Will Honda 2000 portable generator supply sufficient AC power to Magnum 3012 hybrid's charger?

Hello. Looking to power my fifth wheel travel trailer for off grid boondocking using combo seeking a maximum reliance on solar and a minimum on generator. My goal is to carry, due to size and weight, the smallest generator necessary to bring an 800 amp hour AGM battery bank up to 100%. 

Magnum 3012 has a 125A charger and the max charge rate is set to 80%.

Magnum's manual says 18AAC input current is needed to operate at it's continuous rated output.

Honda 2000's max of 2.0kVA (16.67A) and continuous of 1.6kVA (13.3A) seems insufficient.

I don't understand if only 13.3A from the Honda will NEVER allow the Magnum to charge the batts to 100% OR whether the lower input to the Magnum will just take longer. (????)

If it just takes longer, I wonder how much longer. For example, if I'm down 150AH on the bank and have 3 rainy days with no meaningful contribution from solar, and crank up the Honda 2000, how effective/ practical will this be?

I hope this makes sense. Thanks
 

Comments

  • EstragonEstragon Registered Users Posts: 1,433 ✭✭✭✭
    The 13a limit on the honda sounds about right. Also, unless the Magnum has a slow ramp up on the charger, take the honda out of eco mode before charging. I sometimes use mine to charge a ~350ah 48v bank. I need to limit current on the charger, which slows things down some, but it works.

    Taking 18aac input to put 125adc into the batteries implies a not great power factor, which isn't unusual for ac battery chargers. Assuming the power factor is fairly constant, 13aac out from the honda might put 90-100adc into the bank. Your AGM bank may be able to take twice that or more, but that isn't a bad charge rate.

    Using your example of being down 150ah on the bank, you would be into absorb in an hour or so, at which point you could put the honda in eco mode as current will taper down anyway. Another 2-3 hours in absorb would get you nearly full. Using a generator to charge though, I would just charge to ~90% or so, and only fully charge if it had been a week or so since a full charge.

    Assuming you ran the bank down to 50%, charging the 400ah deficit would take ~3ish hours to get to absorb, and another 2-3 to full. Again, I would stop after maybe an hour of absorb using the generator and let whatever solar there is do what it can.
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
  • John_SJohn_S Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭✭
    Estragon said:
    The 13a limit on the honda sounds about right. Also, unless the Magnum has a slow ramp up on the charger, take the honda out of eco mode before charging. I sometimes use mine to charge a ~350ah 48v bank. I need to limit current on the charger, which slows things down some, but it works.

    Taking 18aac input to put 125adc into the batteries implies a not great power factor, which isn't unusual for ac battery chargers. Assuming the power factor is fairly constant, 13aac out from the honda might put 90-100adc into the bank. Your AGM bank may be able to take twice that or more, but that isn't a bad charge rate.

    Using your example of being down 150ah on the bank, you would be into absorb in an hour or so, at which point you could put the honda in eco mode as current will taper down anyway. Another 2-3 hours in absorb would get you nearly full. Using a generator to charge though, I would just charge to ~90% or so, and only fully charge if it had been a week or so since a full charge.

    Assuming you ran the bank down to 50%, charging the 400ah deficit would take ~3ish hours to get to absorb, and another 2-3 to full. Again, I would stop after maybe an hour of absorb using the generator and let whatever solar there is do what it can.

    Thanks. The Magnum's "shore power" setting are in 5 increments, so I may select 10 or 15, so I choose 15 and the Honda's breaker's don't trip in bulk. I wish I could set it to like 12. Anyhow, my AGM takes c/5 or 166amps. The magnum was set at 80% max charge rate, but I just decided to put that down to 70% to attempt to better accommodate the Honda as a power source, so .7 x 125 or 88amp max. When at 80% charge rate, I'd get 90-100amp from the Honda, as you estimated.

    That's good advice to let the sun finish the job after 90%. I've got 960 watts on my RV's roof. The Honda runs forever for that last 3% - seems crazy.

    Great advice on eco. I will do that.
  • John_SJohn_S Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭✭
    Thanks. Your estimates are right on. I had my magnum msh 3012 max charge rate on 80%, but am going to try 70% to see if the Honda runs a little more smoothly. The magnum also has a "shore power" setting in 5 increments, so I may select 10amps or 15, and it's on 15amps, and the Honda doesn't trip up. I'm hoping shore on 15 and max rate on the charger of 70% works well; well's see.

    Good advice on using eco and letting the last 10% fill from solar. I have 960 watts of panels, so this should be ok if I've got sun.
  • EstragonEstragon Registered Users Posts: 1,433 ✭✭✭✭
    With that much pv on the roof, it would have to be pretty gloomy to get nothing. Should work well to bulk with the honda and absorb with solar most cloudy days.
    Off-grid.  
    Main daytime system ~4kw panels into 2xMNClassic150 370ah 48v bank 2xOutback 3548 inverter 120v + 240v autotransformer
    Night system ~1kw panels into 1xMNClassic150 700ah 12v bank morningstar 300w inverter
  • John_SJohn_S Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭✭
    Estragon said:
    With that much pv on the roof, it would have to be pretty gloomy to get nothing. Should work well to bulk with the honda and absorb with solar most cloudy days.

