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  • #46

    Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

    Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

    There is a plethora of great advice in this thread. Like Niel, I'd like to fill 3 pages with links and information on this subject but I know it is probably too far off topic. Someone above spoke of commodity confiscations. I do believe we will be there again if something large enough happens. It has happened in the past forcefully as in Gold and as "donations" in the war time "drives" for materials. It is well within the government's power to do so in the name of nationalism and patriotism. As Niel said, simply talking has become a broadcast event with the internet. It should suffice to reference the old sayings "Don't keep all your eggs in one basket" and "Loose lips sink ships".

    I do not believe David Sarti.. the gunless prepper...kept all of his "eggs" in one basket but his lips were certainly loose.

    Heck, in my signature below I show 2 solar panels, a CC, and an inverter that I keep in reserve. This protected to the best of my ability from an EMP event and those that would want to confiscate them from us. This even though the chances are very slim the protection will ever be required. If I didn't believe in prepping they would be in use daily....

    If I may insert three pieces of advice to all that may be gearing up for the long haul (I know this is dangerously close to being too far off topic here on this forum). First is, scour the web for info on preparedness at preparedness websites. Do this and just ignore the "mutant zombie biker" fanatics that may turn otherwise non-gun-lovers off of the main subject of prepping entirely. Second, get with a group of like minded people in your area. Preferably dear neighbors and family. There is more than just simple brute strength in numbers. Thirdly, research medications, dosages and diagnostic proceedures for ailments, first aid, and buy "fish meds".....even Cipro can be had without a script purchasing it in "fish med form" from the local pet store or online.

    I have taken these meds and they do work fine. They are the same as human meds with dosages adjusted. These can be rotated on expiration but if stored correctly will last far longer than that. The only side affect I've noticed is my skin got a little scaley but never turned into a merman....HA! Do this carefully though. This advice can be responsible for more than just a bad day if done wrong. The typical disclaimers do apply. My wife is an RN that never really left school. She aspires to become a nurse practitioner so we are lucky to have her expertise with us.

    Look into the Mormons' methods of preparedness. You may have an LDS cannery local to you like we do. Wholesale bulk foods available to the general public. Cash and carry complete with all supplies you need for packaging or canning and they let you use the canning machines for free too......
    Last edited by SteveK; February 24th, 2012, 4:47.
    6-180W CETC's., Midnite Solar Classic 200, Exeltech XP-1100E, Victron 24V-350W Inv, Energizer 24V 450aH FLA. Honda EU2000i Tri-Fuel. Victron BMV-602. Meanwell PB-1000-24. In Reserve: 2-180W CETC panels, Rogue MPT-3024, Exeltech XP-1100E

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    • #47

      Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

      Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

      This thread has drifted way far from the intent of this forum, in which most solar gear is sold to folks that are pre-paying their electric bills for many years ahead (grid tie only) in the assumption that the grid will still be around, and somebody will want to be paid for supplying it. A glance at my sig line will indicate I'm on the fence.....ahahahaaa..

      If you lean toward the 'dark side' of the fence..literally, the one with no lights.....you could go places like this:

      http://www.survivalmonkey.com/forum/...own-world.html
      20-175watt Solarworld panels, mounted on two home built single axis powered trackers, 10-245w Solarworld panels, mounted on home built dual axis tracker, 1 MX60, 1 FM60, 1 FM80, 24v bank of Absolyte 2v AGM GNP II cells 1200amp/hr, 2-GTFX2524 2500w Outbacks producing 120/240 AC, Trimetric monitor, Grid tied, produce about 600kw/hrs/mo. 12/2012: Added 10 Solarworld 255w panels and 10 Enphase mirco inverters.

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      • #48

        Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

        Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

        Originally posted by TnAndy View Post
        This thread has drifted way far from the intent of this forum, in which most solar gear is sold to folks that are pre-paying their electric bills for many years ahead (grid tie only) in the assumption that the grid will still be around, and somebody will want to be paid for supplying it. A glance at my sig line will indicate I'm on the fence.....ahahahaaa..

        If you lean toward the 'dark side' of the fence..literally, the one with no lights.....you could go places like this:

        http://www.survivalmonkey.com/forum/...own-world.html
        I resemble that remark, if the SHF we will probably want to just bug out of here as the infrastructure is all based on electric and water supply both of which will be a huge issue. The wife is pushing for a cistern now to capture rain water for irrigation uses, I am on the fence with it. Given some lead time the battery and electronics to flip to off grid could be done I suppose but would be a major undertaking to make staying a possibility. At least the house could be zoned to reduce the required setup in that eventuality.

