Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

:-( Is this a world wide thing, or is it just here in Canada?
In the last couple of weeks, house wire (14/2 etc) has DOUBLED!
The standard 75 metre, (250 foot) roll went from $38.99, to $86.99.
The 150 metre went from $86.99, to $184.99!
Thieves are actually climbing up on church roofs to steal the copper roof flashing.
Standard copper pipe used in house construction has also more than doubled.
I'm told that come October, there will be great difficulty getting copper at any price.
What's going on?????
Wayne

Comments

  • Brock
    Brock Solar Expert Posts: 639 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    I don't know. I bought 100 feet of #4 about two weeks ago and it was $.79 a foot. The guy cutting the wire asked me if I knew the price was going up tomorrow, I just look at him confused, he then said all their prices were about doubling. Apparently the other large chain home store near by already raised their rates. He said they had a big run on wire and were literally out of all 12-x and 14-x in stock and they usually stock a LOT of wire. He thought he heard something out some South American copper mine (one of the largest in the world) shutting down for labor dispute reasons but wasn’t sure. Sure enough the next day I happened to be getting something else at the same store and the same wire was now $1.49 a foot. I should have bought more...
    3kw solar PV, 4 LiFePO4 100a, xw 6048, Honda eu2000i, iota DLS-54-13, Tesla 3, Leaf, Volt, 4 ton horizontal geothermal, grid tied - Green Bay, WI
  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    i had trouble trying to get info from home depot or lowes to see current prices, but i did try looking up metal prices in general and it showed copper had jumped at least 40% since the beginning of april of this year and had peaked at about $4.00/lb from an april start of $2.44/lb. yes i'd say it's more than just canada. i wonder what the hub bub is myself. any wall street wizards know what's going on for sure?
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,431 admin
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    Down in the lower 48, much of our construction materials have been purchased up by China (starting in 2004 or so, wire, steel, cement, etc.)... That plus a relatively good economy has been pushing up prices (good ol' supply and demand). That, plus now fuel prices (cement and other materials need a lot of fuel to refine/make too), the fun never ends.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    read something in a tech mag about harder to get it etc.. cant remember. sorry this isnt helpful ;)
    i also heard a couple yrs ago that metal roofing is going up to (or has). i know plywood has seen something like a doubling of prices over the last few yrs. i havent done anything useful around the house in a couple yrs so im not really current on material costs. hell my wife says even food is very expensive now. definitely inflationary times peppered by lots of fears, rational or otherwise eh?
  • Patman3
    Patman3 Solar Expert Posts: 62 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    I don't think there is any "copper shortage", it's just traders bidding the futures price up, just like gold, silver, platinum, etc. Once stuff goes up, it's real hard for it to come down. Gold was at $700/oz, now it's back to $630. I watch the numbers sometimes on channel CNBC, copper is displayed there also.
  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    hmm. i'm not sure if i'm remembering right ba, but didn't he artificially raise the price of silver years back?
  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,431 admin
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    Google around for the Hunt Brothers + Silver...:

    http://www.buyandhold.com/bh/en/education/history/2000/hunt_bros.html
    In 1973, the Hunt family of Texas, possibly the richest family in America at the time, decided to buy precious metals as a hedge against inflation. Gold could not be held by private citizens at that time, so the Hunts began to buy silver in enormous quantity.

    In 1979 the sons of patriarch H.L. Hunt, Nelson Bunker and William Herbert, together with some wealthy Arabs, formed a silver pool. In a short period of time they had amassed more than 200 million ounces of silver, equivalent to half the world's deliverable supply.

    When the Hunt's had begun accumulating silver back in 1973 the price was in the $1.95 / ounce range. Early in '79, the price was about $5. Late '79 / early '80 the price was in the $50's, peaking at $54.

    Once the silver market was cornered, outsiders joined the chase but a combination of changed trading rules on the New York Metals Market (COMEX) and the intervention of the Federal Reserve put an end to the game. The price began to slide, culminating in a 50% one-day decline on March 27, 1980 as the price plummeted from $21.62 to $10.80.

    The collapse of the silver market meant countless losses for speculators. The Hunt brothers declared bankruptcy. By 1987 their liabilities had grown to nearly $2.5 billion against assets of $1.5 billion. In August of 1988 the Hunts were convicted of conspiring to manipulate the market.

    John Galt:

    http://www.atlasshrugged.tv/
    Who is John Galt?
    "He said he would stop the motor of the world... and he did. But who is John Galt? A destroyer or a liberator? Why does he fight his battle, not against his enemies, but against those who need him most? Why does he fight his hardest battle against the woman he loves?"

    With this acclaimed work and its immortal query, "Who is John Galt?", Ayn Rand found the perfect artistic form to express her vision of existence. Atlas Shrugged made Rand not only one of the most popular novelists of the century, but one of its most influential thinkers.

    Probably reflects badly on me--I have never read the book...

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    bb,
    yup you're right it was the hunt brothers. altzheimers must be setting in on me.
    ba,
    no problem on the comedy routine, but like you i'm not making a living doing it. at least make sure your audience knows what you're talking about or the joke is guaranteed to be a flop. :-P
  • boB
    boB Solar Expert Posts: 1,030 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    Higher copper prices should have a positive effect on MPPT sales then !! One good thing about it I guess...
    Maybe sometime we can start using cheaper silver wire.

    Price of Cu is definately going up.

    boB
  • crewzer
    crewzer Registered Users, Solar Expert Posts: 1,832 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    I'm no economist, but here's some interesting news: Accordingly to Bloomberg, London copper prices had fallen 18% over the past 5 days, and Chinese copper has fallen 32% in the last month.

    Regards,
    Jim / crewzer
  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    that's good news jim, but you and i know copper products such as wire will stay higher even if it should fall back to the prehike price per pound of $2.44 of last april. the price they actually got it for on that article is $3.205/lb so it's got a ways to go.
  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    I install satellite systems here in Spain and a roll of satellite antenna wire copper shielded went from 31euros in January to 78euros today. Quite a hike but it seems its everywhere.

    Greetings

    Chris
  • niel
    niel Solar Expert Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    chris,
    coaxial cables are always more expensive than just plain wire. they are specially made as you may know and you are probably using the 75 ohm types with emphasis on rg6. others are rg59 and rg11 that are most common for 75 ohms.
  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    Yes, I know, still, there is a hike of over 100%, that is significant. Aluminum shielded wire went from 29euros to 40euros, still a good increase but not as bad as pure copper.

    Greetings

    Chris
  • boB
    boB Solar Expert Posts: 1,030 ✭✭✭✭
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    I just heard today that copper prices are comin down again. This would be good if it's true.

    :-D
  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    Re: Copper prices take a BIG jump!!

    So this is one reason for high copper prices! :x :x

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/business/5269104.stm

    The world's largest mining firm, BHP Billiton, will post record profits of over $10bn (£5.3bn), analysts say. Strong global demand for commodities such as copper, zinc and iron is creating new opportunities for mining firms such as BHP. The Anglo-Australian firm, which announces final results on Wednesday is expected to earn $10.2bn to $10.6bn compared to $6.2bn a year before.
    Reports in The Sunday Telegraph say shareholders will receive $3bn.
    The massive profits will come despite a strike at the Escondida mine in Chile, responsible for 8% of the world's copper, and where BHP is the majority owner.