replacing batteries

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  • Cariboocoot
    Cariboocoot Banned Posts: 17,615 ✭✭✭
    #32
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    Re: replacing batteries
    castilloj wrote: »
    What should refloat set point be?
    Also equalize set point and float time period?
    Also is there anything I need to change with m mppt60?
    Or use their normal setting using the dip switches?

    Thanks

    Normally refloat is 25 Volts and Float time is 8 hours (the first returns to Float instead of going to Bulk if the battery Voltage goes below that point, the second is how long it tries to maintain Float before going back to Bulk).
    Equalization should be 31 Volts. Do NOT allow automatic equalization. Trojan recommends you check SG on each cell and equalize only if necessary (one or more cells lower by 0.010). 1 hour EQ, recheck SG, repeat until no improvement is seen (pain in the neck, but it works).

    You have a MS charge controller, right? You may have to 'play' with the Absorb time setting and re-adjust it periodically according to use. Unfortunately they do not time-adjust Absorb according to Bulk time. Your best bet is to actually time the Bulk stage yourself (from when charging begins to when Absorb Voltage is reached) and set the Absorb time as close as possible to that.

    MS View software allows you to do custom settings which may be more suitable for your system. But I have never programmed an MS controller so you'll need input from some of those forum members who use them.
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  • SolaRevolution
    SolaRevolution Solar Expert Posts: 410 ✭✭
    #33
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    Re: replacing batteries
    Cariboocoot wrote: »
    You have a MS charge controller, right? You may have to 'play' with the Absorb time setting and re-adjust it periodically according to use. Unfortunately they do not time-adjust Absorb according to Bulk time. Your best bet is to actually time the Bulk stage yourself (from when charging begins to when Absorb Voltage is reached) and set the Absorb time as close as possible to that.

    MS View software allows you to do custom settings which may be more suitable for your system. But I have never programmed an MS controller so you'll need input from some of those forum members who use them.

    BTW; There are no dip switch accessable presets in the Tristar CC with settings acceptable to Rolls Surette. If you don't have MS view you cannot follow the Rolls/Surrette charging guidelines.

    Not a problem with your new Trojans.:D

    -Alex Aragon
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  • castilloj
    castilloj Solar Expert Posts: 208 ✭
    #34
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    Re: replacing batteries

    So I connected 4 of my rolls batteries again, the Trojans t105 did not give enough power thru the night.
    I jus checked the readings on the rolls using a refractometer.

    Battery 1
    + 1.25 ,1.25 ,under 1.10 near water line

    Battery 2
    +1.34 , 1.33 , 1.28 - boiling allot

    Battery 3

    +1.25 ,1.25 , 1.26 -

    Battery 4

    1.26 , 1.25 ,1.20

    Now for the rolls what settings should I set on the outback?
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
    #35
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    Re: replacing batteries

    Shorted cell in battery #1?

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • castilloj
    castilloj Solar Expert Posts: 208 ✭
    #36
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    Re: replacing batteries

    Yes It's a bad cell.
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
    #37
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    Re: replacing batteries

    That shorted cell (guessing) will cause the rest of the cells/batteries to overcharge like crazy. Even replacing that one battery with something with roughly the same AH rating is better than leaving that battery in the string (at least until you can do something permanent).

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • Ralph Day
    Ralph Day Solar Expert Posts: 1,019 ✭✭✭✭
    #38
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    Re: replacing batteries

    I agree with Bill.
    A neighbour had a shorted cell in both strings in his bank...ended up toasting the bank. Overcharged. 3 out of 16 L16's were somewhat usable with questionable life left.

    Ralph
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  • castilloj
    castilloj Solar Expert Posts: 208 ✭
    #39
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    Re: replacing batteries

    All the rest of my s600 have a bad cell. Could I use A t105? Also is it possible to wire a s600 that the terminal split open.
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  • inetdog
    inetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    #40
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    Re: replacing batteries
    castilloj wrote: »
    All the rest of my s600 have a bad cell. Could I use A t105? Also is it possible to wire a s600 that the connector broke?