        Really I have a hard time coming to grips with a system large enough to make this place habitable in 115F heat while being off grid.
        Sticking it to the power company one watt at a time!
        60 Ningbo Electric 175 watt panels and 12 Canadian Solar 180 watt panels with 2 PVP 5200 Inverters

        Comment


        • #49

          Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

          Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

          Originally posted by solar_dave View Post
          Really I have a hard time coming to grips with a system large enough to make this place habitable in 115F heat while being off grid.
          My question is not in any way sarcastic, or smart-assed, rather it's an honest question. If people lived in your area before AC, how did they do it, how did they survive? Did they have different ways, or did they just suffer it out?
          1900 watts PV, (1000 watts PV feeding MidNite Classic 150; 900 watts PV + 160 watts micro hydro both feeding into a single shared Morningstar TS-MPPT-60) ; Xantrex Pure Sine 1800/12 for heavy loads; Xantrex Pure Sine 1000/12 on 24/7 for everything else; six Rolls Surrette 2 volt L16 @ 12 volts.
          Domestic hot water totally provided by the sun 8 months out of every year via thermal panel.

          Comment


          • #50

            Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

            Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

            The very few that lived there before sweated a lot....and used swamp coolers. Without electric power, the "Valley of the Sun" would revert pretty quick to what it was before......a natural habit of lizards, jack rabbits, rattle snakes and a few really ornery prospectors.
            20-175watt Solarworld panels, mounted on two home built single axis powered trackers, 10-245w Solarworld panels, mounted on home built dual axis tracker, 1 MX60, 1 FM60, 1 FM80, 24v bank of Absolyte 2v AGM GNP II cells 1200amp/hr, 2-GTFX2524 2500w Outbacks producing 120/240 AC, Trimetric monitor, Grid tied, produce about 600kw/hrs/mo. 12/2012: Added 10 Solarworld 255w panels and 10 Enphase mirco inverters.

            Comment


            • #51

              Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

              Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

              Originally posted by TnAndy View Post
              The very few that lived there before sweated a lot....and used swamp coolers. Without electric power, the "Valley of the Sun" would revert pretty quick to what it was before......a natural habit of lizards, jack rabbits, rattle snakes and a few really ornery prospectors.
              Nail hit firmly on the head!

              here is the state population stats.
              1900 = 122,931
              1950 = 749,587
              1990 = 3,665,228
              2000 = 5,130,632
              2010 = 6,329,017
              Percent change 1990 - 2000 40%
              http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004986.html
              Last edited by solar_dave; February 24th, 2012, 10:20. Reason: added stats
              Sticking it to the power company one watt at a time!
              60 Ningbo Electric 175 watt panels and 12 Canadian Solar 180 watt panels with 2 PVP 5200 Inverters

              Comment


              • #52

                Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                Ah - - so now I know!
                Thanks for educating me
                1900 watts PV, (1000 watts PV feeding MidNite Classic 150; 900 watts PV + 160 watts micro hydro both feeding into a single shared Morningstar TS-MPPT-60) ; Xantrex Pure Sine 1800/12 for heavy loads; Xantrex Pure Sine 1000/12 on 24/7 for everything else; six Rolls Surrette 2 volt L16 @ 12 volts.
                Domestic hot water totally provided by the sun 8 months out of every year via thermal panel.

                Comment


                • #53

                  Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                  Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                  Remember that addressing issues/modernization/safety around your home can reduce the chances of harm/emergency evacuation/limit losses...

                  For example, in California much has been learned about the effects of earthquakes. Older homes were not bolted to their foundations, cripple walls/soft stories that need shear walls (strip 1/4 of wall and attach plywood with lots of fasteners), mounting water heaters, valves that close when a quake hits or gas lines are pulled apart, etc...

                  Trimming back flammable vegetation in fire areas.

                  Cleaning drains, sumps, checking pumps to prevent flooding. Have some way of storing water for a week or so (even temporary storage).

                  Updating home to wind/hurricane codes for roof attachment. Digging storm shelter for tornado areas.

                  Backup power/fuel for a week or two of shelter in place. etc....

                  Many major natural disasters (earthquakes, tornadoes, fires) tend to be mottled or a set of localized destruction with large swaths of relatively undamaged properties (although, you may lose power, natural gas, water for awhile).

                  At least, if the disaster brushes by your home--You will not be part of the flood of folks that were directly hit or had (potentially) avoidable catastrophic damage. And can survive fairly comfortably until basic services are restored.

                  -Bill
                  20x BP 4175B panels (replacement) + Xantrex GT 3.3 inverter for 3kW Grid Tied system + Honda eu2000i Inverter/Generator for emergency backup.

