.517¢ vs 6.118¢...it's like half a cent difference.

I'm hoping my plan to use the standard plan with net metering works out.

elvis1991

So guys I just got a house with solar panels and im gonna live there just with my girlfriend what plan you guys think is best for me

solar_dave

elvis1991 said:

So guys I just got a house with solar panels and im gonna live there just with my girlfriend what plan you guys think is best for me

It depends on how much solar you have I would think.  The ET-1 (9AM to 9PM peak Mon-Fri.) is now closed and only grandfathered accounts (like me) are still on it. If you do EPR-6 with the current TOU plan (time advantage) ET-2 seems the likely rate.  While the on peak  rate seems pretty high, with solar you will bank kWh early in the year which can then be drawn down in the hot months. You will also be generating power when the highest rates are in effect.  On APS EPR-6 the generation is only banked within the TOU that it was generated, so you will always have to buy off-peak power, so expect a bill. The only way around that is the E-12 rate plan which is your standard tiered rate kind of plan.  https://www.aps.com/library/rates/e-12.pdf  It could work if you can keep your peak monthly usage out of the top tiers.

So we have some really peak days here in the summer, i think our greatest peak day was 131 kWh a couple years ago (the off griders are now screaming). We only generate about 75 kWh daily at best from our 12.5 kWh system. With the kWh bank system we didn't pay any service delivery (same kWh fee 24/7)  till Aug. and only paid for on peak generation a little in Aug and some in Sept. We are still catching up on Service Delivery charges.

Please remember when looking at the above numbers we have two 3 ton Heat Pumps units on the house, a 30,000 BTU mini split with 3 head units in the shop/office that may or may not be run often. We also have a swimming pool on a VFD, electric clothes dryer, electric oven (of course not run much in summer) and 2 plug-in electric extended range cars. Nat Gas for stove top, back up hot water heat, and rarely fireplace.

Some of your choices will be life style, i.e doing laundry off peak, keeping the house warmer in the daytime.  Some of your choices should be conservation, cheaper to save a watt than generate that same watt. Lots of conservation threads around here. I think at our next replacement cycle the electric dryer is goner.  Been really considering Solar DC direct drive for the pool pump, leave the VFD in place as a backup/backwash unit.

sjslms

Arizona... jun,24th,2017...We started with solar in nov so this is our first year. Jan Feb march we owed aps in off peak hours ,but banked on peak time...We are on the EPR-6 plan it looks like. We bank  more during peak ours than off peak hours. The last 3 bills we banked over 1500 kwhrs on peak total so far and off peak has just over 700 kwh banked..total now.  You still have to pay taxes and fees.  Would it be better to switch to EPR2.???
  I wanted to do epr6 first this year then epr 2 next year to compare, Now with the new aps regulations coming out I would be grandfathered in,but would I be able to change plans and still be grandfathered in on the rates today if i wanted to try the other plan later??  Thankx for any help.