SunRun - What's the deal here??

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quid_non
quid_non Solar Expert Posts: 48 ✭
in Solar Skeptics, Hype, & Scams Corner #1
Anybody heard of this company:

http://www.sunrunhome.com/

They kinda' remind me of the CitizenRE plan. I've been through thier site, but still do not understand thier business model. The company installs the panels, you pay for the electricity you generate. I'm assuming this is a grid tied, net metering kinda deal, but still trying to figure out the economics.....:blush:

Thanks for any insight!
Best
Wayne
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,447 admin
    #2
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    Here is one extensive thread...

    I may still have a pdf copy of the contract (personal details blacked out) that was discussed there...

    As always, get the latest contract and review carefully before signing anything.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • quid_non
    quid_non Solar Expert Posts: 48 ✭
    #3
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    Thanks!
    Did a thread search, but did not find it!
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  • BB.
    BB. Super Moderators, Administrators Posts: 33,447 admin
    #4
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    Secret search hint for Google. Type

    the words to search site:wind-sun.com

    The "site:web-address.com" will limit the results to just the one website.

    -Bill
    Near San Francisco California: 3.5kWatt Grid Tied Solar power system+small backup genset
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  • Braden
    Braden Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭
    #5
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    well I know the PPA (Power Purchase Agreement) model works at the commercial scale (SunEdison being one example of a company that has been doing this for years. And I work for a startup that also specializes in PPAs). Basically with economies of scale; state, local, and utility rebates combined with the federal tax incentive pay for a large part of the system. That combined with selling power back to the customer and selling the SRECs created on the open market can lead to a profitable business model. Of course, because of the economics of this, it generally only works in certain states.

    I have heard of SunRun, but have 0 experience with them (they are a California company, we do business primarily in the Mid-Atlantic). I also have never run the numbers to see how PPAs work on the residential level.

    EDIT: The signer of the PPA agrees to purchase electricity prices at a set rate (usually beginning at or below the price they currently play and increasing at a much lower rate than historical 'centralized power' increases) for a set number of years, usually 15-25.
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  • newenergy
    newenergy Solar Expert Posts: 291 ✭✭✭✭✭✭
    #6
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    SunRun does the lease. They don't install. I think their business model is to charge enough off the lease to make a profit, though their real business model could easily be to grow big real fast, go public, make millions for the top execs, and then worry about profits.
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  • russ
    russ Solar Expert Posts: 593 ✭✭
    #7
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    What happens if you have a system on the roof and a couple of years later the company goes belly up?
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  • Solar Guppy
    Solar Guppy Solar Expert Posts: 1,989 ✭✭✭
    #8
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    Technically, the one with the equity interest becomes the new owner, the lease would be discharged probably as part of the foreclosure / bankruptcy and you would have a new owner that could either demand you meet new terms or they take the system off the home ( repo the system :roll: )

    There are all sorts of issue's people are not considering in the lease arraignment, but it will be a few year till these horror story's start to pop up as you need to see a few of these company's fail ( very likely ) before all this type of stuff comes into play
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  • russ
    russ Solar Expert Posts: 593 ✭✭
    #9
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    İ think that anyone who signs one of the lease arrangements today is nuts.

    The terms and conditions need to be controlled by the state or it will be a grab bag of what ever someone can think of to screw the customer with.

    Sounds very much like an area the siding sales companies would love. Get in, dump the contract and they are free with your and the bank's bucks in their pocket.
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  • solar_dave
    solar_dave Solar Expert Posts: 2,397 ✭✭✭✭
    #10
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    The leases I have seen make very little economic sense either. the shorter term ones have a huge residual. The longer term ones burn out the life of the panels.

    I got my solar installed for about an overall out of pocket expense of about $1.50 a watt.
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  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    #11
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??
    BB. wrote: »
    Here is one extensive thread...

    I may still have a pdf copy of the contract (personal details blacked out) that was discussed there...

    As always, get the latest contract and review carefully before signing anything.

    -Bill

    Hello Bill! Do you have a PDF copy of SunRun's PPA agreement?
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  • System2
    System2 Posts: 6,290 admin
    #12
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    Hi everyone,

    My name is Nami and I work at SunRun. I was browsing the web when I happened upon this forum thread and I thought I'd try to answer some questions.

    SunRun's goal is to bring affordable solar to homeowners who would otherwise not be able to afford it. Solar systems usually have a high upfront cost - anywhere from 15K to 30+K. Some homeowners can front that. Most cannot. There are* state and federal rebates and incentives out there, but they are often not enough to make solar financially viable for those who can't cover the out of pocket expense. SunRun buys and owns your system - as a business, we get better incentives than homeowners so the company purchases AND gives you the full value of your rebates and credits through the lower cost for electricity. It's true what you are saying - that SunRun does make a profit, but the homeowner does save, as well. As many of our customers have said repeatedly, it's a "win-win" situation.

    For many homeowners, leasing or PPAs is a good option b/c a) as little as no upfront cost, b) lock in low electricity rates v. rising utility rates, and c) no maintenance, repair, inverter replacement, monitoring costs or hassles. SunRun takes care of everything so you don't have to worry.

    @russ SunRun is a well-backed company, financially - by $190 million in tax equity by U.S. Bank and millions more from VC firms, like Accel and Foundation Capital. your contract is protected, in any case, regardless of the company situation.

    If you're interested in learning more about SunRun, you can:

    1. check out the website: www.sunrunhome.com
    2. call us at 1-877-SUN-MOJO
    3. we can even put you in touch with customers (we have thousands of customers across the U.S. in AZ, CA, CO, MA, and NJ) if you want to talk to homeowners who've gone solar with SunRun.

    hope this helps!
    nami
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  • russ
    russ Solar Expert Posts: 593 ✭✭
    #13
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    we get better incentives than homeowners

    Believe you made an error here - maybe you mean discounts from suppliers.

    Why not post one of your blank contracts for us too see? Would be interesting and informative.
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  • Row1
    Row1 Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭
    #14
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    Re: SunRun - What's the deal here??

    (? analogy: you lease a more fuel-efficient care to save long-term cost of your gas-guzzler?)
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