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                  • #54

                    Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                    Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                    If any are ever in the Greenbrier WV. area one may take a tour of the "Mother" of survival bunkers. Google Greenbrier Bunker for different virtual tours and information. Much to be learned from this bunker of what will be required in the event of a natural or man-made apocalypse.

                    Comment


                    • #55

                      Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                      Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                      This thread has wandered far away from the purpose of the forum.

                      It is impossible to prepare for every potential disaster of indefinite duration. Let's just say you need to consider what sort of emergency is likely to happen in your area (flood, earthquake, snow storm) and leave it at that.

                      (Hint: my hand is on the key to the lock.)
                      1220 Watts of PV, OB MX60, 232 Amp hrs, OB 3524, Honda eu2000.

                      Ohm's Law: Amps = Volts / Ohms
                      Power Formula: Watts = Volts * Amps

                      Comment


                      • #56

                        Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                        Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                        cariboocoot,
                        i am going to ask you not to lock the thread at this time even though it is encompassing more than just the issue of the lights going out for it has morphed into the possible reasons that the lights could go out and how those same things cause other hardships. it is by a thread (pun intended), but i think at this point still ok. i suppose to really open it up it could go into the opinion area or a new thread in that same area. the op, bjb, has some control here with the direction it should go too, but just may need to be relocated.
                        NIEL

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                        • #57

                          Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                          Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                          Yes, Niel; that's exactly what I'm hinting at.
                          If we all just stay away from drifting into the politics and blame-placing for why the lights might go out we'll be okay.

                          Personally I feel the natural disaster aspect is far more likely than anything more sinister. We know those things happen.

                          But you have to get the data right there too: around Vancouver, earthquake preparedness is a popular way to spend money (especially by gov't) even though there has never been a major quake here, unlike Los Angeles say. Meanwhile the inevitable seasonal flooding occurs (large area near sea-level) with seemingly little concern for planning about it. Flooding isn't as "glamourous" and dramatic as earthquake, even though it's absolutely certain to occur to one degree or another every year.

                          Go figure.
                          1220 Watts of PV, OB MX60, 232 Amp hrs, OB 3524, Honda eu2000.

                          Ohm's Law: Amps = Volts / Ohms
                          Power Formula: Watts = Volts * Amps

                          Comment


                          • #58

                            Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                            Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                            Originally posted by Cariboocoot View Post
                            This thread has wandered far away from the purpose of the forum.

                            It is impossible to prepare for every potential disaster of indefinite duration. Let's just say you need to consider what sort of emergency is likely to happen in your area (flood, earthquake, snow storm) and leave it at that.

                            (Hint: my hand is on the key to the lock.)
                            Okay, let me see how I can pull this back into the middle lane of traffic, and get it back on the road... SAWMILL'S comment referred to "Seeing" an ideal model of a prepared shelter. So, maybe, your thoughts and refinements could "Show" what a basic power system looks like. It gets us to review at our own situation and help others to physically and mentally prepare to help themselves...."For When The Lights Go Out..."

                            I know the first step in sizing a personal size of solar power is to know your electrical loads. But, a question that might help those who are "Prepping on a Shoestring" is this:

                            What basic power appliances/lighting do you see a family of two or four need to get through a day of living with shortages around/in a community/county/state disaster? Then, what solar equipment and support items would you collect/buy to run this system?

                            Most people won't change until they have to. I like the saying I heard about 20 years ago: "People change, not because they see the Light, but because the Feel the Heat." So after an economic or weather related storm hits/continues/passes, and you realize that your routine life isn't there for the foreseeable future, so how and where would you go about sourcing/setting up that basic system?

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                            • #59

                              Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                              Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                              i suppose the very first thing anybody would want is lights. the question is just how much are they willing to sacrifice in the way of lighting? you could go with small led or cfl lights (dc or ac) and have just a few on at night for a few hours or if you are like my other half you could light up the neighborhood. big difference between the 2 and that was just in lighting. the batteries and pvs would depend on the loads as usual, but if they deem a refrigerator to run this changes everything and the stakes are even higher now.
                              NIEL

                              Comment


                              • #60

                                Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                                Re: "When the Lights Go Out"...

                                I think I would want to maintain the fridge and freezer initially, my better half is candle crazy so minimal lighting is always available. I think the Volts will hold them for a while. Given most local sorts of disaster are fairly short lived I thing I would be good there.
                                Sticking it to the power company one watt at a time!
                                60 Ningbo Electric 175 watt panels and 12 Canadian Solar 180 watt panels with 2 PVP 5200 Inverters

                                Comment

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