    I hope so. The first time I started using my system July 10, 2017, I was in Alaska, then British Columbia and now coastal northern Oregon. I believe my first couple month's experience has been with lower quality sun. I live in Florida, will winter in Arizona, and hang out in the lower 48, so I think my solar will perform better. 
  • westbranchwestbranch Solar Expert Posts: 4,827 ✭✭✭✭
    A suggestion, as you are setting the charger to lower max settings...first try ans see if the gen can start the charge cycle with ECO on, if not take it off .....and after the charger has run for 15 minutes or so try ECO again....  the chargers sometimes will 'test' the battery to see how much charge rate is needed and then ramp back on the load called for from the charger ...
     I had a 40a 12V charger that needed to have a 3000W generator to start  (10 min.) and then would run off  a  Eu1000i till the end of charge.
     My newer charger 30A 24V  repeatedly checks through the charge cycle and so needs
     
    KID #51B  4s 140W to 24V 900Ah C&D AGM
    CL#29032 FW 2126/ 2073/ 2133 175A E-Panel WBjr, 3 x 4s 140W to 24V 900Ah C&D AGM 
    Cotek ST1500W 24V Inverter,OmniCharge 3024,
    2 x Cisco WRT54GL i/c DD-WRT Rtr & Bridge, Hughes1100 Sat Modem
    Eu3/2/1000i Gens, 1680W & E-Panel/WBjr to come, CL #647 asleep
    West Chilcotin, BC, Canada
  • John_SJohn_S Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭✭
    edited September 13 #8
    A suggestion, as you are setting the charger to lower max settings...first try ans see if the gen can start the charge cycle with ECO on, if not take it off .....and after the charger has run for 15 minutes or so try ECO again....  the chargers sometimes will 'test' the battery to see how much charge rate is needed and then ramp back on the load called for from the charger ...
     I had a 40a 12V charger that needed to have a 3000W generator to start  (10 min.) and then would run off  a  Eu1000i till the end of charge.
     My newer charger 30A 24V  repeatedly checks through the charge cycle and so needs

    Thanks. The only time the Honda 2000's breaker tripped was when I forgot to set the shore power down to 15 from 30. I've been using eco when charging the batt bank. Set on 80% charge rate and in eco mode, the Honda bogged down initially when the charger hit bulk, but didn't trip or throw a red light. In absorption, it just purrs along. I'll check today on 70% charge rate, to see how hard the Honda bogs when it hits bulk on the magnum.
  • Marc KurthMarc Kurth Solar Expert Posts: 409 ✭✭✭✭
    You have great setup for minimizing generator run time!

    With an inverter based charger, the Honda will supply clean power at full voltage right up until it trips out on overload.
    For what it's worth, my Honda eu2000i easily supports my Xantrex Truecharge II, 60 amp charger, even starting a charge cycle from Eco mode.

    Which AGM's do you have? Some need to spend more time on float than others, in order to achieve a maximum service life.

    Marc
    I always have more questions than answers. That's the nature of life.
  • John_SJohn_S Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭✭
    edited September 13 #10
    You have great setup for minimizing generator run time!

    With an inverter based charger, the Honda will supply clean power at full voltage right up until it trips out on overload.
    For what it's worth, my Honda eu2000i easily supports my Xantrex Truecharge II, 60 amp charger, even starting a charge cycle from Eco mode.

    Which AGM's do you have? Some need to spend more time on float than others, in order to achieve a maximum service life.

    Marc

    Thanks Marc. I have 4 fullriver AGM DC-400-6s connected for 800AH. In April/May of 2016, Lifeline batteries were entirely unavailable in the Florida area, because the factory could not satisfy demand. I was shocked and disappointed. I'd built the space for the bank into a very tight area, so I selected the fullrivers due to their form factor and AH sizing. If I built the bank today, I'd buy the lifelines I originally specified. For my budget and relatively short period in which I'd use the batteries (2-3 years), lithium was not seriously considered.
  • Marc KurthMarc Kurth Solar Expert Posts: 409 ✭✭✭✭
    No reason to fret - those Fullriver's will serve you well for many years. I have dealt with hundreds of their L16's in both 2v and 6v and they perform very, very well under tough conditions. The large cost savings per battery makes good sense for some applications.

    Do try to let them sit on float at 13.6v to 13.7v for a few hours when you can. It really helps equalize them to each other.

    Marc
    I always have more questions than answers. That's the nature of life.
  • John_SJohn_S Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭✭
    No reason to fret - those Fullriver's will serve you well for many years. I have dealt with hundreds of their L16's in both 2v and 6v and they perform very, very well under tough conditions. The large cost savings per battery makes good sense for some applications.

    Do try to let them sit on float at 13.6v to 13.7v for a few hours when you can. It really helps equalize them to each other.

    Marc

    Thanks. Will do on the float advice.
Sign In or Register to comment.