XW 6048 AC Over Current (F63) When Generator Runs

mcnutt13579mcnutt13579 Posts: 15Registered Users ✭✭
A system owned by a person who has little knowledge of how to work it. Very clean and tight installation. Has started throwing F63 error repeatedly (until it shuts down) whenever the generator runs automatically to charge the batteries. We are helping but it is a long drive. Nothing observed on site visit, not really possible to overload this inverter anyway. Maybe 3500 watts max load but none of that is happening at night when the problem occurs. Ran generator and batteries charged fine, not much else happened. I am thinking reset inverter, reload firmware at this point.

Comments

  • mike95490mike95490 Posts: 7,564Solar Expert ✭✭✭✭
    Do you have a combox to load firmware with ?  You know there is a script to read and store the settings, and then restore them to the freshly booted system, without having to re-enter them manually ?
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

  • mcgivormcgivor Posts: 1,549Registered Users ✭✭✭✭
    Check for load ballance between both live terminals and neutral of the split, particularly if there is an inductive load such as a 120V pump (motor) along with other loads on one side of the split. Disconnecting one load at a time may pinpoint the problematic one. Since the F63 fault is an escalating fault which must occur 3 times within 5 minutes before shutting down, there could be something set up to run only when the generator runs, a well pump for example. Rationale behind these thoughts is 6000W a split phase inverter is actually two 3000W inverters in parallel if one side is running near limitations it takes the other side down with it in an overload condition, of course I'm making the assumption it's a split phase unit. 
      1500W, 6× Schutten 250W Poly panels , Schneider 150 60 CC, Schneider SW 2524 inverter, 8×T105 GC 24V nominal 

  • mcnutt13579mcnutt13579 Posts: 15Registered Users ✭✭
    Negative on the combox.  Can you give me a quick idea how it works.

    As for load balance.  The unit ran fine for years until lately.  (Installed ~2008).  F63 to me indicates total overload.  One leg or the other would be F64 or F65 I believe.

    I have been trying to get the owner to disconnect loads but it's difficult to explain to them.

    According to the manual pg. A-2 it should be capable of 37.5 A on one side but I agree it seems like it is really just 2 inverters in a box so I don't know what to think.

    Schneider is not popular in this area at all.  I know of one other and they hated it.  It broke completely a couple years ago and they just run a diesel generator, $$$$.
  • Dave AngeliniDave Angelini Posts: 3,569Solar Expert ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 11 #5
    Just because it ran well when you were there does not mean that the generator is not causing problems. They almost always are the problem!

    People who do not understand or have little knowledge of the system are just disasters waiting to happen without competent service folks...
    These situations are made easier by having the best logging gear in the system, like the combox.

    As Mike said, you should have the combox as it will log the problems and allow you to remotely view them real time if there is an internet connection at both ends.

    As Mcgivor asked, is the user turning on something that causes a HUGE imbalance on L1 or L2.

    You should be able to get some of the data from the SCP on each device as this is an escalating fault. That means it has to happen several times before the inverter reacts.

    Running generators can cause glitches in the system!!!! Especially marginal generators or ones that have developed issues. Lower AC2 settings as what worked before will not now as the generator is degrading.

    Escalating Auto Fault. Must occur 3 times in 5 minutes before becoming a manual fault. Excessive load on the AC output. Check for loads above the inverter’s capacity. Turn off some loads if necessary

    You need to check the AC2 settings in the XW and see if they are appropriate for the generator size. These setting set the capacity and bad batteries can play in here also.

    The service guys should have access to a spare 6KW generator for test. Even a 6kw can easily be overloaded by an XW if AC2 setting are wrong. If you are the service guys, you can call Schneider today.

    I doubt it is firmware if the other functions work well. The settings could have been corrupted though by generator glitches. None of my many clients who do not run generators ever have problems with XW's. A couple still running from 2006 out in the deserts.

    Good Luck!



    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Mountains near Mariposa/Yosemite CA
     http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
    E-mail [email protected]

  • BB.BB. Posts: 27,229Super Moderators admin
    edited January 11 #6
    Sometimes other weird things can happen... A little water/corrosion or even age loosening wire nuts and circuit breaker/outlet connections.

    A "broken" or weak neutral connection (i.e., turn on microwave and house lights brighten. Not saying it is this problem--But pulling box covers and checking connections, look for signs of over heated connections (damaged insulation, wire turning colors, signs of water/corrosion, tighten/check all wire nuts/binding screws).

    Gensets are known for "shaking off" wire connections... If there is enough movement/loose cables, can even work harden the wiring and cause it to fail strand by strand.

    Not saying that this is causing these issues--But can be worth a check.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • Dave AngeliniDave Angelini Posts: 3,569Solar Expert ✭✭✭✭
    Where is he Bill?  Yea, weird things happen all the time with generators. If I wanted to work harder I would sell them ;)
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Mountains near Mariposa/Yosemite CA
     http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
    E-mail [email protected]

  • mike95490mike95490 Posts: 7,564Solar Expert ✭✭✭✭
    The combox does Logging, Control, Backup & Restore and can load firmware
    https://solar.schneider-electric.com/product/conext-combox/

    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

  • BB.BB. Posts: 27,229Super Moderators admin
    Somewhere in central California (Santa Clara to Placerville area) I think.

    Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
  • Dave AngeliniDave Angelini Posts: 3,569Solar Expert ✭✭✭✭
    Great Central Cal... Definitely need a diesel here with so little sunshine.
    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Mountains near Mariposa/Yosemite CA
     http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
    E-mail [email protected]

  • mike95490mike95490 Posts: 7,564Solar Expert ✭✭✭✭
    All clouded up here too, been going through 1/2 gal diesel a day here, and limiting loads. Going to have to fill tanks and do laundry soon.
    Powerfab top of pole PV mount | Listeroid 6/1 w/st5 gen head | XW6048 inverter/chgr | Iota 48V/15A charger | Morningstar 60A MPPT | 48V, 800A NiFe Battery (in series)| 15, Evergreen 205w "12V" PV array on pole | Midnight ePanel | Grundfos 10 SO5-9 with 3 wire Franklin Electric motor (1/2hp 240V 1ph ) on a timer for 3 hr noontime run - Runs off PV ||
    || Midnight Classic 200 | 10, Evergreen 200w in a 160VOC array ||
    || VEC1093 12V Charger | Maha C401 aa/aaa Charger | SureSine | Sunsaver MPPT 15A

    solar: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Solar
    gen: http://tinyurl.com/LMR-Lister ,

  • Dave AngeliniDave Angelini Posts: 3,569Solar Expert ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 12 #12
    Nice in the Sierra since Sunday.

    "we go where power lines don't" Sierra Mountains near Mariposa/Yosemite CA
     http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
    E-mail [email protected]

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