    If your Charge Controller allows for custom settings, dropping all of the voltages roughly 2 volts to allow for a shorted cell or somewhat less to allow for a cell with unknown damage might allow you to keep running and not damage the rest of your batteries too badly in the short run while you get replacement(s).
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
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  • Blackcherry04
    Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    #41
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    Re: replacing batteries

    Here is a thread on a repair : I have just plug tapped then and used a bolt before, Hanger screws should be available also.

    http://forum.solar-electric.com/showthread.php?15933-Broken-battery-terminal&highlight=broken+battery+connector

    How old are those batteries ?? Odd everyone has a shorted cell.
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,439 admin
    #42
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    Re: replacing batteries

    Can you access the cell to cell bus bar?

    perhaps you can jumper the cell from another battery. This can be done with some forklift batteries.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • inetdog
    inetdog Solar Expert Posts: 3,123 ✭✭✭✭
    #43
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    Re: replacing batteries
    BB. wrote: »
    Can you access the cell to cell bus bar?

    perhaps you can jumper the cell from another battery. This can be done with some forklift batteries.

    -Bill

    If the cell is shorted rather than high-resistance, you will need to cut its bus bar, or else leave the failed battery untouched and add the tapped additional cell to one end of the string.
    SMA SB 3000, old BP panels.
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  • castilloj
    castilloj Solar Expert Posts: 208 ✭
    #44
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    Re: replacing batteries

    They are a about 2 years old.
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  • castilloj
    castilloj Solar Expert Posts: 208 ✭
    #45
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    Re: replacing batteries

    Also is there a How To Guide to do this with s600 batteries?
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  • Blackcherry04
    Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    #46
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    Re: replacing batteries
    castilloj wrote: »
    Also is there a How To Guide to do this with s600 batteries?
    What are you trying to do ?? Repair a broken connector or remove a cell from the buss ??

    You know the Warranty is 7 years ( First 24 months replacement, next 60 months prorated ) on them ?? I am not so sure that with the proper EQ' ing that they could not be revived. Sounds like they have been dogged, but If your pulling them that low, I am not sure you ever were recharging them completely based on your description. That one low cell is not a good sign.
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  • castilloj
    castilloj Solar Expert Posts: 208 ✭
    #47
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    Re: replacing batteries

    I would like to try and remove cell from the buss.

    and i think the warranty would not apply to me because of the undercharging.
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  • Blackcherry04
    Blackcherry04 Solar Expert Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭
    #48
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    Re: replacing batteries
    castilloj wrote: »
    I would like to try and remove cell from the buss.

    and i think the warranty would not apply to me because of the undercharging.
    I left you a post , but on second thought, not knowing your skills It might be to risky for you . You never know what you might end up with.
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  • castilloj
    castilloj Solar Expert Posts: 208 ✭
    #49
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    Re: replacing batteries

    hi guys, so im still waiting for my batteries to clear customs in haiti. so i have a 48 v outback inverter waiting for my 8 trojan L16H batteries. I was also wondering if someone would recommend some solar panels for my setup? Ived been looking at sunelec looking fr cheap non UL rated panels. i just dont know which? and how many should i get to keep my system running.
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  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    #50
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    Re: replacing batteries

    in general you'd want a 10% charge rate to the batteries, but pvs are rated for stc wattage values which aren't realistic values. find what it would be for your setup using the stc wattage and then just add another 29.88% minimally to it. also remember that volts x amps = watts.

    of course for 48v you'd need at least 144 cells in series at a minimum going by 36 cells per 12v pv or 72 cells per 24v pv. today's pvs also have odd numbers of cells which 60 cells is a common number. to get at least 144 cells in series with 60 celled pvs you'd need 3 60 celled pvs in series for 180 cells in series total. you would want an mppt cc to optimize the current to the batteries as voltages will go higher than nominal multiples of 36 celled pvs in series. these 36 cell multiples would be 4 36 celled pvs (12v each) in series or 2 72 celled pvs (24v each) in series. odds are you'll need more series strings paralleled to get the current you'd need.

    it is a bit much for us to compute your needs utilizing every pv configuration available so you have some homework to do there.

    as to who you buy from that is also your choice and don't forget that this forum is sponsored by northern arizona wind & sun and it would be appropriate for you to check them out first.
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  • castilloj
    castilloj Solar Expert Posts: 208 ✭
    #51
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    Re: replacing batteries

    I was just informed that i can buy 9 Helios 250w panels here in haiti for $550 each. any reviews on those panels?
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